Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Handguns New way to hold semi-auto handguns?

Everyone knows that it's thumbs straight on a semi and crossed on a revolver

Gents, a point to ponder

Accurate handgun shooting is relatively easy when you can see the sights. Night shooting is a whole nuther animal. I'll get to my point in a minute.

I've made some discoveries over the years and these discoveries came from experimentation, not reading internet bulletin boards. Now, about the time that photo of Ross was taken, he'd beaten the world in the IPSC game with a 1911 similar to the one you see, a pretty capable and useful tool. This photo shows a compensated barrel, but if I recall, when he beat the world, he was shooting an uncompensated weapon, against a passel of shootists who had discovered the game-gun craze with slide-sized compensators and weights and other gizmos that helped to reduce recoil. I had a well-known custom smigh build me one just like it. I still have it.

Ross was a strapping lad with big hands and perfect form, and his gun just didn't seem to recoil much. He beat the world, but the world didn't seem to take much notice. It was "game-on," and the gamesmen ruled from that time on.

Getting back to the finger forward grip.

This may not work for everyone. In fact, I do it sometimes and at other times, I don't. I've discovered, at least for me, that another point of reference on the gun's frame helps me to determine the precise attitude of the weapon's slide as far as elevation and windage, when I can't see the sights, I.E. in the darker environments with shorter slides.

We aren't always carrying 5" 1911s. Many of us carry little bitty guns with abbreviated slides and correspondingly itty bitty barrels. We don't have that gun with the physical properties that tell us by weight and balance, exactly where that barrel is pointing while walking down the dark hall at 2a.m..

With the finger forward, you have another point of triangulation. You physically know, based on three points of reference, that you are on, both in elevation and windage. I tried to explain this to an FBI pistol instructor and he kindly told me I was full of crap, just before I used this technique to beat everyone on the line in a night shoot, with a gun that didn't have night sights, against 80% of fellow shooters who had night sights on their guns.

I'm saying, try it before you knock it, and if you knock it, have the courtesy to offer a "reality based" reason why, which suggests you know what you're writing about, rather than just exercising two of your fingers on the keyboard.

Yes, the fastest shooters in the world today, don't use it. But then, they have guns that don't resemble actual firearms, shooting loads that are more akin to mild 9mms, vs something that actually recoils, not that it offers any advantage in the recoil control department.

Blue makes some excellent points.
My opinion falls somewhere in between " If it ain't broke, don't fix it" and "give a different technique a fair shot to see if you can improve."

Personally I do not put my finger on the front of the TG. That being said, a close friend who is an A class shooter, and would likely be a master if he was in the states and had more time to shoot, shoots with his finger on the front of the TG. He is also left handed and right eye dominant. He has managed to become one heck of a good shooter in spite of this.

On a personal level, I consider myself a life long learner. If someone I know who is at the top of the game makes a suggestion to me, I usually give it due consideration and try it for a bit. If it works, fine, if not, I revert back to what I know.

When we start thinking we know all about any subject, we become stagnant.

As an example, in my work, I deal a lot with medical reports and speak to a lot of doctors. I keep a PDR (Physicians Desk Reference) on my desk, and have a couple of links on my work computer's desktop that link me to med definitions. When I come across a word I do not recognize, or a drug I am not familiar with, I look it up.

The result is that I have a better grasp of the subject and when talking to coworkers and docs, they think I am a lot smarter than I really am!

Long story shortened: Be willing to get outside your comfort zone if you want to advance your performance.

I agree with Mackay. Ross won a world championship and Weaver was no slouch either.

I have also been a long time shooter of single action revolvers and had previously used my right hand thumb to cock the hammer. Found out that if you use the opposite hand to work the hammer back you can keep your shooting hand consistent on the grip, less effort and time wasted in having to reacquire the hold.

So it does show that an old hand like myself is always learning something new.

[/quote]Everyone knows that it's thumbs straight on a semi and crossed on a revolver [/quote]

Oh no here we go,

I may be the odd duck but I shoot both my revolver and semi with thumbs crossed, mainly due to muscle memory so there is no thinking when I pick up said handgun.

For those that assume I have the intolerant old fart syndrome, I don't hold revolvers or semi-autos the same way I did perhaps ten years ago. Through tens of thousands of rounds per year, working up some speed and trying to do things efficiently, my hold and my shooting has evolved. A few years ago I started shooting automatics, mostly 1911's, with the thumbs-forward hold and it works well. You can't do that if you want to shoot a DA with serious recoil or an SA and run it fast. When I shoot a revolver, double action or single, I place my weak index finger on the front of the triggerguard and my weak thumb on the left side of the recoil shield. This offers a little more stability, stability that you can see in your sights, and places the thumb in a good position to manipulate the hammer.



The pics of Weaver and Seyfried were for those who make stupid sweeping statements out of ignorance.

Many millions of golfers have used the grip invented by Harry Vardon, before WWI. But in the late '50's a big young blond guy decided it didn't work for him, and tried the interlocking grip. His name was Nicklaus, and it worked for him

Brian Enos


Daniel Horner


Todd Jarrett


Jerry Miculek


Dave Sevigny


And Rob Leatham, the winningest shooter in the world.

Thumbs forward on an auto. Lock the weak side wrist and good things happen.



Travis

Also endorsed by Bluedreaux.

Best GD pilot in the sky.



Travis

Hickok45 on youtube does pretty well with his style.

The "Boss Hog" picture should have been put in there between Jarrett and Miculek.

I'll forgive this time.

Newsflash smart guy, the Weaver and Seyfried pics were in response to this stupid post:



So let us not take it out of context. Unless you want to claim superiority over either of those world class shooters, throttle back on your fervor.

Nobody's trying to change how you hold your pistol at your 3-gun matches. Or really cares. Like I also said, there is NO universal hold for ALL handgun shooting. Again, those guys are all shooting semi-autos (repeat, I hold mine the same way) but that is not necessarily the proper hold for revolver shooting or with heavy recoiling handguns. I'm sorry if I do not consider what competition shooters do to be the be-all, end-all of handgun shooters. Furthermore, those aren't the only handgun shooting sports either. Shall we all drop into the Creedmoor position because that's how they do it in silhouette competition? Probably not.

Maverick approves this message.

What about this

Change grips?
When I was taught, only a girl needed to use Two hands!
A man stood tall and shot with one hand!

I think this is a great explanation about thumb position

http://sheriffjimwilson.com/2011/03/15/video-sheriff-tip-the-thumbs-have-it/

I think Travis does a nice job explaining it. Since I swapped to the hard 45 degree before the hands even meet I have a better grip that does not move. I shot a heavy 9mm (5906) for a long time and could be pretty sloppy with my grip. Going to a polymer .40 made me adapt to a better way of doing it to keep the control I liked.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MY6gwhj5qpY