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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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I looked at the SIG in 556 they have a pistol in 308 as well, there IS NO LIMIT to insanity. Can you imagine shooting a 12 or 13 inch 308 in your bedroom?  Not sure about the SIG's they look nice but seems to me you could make something lighter, IIRC the SIG's were Piston guns. Damn this means I have to buy another aimpoint, I am going to be the most well equipped mall ninja in the poor house before long.
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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On a side note, how are giys doing the same swaps with Encores and not running afoul?
If it is first assembled as a pistol, it can be turned into a rifle, and swapped back. If it is first assembled as a rifle, it is a rifle and can not be switched into a pistol. So why wouldn't that same formula follow suit with an AR pistol?
The government plans these shootings by targeting kids from kindergarten that the government thinks they can control with drugs until the appropriate time--DerbyDude
Whatever. Tell the oompa loompa's hey for me. [/quote]. LtPPowell
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Joined: Nov 2011
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Campfire 'Bwana
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OP
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 30,985 |
On a side note, how are giys doing the same swaps with Encores and not running afoul?
If it is first assembled as a pistol, it can be turned into a rifle, and swapped back. If it is first assembled as a rifle, it is a rifle and can not be switched into a pistol. So why wouldn't that same formula follow suit with an AR pistol? Does it have something to do with the ATF's classification of pistol that includes an OAL that does not exceed 26"?
You didn't use logic or reason to get into this opinion, I cannot use logic or reason to get you out of it.
You cannot over estimate the unimportance of nearly everything. John Maxwell
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 17,101
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 17,101 |
On a side note, how are giys doing the same swaps with Encores and not running afoul?
If it is first assembled as a pistol, it can be turned into a rifle, and swapped back. If it is first assembled as a rifle, it is a rifle and can not be switched into a pistol. So why wouldn't that same formula follow suit with an AR pistol? Does it have something to do with the ATF's classification of pistol that includes an OAL that does not exceed 26"? Encore pistols are under 26 inches OAL. But they can be turned into a rifle, so why can't an AR pistol?
The government plans these shootings by targeting kids from kindergarten that the government thinks they can control with drugs until the appropriate time--DerbyDude
Whatever. Tell the oompa loompa's hey for me. [/quote]. LtPPowell
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Joined: Nov 2011
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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There's actually been some debate about his on the AR forums.
Part of the debate also centers around sig brace "pistols" with an OAL over 26" that could be considered "other" vs pistols and if that makes a forward vertical grip legal or not.
In both instances, is seems nobody wants to be the test case.
You didn't use logic or reason to get into this opinion, I cannot use logic or reason to get you out of it.
You cannot over estimate the unimportance of nearly everything. John Maxwell
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Dec 2009
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So why wouldn't that same formula follow suit with an AR pistol?
It does.
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Joined: Jun 2012
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2012
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So you can turn an AR pistol i to a rifle and back again?
The government plans these shootings by targeting kids from kindergarten that the government thinks they can control with drugs until the appropriate time--DerbyDude
Whatever. Tell the oompa loompa's hey for me. [/quote]. LtPPowell
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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On a side note, how are giys doing the same swaps with Encores and not running afoul?
If it is first assembled as a pistol, it can be turned into a rifle, and swapped back. If it is first assembled as a rifle, it is a rifle and can not be switched into a pistol. Not that I would suggest anything illegal, but who is going to know if it was once a rifle or once a pistol?
John 8:12 "I am the light of the world. Whoever follows me will never walk in darkness, but will have the light of life."
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Joined: Nov 2011
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2011
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Got the go ahead this weekend to build "My Wife's" new Sig Brace gun.
The first piece is now in inventory.
An Odin Works, 10.5" stainless, medium weight .223 Wylde chambered, button rifles, Carbine length gas, barrel.
You didn't use logic or reason to get into this opinion, I cannot use logic or reason to get you out of it.
You cannot over estimate the unimportance of nearly everything. John Maxwell
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Joined: Sep 2009
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Sep 2009
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On a side note, how are giys doing the same swaps with Encores and not running afoul?
If it is first assembled as a pistol, it can be turned into a rifle, and swapped back. If it is first assembled as a rifle, it is a rifle and can not be switched into a pistol. Not that I would suggest anything illegal, but who is going to know if it was once a rifle or once a pistol? I suspect the ATF would know. If it was entered into the manufactures bound book as a rifle then you will have a problem. As the brace is a work around I personally would pay very much attention to my Ps & Qs. They might not have much of a sense of humor. 
John Burns
I have all the sources.
They can't stop the signal.
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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I didn't know manufacturers would do that. Are the markings or serial numbers generally any different?
Last edited by CBMJR; 09/08/14.
John 8:12 "I am the light of the world. Whoever follows me will never walk in darkness, but will have the light of life."
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Joined: Nov 2011
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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I didn't know manufacturers would do that. Are the markings or serial numbers generally any different? By bound book he's referring to the form 4473.
You didn't use logic or reason to get into this opinion, I cannot use logic or reason to get you out of it.
You cannot over estimate the unimportance of nearly everything. John Maxwell
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Joined: Sep 2004
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2004
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if you buy a lower that is new and has never been built on they call it in as "undefined" vs. handgun or long gun.
so, buy a lower and build.
if you ever sell it and it goes through a dealer as one or the other, then that might be a problem, but I still can't see how ATF would know...
“Live free or die. Death is not the worst of evils.” - General
John Stark.
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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if you buy a lower that is new and has never been built on they call it in as "undefined" vs. handgun or long gun.
so, buy a lower and build.
if you ever sell it and it goes through a dealer as one or the other, then that might be a problem, but I still can't see how ATF would know... That was my train of thought also. ETA: After reading up on it, if you start with a stripped receiver, there is no way to tell if it was once a rifle or pistol. So, you may be breaking the law, but there is no way anyone would know by looking at it or tracking paperwork.
Last edited by CBMJR; 09/09/14.
John 8:12 "I am the light of the world. Whoever follows me will never walk in darkness, but will have the light of life."
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Joined: Nov 2003
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 18,312 Likes: 1 |
If you buy a brand new unbuilt stripped lower and build it as a pistol! It. Has to be marked other on the 4473.
Last edited by jimmyp; 09/09/14.
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Joined: Sep 2004
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 17,419 |
if you buy a lower that is new and has never been built on they call it in as "undefined" vs. handgun or long gun.
so, buy a lower and build.
if you ever sell it and it goes through a dealer as one or the other, then that might be a problem, but I still can't see how ATF would know... That was my train of thought also. ETA: After reading up on it, if you start with a stripped receiver, there is no way to tell if it was once a rifle or pistol. So, you may be breaking the law, but there is no way anyone would know by looking at it or tracking paperwork. The law is that a rifle cannot be made into a pistol. They have to have some proof it was a rifle and you converted it. You have no obligation to prove it was not a rifle. However, your idea of keeping a copy of the 4478 seems sound.
“Live free or die. Death is not the worst of evils.” - General
John Stark.
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Joined: Sep 2006
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Nice piece, but I think I'd rather have a bullpup rifle in 5.56 than a pistol version. MSAR MM
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Joined: Nov 2011
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Campfire 'Bwana
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OP
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2011
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Nice piece, but I think I'd rather have a bullpup rifle in 5.56 than a pistol version. MSAR MM That's another fun looking option. Personally, I decided to stay standardized on the AR platform.
You didn't use logic or reason to get into this opinion, I cannot use logic or reason to get you out of it.
You cannot over estimate the unimportance of nearly everything. John Maxwell
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Joined: Sep 2006
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 23,639 |
Yeah, I have so far, too, but the smaller piece sure makes a nice CQ or vehicle option.
MM
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