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I never understood why the 1911 was replace in the first place and the 45 ACP was shelved in favor of the 9mm since NATO countries were using it... the 45 worked well for its intended purpose.. it was reliable and well designed...
another 25 year social experiment by Washington that failed...
I have a 1927 built 45 ACP/1911... I wouldn't trade it for 5 Glocks of the caliber of my choice....this thing is built like a 53 Buick... lot of metal and tough....and the capability of any 45 ACP round needs no explanation unless someone doesn't know squat about a pistol round... The 9mm had its own NATO pressures. The reason the 92F was picked was because we needed medium range missiles in Italy at the time. Not a well know fact but a firm belief back then by some Admirals and Generals of that era.
Gun Shows are almost as comical as boat ramps in the Spring.
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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A pistol is an intermediate weapon who's only purpose is to allow you to fight long enough to acquire a rifle. There's a lot of truth in that statement. if one looks at all the WWII pictures of fighting airborne generals that jumped with the troops they all carry either M-1 Garands or 03 Springfields. In fact, General Ridgeway saved himself from capture because he was carry an M-1 with armor piercing ammo. He was out taking a wiz when he was attacked by a German tank trying to capture him alive. He figured what the hell and shot the tank driver through the tank. The tank went out of control and he escaped. Imagine if all he had was a 1911. Let's see, Sherman tanks armed with a 75MM CANNON couldn't punch through the armor of a German tank, so this guy did it with a 3006 and AP ammo? Calling bullshit..
A good principle to guide me through life: “This is all I have come to expect, standard lackluster performance. Trust nothing, believe no one and realize it will only get worse…”
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Joined: May 2002
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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A pistol is an intermediate weapon who's only purpose is to allow you to fight long enough to acquire a rifle. There's a lot of truth in that statement. if one looks at all the WWII pictures of fighting airborne generals that jumped with the troops they all carry either M-1 Garands or 03 Springfields. In fact, General Ridgeway saved himself from capture because he was carry an M-1 with armor piercing ammo. He was out taking a wiz when he was attacked by a German tank trying to capture him alive. He figured what the hell and shot the tank driver through the tank. The tank went out of control and he escaped. Imagine if all he had was a 1911. Let's see, Sherman tanks armed with a 75MM CANNON couldn't punch through the armor of a German tank, so this guy did it with a 3006 and AP ammo? Calling bullshit.. And is that why they recently did away with the AT4 and brought back the M1?..... 
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My guess is they'll go with an M&P in .40 S&W.
For the last 15 years, I've carried a P226 in my flight vest with two mags, and I've felt very comfortable with it. If I ever have to use it, I've had to ditch the aircraft somewhere bad, and I like the capacity of the 9mm in that situation.
Personally, I find a Glock 17 in .357 SIG to be about the best combo available (one lives in my nightstand), but you couldn't teach 75% of active duty personnel to shoot that cartridge well.
Chris
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
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Personally, I find a Glock 17 in .357 SIG to be about the best combo available (one lives in my nightstand), but you couldn't teach 75% of active duty personnel to shoot that cartridge well.
Agreed, but that would be the Glock 31, except in a REAL Caliber  I've got one that lives on my night stand with a Streamlight Lazer / Light Combo on it. The mid sized version, the Glock 32 lives in the console of my F-250.
"Allways speak the truth and you will never have to remember what you said before..." Sam Houston
Texans, "We say Grace, We Say Mam, If You Don't Like it, We Don't Give a Damn!"
~Molɔ̀ːn Labé Skýla~
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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A pistol is an intermediate weapon who's only purpose is to allow you to fight long enough to acquire a rifle. There's a lot of truth in that statement. if one looks at all the WWII pictures of fighting airborne generals that jumped with the troops they all carry either M-1 Garands or 03 Springfields. In fact, General Ridgeway saved himself from capture because he was carry an M-1 with armor piercing ammo. He was out taking a wiz when he was attacked by a German tank trying to capture him alive. He figured what the hell and shot the tank driver through the tank. The tank went out of control and he escaped. Imagine if all he had was a 1911. Let's see, Sherman tanks armed with a 75MM CANNON couldn't punch through the armor of a German tank, so this guy did it with a 3006 and AP ammo? Calling bullshit.. Well Ridgeway was a decorated general and did replace MacArthur in Korea so if he said so it's so. He also said he didn't think the 06 AP round would penetrate the tank but figured what the hell did he have to lose. It's a proven fact the high speed AP rounds will penetrate amour that slow rounds will not do. Also, IIRC, it wasn't a Tiger tank, maybe a Panther or earlier. I don't have the history of the 82nd Airborne any more to check.
Don't vote knothead, it only encourages them. Anonymous
"Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups." Anonymous
"Self-reliance, free thinking, and wealth is anathema to both the power of the State and the Church." Derby Dude
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Looking at pictures of German WWII tanks each appears to have a viewing slit for the drivers to see. Some also appeared to have a periscope in addition.
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/7.62%C3%9725mm_Tokarev
7.62x25
Only Dead Fish Go With The Flow
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
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Their a little slow on the draw on this one.
Paul
"I'd rather see a sermon than hear a sermon".... D.A.D.
Trump Won!, Sandmann Won!, Rittenhouse Won!, Suck it Liberal Fuuktards.
molɔ̀ːn labé skýla
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Personally, I find a Glock 17 in .357 SIG to be about the best combo available (one lives in my nightstand), but you couldn't teach 75% of active duty personnel to shoot that cartridge well.
Agreed, but that would be the Glock 31, except in a REAL Caliber I've got one that lives on my night stand with a Streamlight Lazer / Light Combo on it. The mid sized version, the Glock 32 lives in the console of my F-250. Right...sorry. Confused my Glocks...the 31.
Chris
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I think the Ridgeway incident happened with an armored car, not a tank, but I might be mistaken (and it might have been Gen. Gavin, who carried a 1903, at least in Sicily, as I have some photos of him in a book with a Springfield).
You can roll a turd in peanuts, dip it in chocolate, and it still ain't no damn Baby Ruth.
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All pistol cartridges are pretty poor stoppers with ball ammo. I'm not sure changing cartridges will netter much. Now changing pistols is a fine idea.
Will Munny: It's a hell of a thing, killing a man. Take away all he's got and all he's ever gonna have.
The Schofield Kid: Yeah, well, I guess they had it coming.
Will Munny: We all got it coming, kid.
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Campfire Tracker
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I know it is blasphemy but the capacity of the 1911 is its Achilles heel. High cap, low cost, "manstopper", easy to shoot and fit the gender neutral army: Glock 23 or some other companies version of it.
NRA Life Member
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Aught to be a 40 cal something if they wanna look less stupid.
Trump Won!
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Campfire Tracker
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OP
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Aught to be a 40 cal something if they wanna look less stupid. I would think with the pressure levels involved with that caliber, and the conditions we would expect a new sidearm to operate in, we might see many more failures. Just a thought. Not to mention I would expect the females in the armed forces to have more of an issue with its recoil. **not to side-track this into a discussion of females in the armed forces. **
Last edited by Mink; 07/05/14.
"If dogs don't go to heaven, when I die I want to go wherever they went." -Will Rogers
"If you have a lot of self control you don't need a lot of government control" - Thomas Sowell
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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40's will rip out pretty well, dont know about the meshing with the filly shooters though, their looking less stupid part comes from the a$$holes already having a billion rounds of that bought.
Trump Won!
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
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Got no particular horse in this discussion, but the article in the OP is drivel.
Combat handguns are facilitators, little more. They bridge the gap of extemporaneous need. Per usual, it's not the weapon as much as it is the operator.
That said, the 9mm pretty much sucks swamp water when all things are considered.
DD
I am..........disturbed.
Concerning the difference between man and the jackass: some observers hold that there isn't any. But this wrongs the jackass. -Twain
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Dad always said his sidearm was for use on himself so anything would do. <G>
Trump Won!
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Yep the Army is looking for a hardware solution to a software problem. In general the regular Army doesn't need anything special for a pistol. I'm not a Glock fan personally but from what I understand the service life is outstanding. Personally I was fine with the M9 and would of been fine with the Glock or a newer 1911.
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Campfire Tracker
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OP
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Not to get into the merits of a sidearm in general, but I see this as an opportunity for them to get it right (again). IMO we should have never deserted the 1911 platform, or at a minimum the 45 acp. Room for improvement? Sure, but no different in the current selection.
Not a big fan of striker fired plastic pistols in the environments we expect our guys to operate, or the people we expect to operate them, but that is an opinion.
A new steel 45 acp is the answer to the question. But the real question is will they be able to see that without politics or bean counting figuring in. Doubtful.
YMMV
"If dogs don't go to heaven, when I die I want to go wherever they went." -Will Rogers
"If you have a lot of self control you don't need a lot of government control" - Thomas Sowell
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