Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire Fury

Who's going to see it? We're going on Sunday, hope it's worth the money.

I'll wait for Netflix.

I thought at first it was an M-18 Hellcat but I guess not.

The Hellcat was a tank destroyer but because of it's main gun and the fact it was the fastest tracked vehicle in the world and still is many times it was pressed into tank duties.

Sure thing, Dickweed. Still waiting for you to tell us how the MLRS and Stryker are tank destroyers.

Saw it this afternoon. It was a good movie, very dark in tone, but nothing memorable like Saving Private Ryan. Lots of shooting and they're certainly graphic with the mangled bodies and body parts strewn about the countryside, but otherwise you've seen this story before in other war movies. Heck, "Sahara" did it in 1943 (but without all the tracers and body parts).

Only thing that struck me was how stupid the SS battalion was in the big final battle scene. Won't give away any spoilers but if anyone sees it you might agree there are better ways to attack an immobilized tank.

Previews looked good.

It would be pretty damned hard to top Saving Private Ryan, IMO

Fury was a horse.

I thought it was a Plymouth in the movie Christine

Mike

What sort of tank are they in?

I thought it was a Sherman tank.

M4E4 Sherman with the 76mm High Velocity cannon.

When I first saw the title, I was kinda hoping it was going to be based on Marvel Comic's Sgt Fury and the Howling Commandos.

But this still looks good either way.

Just got back. Took my son. Worth the money - easily.

Hard to describe.

If I had to, I'd only use the word "visceral" and call it that.

Thought the same thing but also remembered when this took place - chances are those SS weren't exactly the same battle hardened SS that would have been there in 42 or 43. This taking place about a month before VE.

Was in okc a few years ago and saw a Plymouth Fury somebody had put on a 4wd truck frame. A mean looking rust bucket rat rod. Looked straight out of Mad Max.

Couple of things ya gotta suspend disbelief on, like how a whole column of SS, with vehicles yet, could march ANYWHERE in daylight in the west in April of 1945.

And it may have been SET in April of '45, but it sure wasn't SHOT in April in Germany, a cursory glimpse of the greenery is enough for that, especially where the one guy is hiding in a privet hedge that looks to be already setting fruit.

Nit picks aside though, agreed this is a tremendous movie.

Worth the price of admission just to see the inside operation of a Sherman tank in combat, and ESPECIALLY worth the price of admission to see what happens when Shermans and Tiger collide. One of the more gripping combat scenes I've seen in awhile.

A nice touch too the crew having appropriated a Sturmgewehr 44 or two along the way. This is one of those movies worth buying just to see the equipment and details.

And ya realize how powerful the movie is when the closing credits roll over actual combat footage from that war.

Birdwatcher

"The story of a horse, and a boy who loved him ..."

There's a Sherman Tank in the Museum over at Camp Maybry in Austin that my nephews WWII re-inactment group uses when they stage a mock battle on Veteran's Day. Pretty cool to see it still run!

Just got back from it... was a little disappointed.. but then I am not sure what I was expecting...plenty of blood and guts...

a lot more realistic than a lot of war movies ya see...

thought it was kind of interesting... Brad Pitt is involved in directing this one...

coming out real soon is the one about the LT with the Polish last name that was an Olympic medalist.. and was shot down in a B24 over the Pacific and made a POW in Japan..."Unbroken"

That one is being directed by his wife...

both Brad and Angelina becoming war buffs and conservatives?

Louis Zamperini was of Italian descent.

Looking forward to seeing both movies. "Unbroken" was a heck of a read.

What was the twist rate???


!

Yeah, I know that, don't know why I said he was Polish....
Mental Flatus I guess...

Is over penetration a concern with the high velocity rounds in a 76mm? I think I'd rather have all the energy expended inside the panther.

If they duct tape the end of the muzzle to keep rain out, it will blow up when they fire. Just sayin'.

That gun really didn't do very well against Panthers. Many many more Pzkw Mk IV's around to deal with.

This especially. Even though you know - given where you are in the movie how that scene has to end up - I found myself holding my breath.

Was a lot of fun having my son elbow me and go - he has a Sturmgewehr 44 - cool!

Ya, and a pretty awesome demonstration too earlier in the movie on just how well massed infantry can contrive to stay in the shadow of a supporting tank when advancing under fire across an open field.

Went to see it with my BIL, and before seeing the movie he was unaware how shaped charges in shells and panzerfausts worked against armor plate.

Birdwatcher

Come to think of it, this might THE only movie focusing on armor in combat. Someone correct me if I'm wrong. Strangely enough, we might actually owe a debt of some gratitude to Brad Pitt, who reportedly made this movie happen.

I can't think of another movie that focused on what it's like to be armor in combat. I'm sure there must have been some out there in the haydays of WWII flicks. Many movies HAVE armor in combat but none do what Fury did and put you in the tank - that I can think of.

I'm intrigued. Now I wanna see it.



Travis

It's worth the money.

Was also very impressed with how they showed the ricochets and the reality of marksmanship.

Funny! Found a pile of Stg44 parts in a box in back of shop other day. No receiver tho!

Interesting too how some of the commerical reviewers out there belittle the movie for its depiction of the SS in the last days of the war hanging German civilians and whatnot, claiming gross exaggeration. Heck, there were Polezei and SS fanatics doing EXACTLY that, to German soldiers and civilians alike.

OTOH, it was very fortunate for the fictional tank crew of "Fury" that the very last Jerries they run into in the movie were apparently from a little-known SS "Retard" division

A pity, since the earlier combats were so well done.

I'm sorta reminded of the mess they made of the movie "Lone Survivor".

IMHO both "Blackhawk Down" and "Saving Private Ryan" have set the standard for realistic depiction of combat thus far, or so says I who has never actually SEEN combat....

I will say though that the unexpected act of mercy at the end of Fury was a nice touch

Birdwatcher

That was really my only complaint about the whole movie.

I could nit pick the Germans' choice of defensive positions in the AT gun ambush where the tanks attack across the open field but that would be a small nit.

But the final battle was for plot only. A single stalled tank, buttoned up, no infantry support, both cover and concealment in close proximity and apparently nightfall was about 5 minutes away - that's as blind as a tank can be.

I would have detailed two squads to destroy it, maybe only one. Either wait for full darkness or just lob a few mortar rounds of smoke around the tank to hide your movement, flank it, put a couple of panzerfausts in the side then continue to march. The way they attacked it was...well, I hate spoilers so I won't say.

But overall the depiction of the men was good - their complete immersion in cold hearted, mechanical killing.

It's definitely worth the price of admission, I'm thinking of going back on "cheap Tuesday" night to see it again.

I was telling the wife on the way home.... that was the attitudes that this nation needs, to effectively deal with these ISIS clowns and Islamic Radicals in modern times.....who are no where even close to the toughness of Nazi Troops...

and quit this policy of not wanting to upset Liberals and other candyassses from around the First World Nations...

Did you fellers know Brad Pitt bought a T-54 Russian tank in Hungary, and had it shipped to his&Angelina's estate in socal.

With all the military restoration buffs here in USA, he could have bought American made for what that cost him, me thinks.

Brad Pitt don't need two stinking threads...

Just got back, great flick IMO.
Those men who fought that conflict were some dedicated and tough individuals. Truly the greatest generation.

I haven't been to see a movie at the theater in some time. I reckon I'll have to go and see this one.

Indeed, but I dunno that there were ANY Sherman crews that went in in North Africa and then to Europe who were still alive in April of '45.

As far as a tank movie, there was one a few years ago. The title had the word Beast in it. It was about Russians in Afghanistan.

The death rate of WWII tankers was absolutely horrid. German tanks were far heavier armored and packed much more powerful main guns. German anti-tank guns and Panzerfaust were for killing RUSSIAN tanks which were also far better than ours. American tankers won battles by blood,balls and numbers.

The last scene was a bit overdone, but at that time in the war it was more likely to have been a few SS officers and mostly conscripted soldiers with little to no training and even less desire to fight.

Sounds like it was worth the coin to see, unfortunately I was too sick to go see it. Will probably go next weekend and check it out.

The Beast.

My son is an armor-qualified officer. It's one of his favorite movies.

Paul

A bit of linguistic trivia. In one movie there was a shot of the control panel of a Russian tank with a button marked CTAPT. Doesn't mean anything unless you know that the English equivalent to the Cyrillic letters is START.

Sometimes a bit of linguistic literacy can be useful.

Paul

A few years ago, I read a memoir by a former battlefield recovery officer for a tank outfit. Immediately after the cessation of hostilities, he went looking for the biggest, baddest, heaviest armored Tiger tank he could find. He located one that had been shot in the ass by American shell fire, and he dug a panzerfaust out of his jeep. (He'd traded for it with some infantry guy.)

He judged the heaviest armor plate to be at the very front so he stood off and fired the panzerfaust face-on at the Tiger. Just for S&G.

He said it easily cut a hole all the way through would have burned out the interior if it hadn't already burned. Better than anything he'd ever seen or imagined before.

He also had an indoor shooting range built for his wife.



Travis

I think they both carry, and I'm pretty sure that both could get carry permits for California and New York City if they don't have them already.

It's actually fairly cheap to buy an old Soviet tank in Europe - like $50 grand. I would imagine the transportation cost would be a bit spendy.

A quick Google search shows a T54 with non-operational gun for sale in California for $85 grand, and a couple Shermans located in the US for $310,000 and $495,000. Also a Sherman for $275,000 with free delivery anywhere in the lower 48.

If I had the dough, one of those would be a much more fun toy than any stupid Ferrari.

That must above been a feeling of hopelessness when those 76 mm rounds from the Sherman's main gun would bounce off the Germans armor.

To bad it wasn't the AI version with TSX 's. Lol

diesel vs. gasoline...

James Gardner had a lot fun on screen with his own personal Sherman in �Tank� 1984...

yeah the russian stuff is cheap compared to the US cause everyone wants the US stuff....not that Pitt couldnt affors the American stuff....hell im fascinated by the German armor far more than the American....its his money what the hell, ild love to have a russian tank to just cause

I know I have read they are prepared if somebody comes into their house. Not sure if they carry concealed or not though.

I have read more than once they consider themselves (surprisingly) pro-gun.



Travis

Hard to tell from the clip but does Brad Pitt pick up an StG 44 somewhere?

That's his main personal weapon, an STG44. He also carries a S&W 1917 in a tanker holster. At least I'm pretty sure it's a Smith, could be a Colt but I don't recall getting a good enough look at the cylinder latch or ejector rod to tell.

Of course, when he's using it there is some other stuff going on on-screen so your attention is generally directed elsewhere...

I'm going to see it tomorrow. I could give a fugg about the story. I just want to ID guns and tanks.

And hopefully that Laboufoon actor gets blown up.



Travis

Yep, it's a Smith. I got a good look at the cylinder latch when it was on the table.

Interesting grips as well.

Good eye - it's definitely a Smith. Found this pic online - in the movie it was moving around so much it was hard to tell.

For those who haven't seen the flick, here he's giving their new recruit some basic lessons in handgun marksmanship...



Grips are interesting indeed. It's a picture of a nude model with clear plastic over it. From what I can see it's not a picture of Angelina Jolie.



The link brings up a large version of the pic to see it better - then you can click on that picture to enlarge it even further.

http://www.showfilmfirst.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/DF-00226.jpg

One thing that didn't make sense to me - for Pitt to have fought the Germans from Africa to the last weeks of the war in a tank and to do it with his crew - seems like with the attrition in armor and that time line - he'd be better n E6. But I don't know the exacts of war time promotion or the rank structure of the Army in the ETO at the time.

My Grandfather fought the Germans in 6 different countries, starting in N Africa and ending up in Austria at the end of the war. He was an E-1 in England before going to Africa and an E-5 at the end of the war. Some people certainly gained rank fast but I think the most were lost in the shuffle and didn't get promoted very fast at all.

Read Deathtraps.

At end of war the Third Armored Division totaled up its losses in ETO. Destroyed tanks(not repairable) totaled over 500% of its usual 262 tank inventory.

Fort Knox had shut down its tank training program in 1943 felling there were enough crews to last the war. By March '45 they were putting raw infantry recruits as tanks crew and commanders.

Probably basing it on what I was seeing in the Army between 2002 and 2006 - seemed like the E4 you went to language school was E6 a year later. Wasn't exactly but some sure seemed to get promoted fast compared to those of us in the Navy and we were promoted fast compared to the AF.

He might have been like a few career NCO's I knew where they'd get E6 or E7, then get really drunk and disorderly and be busted back a few ranks, then work their way back up. Wardaddy seems like the kind of guy who probably popped a few of those 90 day wonder butterbars in the chops.

Was poking around the net and found that the Tiger tank in this movie is a real Tiger captured during WWII, and is apparently the only running Tiger tank still around.

[video:youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=mV7TRLpCM48[/video]


The film crew related a spooky story. They said when they got the Tiger on set and brought the Shermans out for the big scene, the Tiger started up by itself and its gun started tracking one of the Shermans. One cameraman swore he could hear voices singing the Panzerlied faintly, like they were way off in the distance...

one of the cooler series ive seen...

diesel vs. gasoline...Sherman tanks... �Ronsons� cigarette lighters �Lights up the first time, every time!�

major difference between us and the Germans was how we went about manufacturing....Germans had better designs but they were being built closer to custom vehicle, lots of hand fitting....they were made like guys like Porsche who were used to making small production runs....we had designs that were nowhere near as good but we handed over manufacturing to the guys that made thousands and thousands of the same thing over and over again so in the end between the fact we had more and the Germans did not have access to quality fuel they got screwed.....more Tigers and Me 262s were parked do to lack of good quality fuel than we ever took out in fights.....

Plus, the German engineer hasn't been born who could look at a mechanical design and not say, "I can make that same process work by using three times as many parts!"

that too, especially when it came to the suspension....the Tiger's and Panther's suspension systems were a nightmare to repare in the field....the American stuff,if not blown to hell to bad, was alot easier to fix

I am going to see this movie. I can't wait for Netflix.

This is long, so digest at your leisure pace. My writing is sometimes a labor to read.

I am sharing this here because I can't think of a better place to do so, and also because I'm trying to create some historical narrative for my family. I am the oldest, so have the greater first-hand knowledge of my Dad's conversations and feel more responsibility to make sure this is not forgotten.

My Pop recently passed December 2012 at the young age of 86. He was in a Sherman with Patton's 10th Armored Division. Or, as he and his buddies would joke at reunions "Patton was with us".

I'm no military historian expert by any measure, so if I make any mistakes along the path of historical accuracy, feel free to correct them. I would appreciate it.

Dad didn't talk much about his wartime experience. So, anything I post here is a compilation of what I picked up from listening to him over a period of 50 years, mostly coming in the last 2-10 prior to his passing. So here goes:

He lied about his age to enlist in the Army because his Southern brood were of the stock it was their divine duty, and got into the tank corps. We're talking about Kentuck'ie, Tennessee, southern Illinois. Go there now and tell me it's any different.

He first stepped foot on French soil and got moved up to the front quickly. Somewhere after this time he or his buddies created one of their funny phrases.. "I'd rather face a German with a gun than have a Frenchman behind me with a knife". I don't know origin or history of that remark, but I've seen his buddies quietly nod their head in agreement when any of them uttered that phrase. I have no axe to grind in this matter.

As his unit was moving through France, in 1944, they were called upon to move quickly into an area around Bastogne, Belgium, in the Belgian part of the Ardennes forest. Everybody knows that story, so I'll leave that part to the experts, much more skilled in the history and story telling of it than I.

After the Bulge, Germany was falling apart and every grunt knew it. It was just a matter of time. Allied Air was kicking the crap out of them, and they had the likes of the entire Allied Army on their tails.

I believe situations after Bastogne affected my Pop more than anything else prior. Dad came to be best friends with his first tank commander, a Lt. and a true southern gentleman like my Dad. He was KIA by a sniper while doing recon out of the tank over a hilltop after they got into Germany. Pop was wounded first time soon after.

Dad was placed back in action a couple weeks later. This is around the time they went to an area called Dachau. "Daa-Kaa" , as Pop pronounced it in his humorous and limited knowledge of European linguistics. He said he and the guys passed out food, but were soon given the cease and desist because the prisoners could not handle the food. Many prisoners asked for guns to hunt down the Nazis who had fled into the forest, but Dad and his guys were again told no can do. Long story short, they couldn't stay long and had to head out. Pop told me later from what he read, many of the prisoners were already so far gone, he finally somewhat understood this order.

During this period in Germany, Pop shot down an ME109 that was strafing his column and, for that, was given the Bronze Star. Dad grew up in the 20's and 30's and was totally enamored by airplanes and the thoughts and dreams of flight. Heck, I've had them, too. Flying like an Eagle, banking and turning, effortlessly. We've all had them. Well, he was a fanatic about planes and flight as a teenager before entering the war. He collected flash cards of all the planes from all over the world throughout the 30's and was full aware of the structure, profile, and silhouette of planes from that period. I am proud to also have these flash cards and accompanying scrapbook in my possession. I believe that knowledge distinctly enabled him to identify the enemy plane and shoot it down before it could cause further harm to his group.

For many years, my family had the Swastika my Dad cut from the tail of the ME109 he shot down in our garage. That, along with an SS dagger, SS helmet were stolen by in-laws. My brother managed to get the original Swastika marked P38 out of the house before that happened, and Pop was able to personally give me back the guns I had bought for him. He never owned many guns during his life, that I saw. I think when I Christmas gifted him the .45, 9mm, and M1 carbine, that was the most he ever personally owned, including his .22 LR and shotguns.

The second time he got hit, his tank caught a Panzerfaust at point blank range, aided by a village woman in Ohringen, Germany pretending to sweep up debris, scouting for the shooter. Everyone in the tank except my Pop was KIA. (correction: after finding my 11 year old notes on a backup drive from my last computer; Dad and 1 other crewman managed to escape, wounded). Dad got blown out of the turret, multiple shrapnel wounds, and destroying his right ear drum for the rest of his life.

This marked the end of his action at the point of attack.

I have all Pop's medals, citations, unit citations, patches, and flag from full military honors burial. These include a Bronze Star for shooting down the ME109 and 2 Purple Hearts. I think he may have weighed in at 160-170 tops, soaking wet when he went in. He was long and dangly like me in my younger days, just a couple inches shorter.

This is the story of a real hero, as I knew him. He was my Pop. Was he a tough SOB? Yes. Was he a hardass? Yes.

We were coming back up from the north side of the lake one time. Beautiful day, bright sun-shiny. We come up on this pickup where this guy was putting a good hurtin' on his GF/wife. First thing out of the box, this guy tells my Dad to mind his own business or he's going to kill him. I remember my Dad first saying "OK", and then telling me to get back in the truck and stay there. I was about 15-16. Then, the guy threw the lady into the truck again and starting beating the hell out of her. Dad went back to the truck and beat his ass in the truck, mind you. Cleaned the guy's clock.. with the woman asking why he was hurting her man. Pop then came back to our truck and said it was time to go home.

I have many pics I would share of his from France, Germany, Bavaria. He REALLY liked the Garmisch- Partinkichern area. I'm just not too adept at posting them here, but if somebody wants to help, we can get them up. These include modern photos of the exact spot his tank took the panzerfaust round and the doorway where it was fired.

Don't want to bore you all with the narrative, but I felt I had to pass this real history forward, as well as my family's legacy in print. I have many pictures that I would gladly share. I just struggle on the Fire with posting pics, for some reason.

if you want to email them to rattlermtgmail.com ill host them on my photobucket and get them up

forgot to add, hell of a story........hell of a story

This sounds similar to my dad's history of service. He served in the infantry under Patton. Saw lots of combat. Started in Africa and ended up near the German border at war's end. Wounded twice in combat, survived a tank charge at Kasserine Pass, the only member of his squad to survive. Dad finished as a 1st Sergeant. He might have made it higher, but dad was no angel, and got in trouble more than a couple times. There was a jeep that got rolled over in Africa while chasing some critters around trying to shoot dinner, some confiscated German automatic weapons in Italy that were used to target some communication wires-only problem was they were Allied lines, not Axis. And then there was the little episode of fishing trout streams in France with hand grenades. Problem was there was Brass nearby that didn't appreciate their morning being interrupted by what could have been actual combat.......... Dad was no choir boy, but he did his job, as so many did. If given the chance, knowing my old man, I don't think he'd have behaved any differently. That's just what guys did to blow off steam.

This is long, so digest at your leisure pace. My writing is sometimes a labor to read.


Your writing is just fine.

I've come across a handful of stories of how infantrymen would have custom handgun grips made in-theater with plexiglas from crashed bombers. One story had it that a French civilian made them.

Found some when I Googled this: wwii plexiglas handgun grips

I had a great uncle who went across Europe with Patton's tank corps. Uncle Virgil had flat feet and expected a deferment, but Uncle Sam had other ideas. He was put in a tank where he didn't have to walk. He died before I was old enough to remember him and the only stories I have heard were those later related by my grandfather.

My gramps fought with the Cdn. Engineers, but I don't have any details. I asked him once about the war when I was a kid, and my dad had to pull me aside and tell me not to ask him that again.

Best line of the movie: "Don't get your panties in a knot. We still have hand weapons and a .50"

German tank crews referred to the Sherman as "Tommy Cookers"...and not because of the goofy little stove the English carried with them.

Found this on the 'net....

http://www.warhistoryonline.com/articles/15036.html

There are many stories of tank men watching dumbfound as their shells bounced off the Tiger. One of the more famous stories is from the commander of a British Churchill tank who had an encounter with Tiger 131(the only running tiger tank in the world .it can be seen at Bovington tank museum UK) the story goes�.� We had not only heard a lot about the Tiger but had also seen its effect on the Churchill tanks. When we arrived at the railhead we saw the hulls of our tanks stacked up with massive holes punched through their armour, even at the thickest parts! As we advanced towards our objective we could see no sign of the enemy, but suddenly my fellow tank erupted in an enormous explosion. Blowing the crew from the turret and setting the tank on fire. Before I had time to locate the enemy tank my own Churchill was hit by an 88 shell from the Tiger which passed through the front of our tank and all the way through to the engine at the back setting it on fire. We managed to bail out with minor injuries, not like our poor friends in the other tank. Tiger 131 that had been firing at us was hit by another one of our tanks and the shell got stuck under its gun which stopped the gun from turning and the Germans abandoned their tank. The British had captured a Tiger.�

I'd give about anything to ride/drive a tank. WWII armoured vehicles have always interested me.

Built many a model as a lad and a few as an adult.

Adventures - Tank Town USA
www.tanktownusa.com/adventures.php
Tank Driving Ages 15+$75.00/10 mins
Feel the Power! Tank Driving has never been more affordable! For $75.00 you will get personalized instruction on vehicle operation and then 10 minutes or 1/2 a mile of driving (whichever comes first!) at the controls thundering around our course. We have plenty of bumps, dips and humps to keep it fun the whole way through! Want a little longer behind the controls? You can extend your adventure for as long as you want with each additional 10 minutes of driving costing just $65.00! Have a group of 5 or more driving participants?

More...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiger_131

On 21 April 1943, the tank was knocked out and captured on a hill called Djebel Djaffa during the preliminary phases of the Battle of Longstop Hill which opened the way to the capture of Tunis. During the battle, Tiger 131 was hit by three shots from 6-pounders from British Churchill tanks of A Squadron, 4 Troop of the 48th Royal Tank Regiment.

A solid shot hit the Tiger's gun barrel and ricocheted into its turret ring, jamming its traverse, wounding the driver and front gunner and destroying the radio. A second shot hit the turret lifting lug, disabling the gun's elevation device. A third shot hit the loader's hatch, deflecting fragments into the turret.

The German crew bailed out, taking their wounded with them and leaving the knocked-out but still driveable and largely intact tank behind.Their identity and fate are unknown. The tank was secured by the British as they captured Djebel Djaffa hill. Tiger 131 was the first intact Tiger tank captured by British or American forces.

Tigers in North Africa. Who knew?

And fine marksmanship by them Tankers

Holy awesome.

Did you see this part?

CAR CRUSHING AGES 15+$499.00

Why just drive a tank when you can crush a car with one? Get your heart pumping with 20 minutes of driving excitement and top it off by smashing a car. Nothing is more thrilling than hearing the hood crumple and the glass shatter as you flatten a car with 17 tons of military steel. Don't just stop with one pass though. We will make sure you hit the car from every angle to ensure that nothing is left untouched. A once in a lifetime experience!

This would make an awesome birthday or christmas present.

Thanks, rattler! I'm going to send you some asap.

My nephew got to take ride in the last flying B-29 this weekend on a deal put on by the Confederate Airforce Event in Waco, TX. I think it cost him around $500 bucks. He got to set in one of the gun turrets and said it was worth every penny. I'm envious!