Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Rimfires Rimfire Shortages - Its Been Over 24 Months Now!

I have been keeping track and this rimfire shortage started in early October of 2,012 - thats 24 full months now - going on 25!
I travel throughout the west and stop at gunshops, sporting goods stores and chain stores at every chance I get - mostly looking for quality 22 hollow-point ammo and 17 Mach2 ammo.
The consensus is (from the "knowledgeable" gunshops owners and ammo counter clerks I trust) that they simply are not getting as much quality 22 ammo and 17 Mach2 ammo as they did prior to this current and ongoing situation.
Frankly I am at a loss - some people claim the 22 ammo makers are pumping out more than ever and its simply being "hoarded" by "hoarders".
I don't think so - I mean how many months/years til the hoarders basements are full???
I tend to give creedence to those who contend that the ammo makers are making so much money selling factory loaded ammo that rimfire ammo and centerfire components have taken a back seat to this profit driven policy?
Again I don't know but tend to give this "contention/conjecture" more creedence than the 5 or 6 other theories that abound.
I mean 25 months and nothing but burps and spurts of 22 ammo just doesn't make sense to me - and there are no signs of the situation (let alone the PRICES!) for quality 22 hollow-point ammo ever getting back to "normal"!
I don't know - I guess I am just frustrated?
I have enough of one type 22 ammo for a year and a halfs worth of shooting but less than a years worth of my favored Winchester 40 grain Power-Points!
I don't even like to think about my store of 17 Mach2 ammo (not much!).
Sad situation - different than what I have lived with, to say the least.
I guess all we can do is roll with the punches?
Come on Winchester produce some 40 grain Power-Points.
There seems to be a fair amount of 17 HMR ammo on the shelves where I travel by.
Your thoughts appreciated.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Frankly, democrats are good for the firearms and ammo business.

It's not as bad as it was around my parts, but the prices have basically doubled from what there were. Hard to get a particular brand or type of ammo, but usually something can be found. Not a hoarder, but I am now buying when I see what I want.

I have zero problem finding 22 ammo for a fair price.

Haven't had a problem for years.

My wife and I were in central Montana a couple of weeks ago doing some PD shooting and managed to gather up almost a case of 22 good gopher shooting ammo just by stopping in sporting good stores, farm stores, etc. and asking if they had 22 ammo. Most places had it under the counter and not out on display so if I hadn't asked I would have assumed that there was none available. All places did have a limit on it but we left happy. On average I paid $30.00 per brick.

There was 17 HMR and 22 Magnum available even in places that didn't have 22 lr. There certainly doesn't seem to be a "shortage" of either of them.

drover

Little to none to be had in Casper WY

Drover: Good for you on the diligent searching!
And thats not to bad a price (these days!) you paid.
I hope you also did well on the Prairie Doggin.
Yeah the availability of 17 HMR seems kind of out of place as compared to the 22 L.R. stuff - puzzling that.
I am already looking forward to next years Gophering!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Smithrjd: I agree on your price evaluation.
I wonder if prices will ever come down?
I am not technically a hoarder either, as I do not buy and then re-sell 22 ammo.
I have bought 22 ammo though and then traded it for ammo that I am sighted in for (22 Federal bulk pack stuff and Winchester Power-Points).
Hoping things get back to normal.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy
P.S.: Be sure and watch out for self described turds - they tend to lie a lot and stink real bad when stepped upon!

PD-ing wasn't bad, we averaged about 250 rounds each per day and then the rain set in so no more PD-ing, too much gumbo.

drover

What I can't figure out is where the heck is it all going? All of the stores around here that used to get plenty of .22 ammo aren't suddenly selling out of it- they can't get it at all. And this is with the big chains and small stores and everything in between. From Sportsman's Warehouse, Cabelas, and BiMart to every other store that used to have good supplies of ammo- none of them can get more than a few boxes a week. Not cases like usual.

So, where the heck is all of that production going? Something stinks here....

Bob

A brand new small gun shop opened up here recently. On the counter next to the register was a tall clear plastic jar filled up about half way with Remington Thunderturds. The sticker on the jar read "15 cents a piece"!

LGS got in 2000 rounds of CCI .22 Mag in today. First they have had in 6 months.

.22 Mag ammo has pretty much been Non Existent here in N. TX

It's out there but you have to look for it (order it). I have bought several cases this year at pre-panic prices.

Dink

Yeah, apparently a lot of shooters still can't comprehend that the Internet is the major place to go for rimfire ammo now, not local stores.

Local stores aren't getting as much as they used to because there are more mail-order companies ordering it now, and they often had their orders in long before the local stores. Plus, some stores have pissed off rimfire manufacturers, by selling as much ammo in one week as they normally sell it three months, then telling customers the shortage is due to the manufacturers not sending them "enough ammo."

Yeah right! Shutting down the lead smelters, now the copper smelters via EPA caveat, and you actually think they're HELPING the situation!
Wake the hell UP! Its going to get a lot worse before it gets better.

Mesabikid44: I had forgotten about the lead smelters going away in America.
I fear that you may be right in your prediction that things are going to get worse in the future (next couple of years).
Did three "gunshops" yesterday and nothing in the way of rimfires but some 17 HMR ammo at one of them.
I have never bought 22 ammo from a mail order outlet like Mule Deer suggests - I wonder if the high prices and then the shipping costs on top of that will further discourage us 22 Hunters/shooters?
I had not heard of the copper smelters being regulated into oblivion - yikes on that.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

I think it will get better soon if the elections go well (a.k.a. Republicans win enough seats).

When I order cases in January they told me one year for it to be delivered. I got it in 7-8 months.

I don't buy the supply/demand theory but the truth of the matter is order it by the case and wait on it to show up. If you don't order it today and the elections go bad there is a good chance in a year wal-mart still won't ammo on the shelf.

Dink

It costs me about an hour and a half and about $4 worth of gas to go running around town checking stores that have ammo, times the number of times I have to do that to amass ammo. It takes me 5 minutes and no gas to order stuff online, and I can do it at times when the stores aren�t even open. I have to make multiple trips to get anything in quantity. In the last month, I have gotten about 1300 Federal Auto Match, 1000 CCI Mini-Mag HP, 300 CCI Mini-Mag RN online. I have passed up even more. If, on average, I pay 2-3 cents more per round delivered than the retail price plus tax when I can find it locally, it still winds up cheaper to me in terms of time and gasoline than amassing similar quantities in my locale at �big box store prices�. The other plus is that I get what I want rather than a mish mash of whatever is on the shelf with a 2-3 box limit.

A guy who spends hours of time and $20 on gasoline and then is happy to have amassed 500 Mini-Mags at $7.99 a hundred ($39.95 plus tax), while another guy spent 5 minutes and $56 ($11.20 a hundred, no tax) shipped for the same item, actually lost money in comparison. I am sure that a lot of people have a hidden cost in time and gasoline that they do not take into consideration when discussing their big ammo score. I realize that everyone�s personal situation differs, but it is much cheaper for me to mail order at a higher price than to run around chasing rainbows for the pot of ammo at the end.

There really isn't any shortage of ammo, just people not wanting to pay the prices they see. On gunbrokers you can find any type of ammo you want.

I mostly agree, but the I do enjoy the time out, chatting with other folks at gun counters & browsing. For me it's a wash either way. But If I have to have "it" ... typically its online for me too.

I always need something or other from ammo/reloading supply sites, so when the right rimfire ammo is for sale I order a couple of the other items, which reduces the shipping costs per item, since they can all go into the same package. As an example, I found some Federal Auto Match on-line at $15 for 325 a month ago, and needed a couple of other small items from the same company (an RCBS bullet-puller collet and a new dial caliper), and the total shipping came to $7. Which means the shipping for the ammo was around $3, less than a gallon of gasoline.

The mail-order companies didn't sell a lot of lower-priced .22 ammo before the Obama panic, because so much was available in stores. Instead they mostly dealt in match .22 ammo, which stores don't sell much. But after the panic started, shooters started looking for rimfire ammo wherever they could find it, and the mail-order companies started moving enough to make it worthwhile to order bigger batches of the lower-priced stuff.

Now and then a small LGS near me has Auto Match. Last box cost me $18, which is about what Wally wanted for it back in the golden days of plenty. The more-or-less box stock 1022 I use for our club's winter indoor CMP shoots, dotes on that stuff.

Ammoman merely wanted about $85 for it the last time I checked while doing the online rounds.

A shop near my hunting camp had those Federal "tuna cans", 325 rounds of 36gr ammo, for $22 last week. Heard of 'em, first I had seen one. Probably not a bad idea for long term storage, ammo sealed in a can.

Surprised the preppers haven't gathered them all up by now? :O)

Our local Walmart had some 225 packs of Remsky Golden Bullets a few weeks ago. One customer was irate over the one box limit instead of the posted three box limit, because the clerk deemed that did not apply to any bulk packs.

First 22LR I've seen there in months, but for some Stingers.

With the Internet dealers pay attention to the price. They are not always close to the same. A friend picked me up 5000 ely target from a local guy he knows. I saw some on the net for close to the same price. I also saw one that was almost twice as much.

Prices are all over the place for 22 ammo. Some local shops have bumped up the price whenever they get any in, some haven't. Perhaps my timing is bad, but I haven't found anything online at a price that I'd pay for it.

Last year I found Auto Match from $30 to $70 around here, for example. Some of the highest prices were at gun shows, although one small shop had it for $30. As noted, the last box I got from a local shop was $18, so he gets more of my business these days. Since then I bought some rifle powder and a few other things from him.

The only ammo I'm really looking for at the moment, is CCI SV. Last few times I found some, they wanted $40 or more per brick.

Midway has had CCI SV off and on, for under $30 a brick, but it tends to go out the door quickly. I ordered one a couple weeks ago along with some other stuff I needed, to (again) spread the shipping costs around. Otherwise the brick would have cost around $40.

I still check local stores and have picked up some ammo here and there, but only when it's a reasonable price and I actually need it. Even found some .22 Magnum 40-grain Winchester hollow-points at Wal-Mart a couple months ago, at under $11 a box.

Bought a pile of .17 Mach 2 and .17 HMR locally last spring, all at around $6 a box for M2 and $12 for HMR, but both primarily sell in the West for spring and early summer varmint shooting, so they're typically produced seasonally. Otherwise the same machines are running either .22 LR or .22 magnum. There hasn't been much of either around since, so if anybody wants some .17's for tree squirrels in the fall they should pick it up early.

But mostly I buy off the Internet, because that's where most rimfire ammo is sold these days. You have to keep checking to find reasonable deals, but checking the net is a lot cheaper than driving around to every store within 100 miles. I only check local stores when nearby for some other reason, and refuse to pay panic prices, and my wife and I haven't had to cut back on shooting any of our 16 rimfires.

Other than looking at online sources all that often, pretty much my MO when looking for 22 ammo.

When I need something, or happen to be in the neighborhood of any sources (small shops, Bass Pro, etc), I pop in to see what they have.

Any trip to Walmart means a trudge back to the sporting goods section to see what is in the ammo case and we're usually at Wally's every few weeks for something. I did buy a 225 pack of those Golden Bullets that I mentioned.

Next time someone shows up at our club range with a kid and hardly any 22 ammo, it's theirs.

Walmart is the only dang place around here that stocks the brand of summer windshield washer bug juice that I use lots of in my truck, so that's my ofeeshul excuse for being there.

That and our favorite cheese at a buck a pound cheaper than our local grocery.

Since the "shortage" started, every time I'm in a store that carries ammo, Walmart, Meijers, Dunhams, Cabelas, Gander Mt, hardwares, etc., I check for .22 LR ammo. I've not found one box on the shelves. My LGS has managed to always keep some in stock, first by buying loose bulk & selling 50 rnd baggies for $5.50, limit one per range visit. They now have some limited varieties of factory packed ammo but are charging scalper prices, $5-$10 per 50. Because they can. I don't shoot my .22s as much or as often as I did before the shortage. According to the range master at my counties largest range, neither is anyone else. I've read all the reasons/excuses and done the math that backs it up, but two years? It's just not making sense to me any more.

So have you changed the way you look for .22 ammo since the "shortage" started?

Tmitch: Your point about NOT shooting as much at a time and as often is simply a sad fact most all 22 shooters are living with (including me!).
I hope you can find some ammo soon.
My VarmintGrandKids (and VarmintKids) are due here next spring and they like to plink at the orange and black clay pigeons.
At least I have plenty of clay pigeons on hand.
Again sorry about you striking out on the 22 ammo so often.
Keep trying.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Have you read this report? Or maybe the NRA is part of the problem?
http://www.americanrifleman.org/blo...imfire2-text&utm_campaign=22Rimfire2

OK, Really, What�s Going on with .22 Rimfire?

By Mark Keefe (RSS)

October 01, 2014


The issues behind lack of .22 Long Rifle ammunition on the shelves of your local retailer are complex and not easily explainable. Demand currently exceeds supply. Beyond the laws of simple economics, there are side effects due to lack of said supply and high demand. The two most obvious are speculation and hoarding. If you can hit the local big box store because you have the time to wait for the ammo truck to arrive and resell $20 worth of .22 for $60 through the Valley Trader or at the next gun show, you are an opportunistic speculator. There are some other words I might use, but I will restrain myself. And if you are a guy that typically buys .22 Long Rifle 250 rounds at a time who just bought 10,000 because you could not find 250 when you wanted them, then you are a hoarder. It does not make you evil, it simply means your buying habits changed due to market or external conditions. And your changed behavior likely led others to change theirs as well.

When demand exceeds supply, feeding more product into distribution is the obvious answer. It�s just good business. But what if you can�t? That�s where we are with .22 Long Rifle.

We have been resoundingly criticized for reporting manufacturers all say they are running full out in .22 Long Rifle production (some of the kinder messages had more expletives than a Quentin Tarantino movie). The ammo makers are not making that up. It is not a conspiracy. I have been in two of the major rimfire plants in the United States since this �crisis� hit, and they are, indeed, running three shifts, full out. But there are not that many rimfire plants in the United States. There are foreign makers, too, with Mexico�s Aquila, Italy�s Fiocchi and Sweden�s Norma in particular stepping up to meet demand. Also making .22 LR are England�s Eley, Germany�s RWS and SK and Armscorp in the Philippines.

For domestic rimfire plants, ATK/Federal has one in Minnesota, there is the ATK/CCI plant is in Idaho, Remington has one in Arkansas, and Winchester has one in Oxford, Miss. The latter used to be in East Alton, Ill., but in order to remain profitable and competitive, Olin Corp. moved the plant about a decade ago. Notice those two words, �profitable� and �competitive.� One of the reasons we shoot so much .22 is that it is cheap. At least compared to center-fire ammunition. Granted, material costs (i.e., lead and copper) have increased but at around 5 to 10 cents a round in normal conditions, .22 Long Rifle is remarkably reliable and inexpensive. But it is not terribly profitable. Much like the promotional dove loads that hit every big box store in the country this time of year (remind me to pick up a case), they are designed for mass production and have low profit margins. Pricing, at least from the manufacturer, is extremely sensitive and competitive. They sell huge amounts of rimfire and dove loads, but no company�s bottom line financial success is made by these products. Loss leaders or thin margins, they may not be pork bellies, but sure seem like commodities.

If you have even seen .22 being made (and my friend Mike Bussard wrote an excellent piece on how they actually make it), you know it is a huge capital expense to set up a rimfire plant. It�s not like you can order a high-speed rimfire loading machine out of the Staples catalog and set it up in your garage. It takes time, land and, literally, a lot of dollars to establish a rimfire factory. Then you have to train the workers and ensure the safety of your workers and the area in which the plant resides. Priming rimfire cases is not something best left to amateurs. The question is, though, would it be worth it to go to the expense of, say, building a $250 million rimfire plant to make your company�s money back at a penny a round over the next 10 to 20 years? The answer, so far, has been a resounding no.

This demonstrates prudence on the part of ammo manufacturers. No one can predict how long the current bubble will last. It has more than burst on the firearms side as demand for new firearms has predictably dropped from last year�s hyper-inflated levels. A company cannot plan soundly based upon a bubble. But a company can plan based on known variables. Variables such as a substantial increase in the number of .22s sold and a change in the type of .22s being shot by their new owners. This may make a new rimfire plant worth it. Time will tell.

There are, literally, millions more .22 Long Rifle firearms owned and shot that have entered civilian hands in recent years. Based on BATF data, Sturm, Ruger alone in 2012 (the most recent year for which date is available) produced 254,991 �up to .22� pistols, in addition to 68,001 �up to .22� revolvers. Heritage in Florida made 88,778, while North American Arms trailed with a still impressive 54,511. And remember, those �up to 22� pistols made by Ruger were pretty much all semi-automatics with 10-round capacity magazines. If each new Ruger buyer purchased just 100 rounds, that is an increase in demand of 25,499,100 just for those buyers. If they bought 200 rounds, you are looking at an increase of demand of roughly 51 million rounds.

Imports are an area in which we can see how the universe of .22 rimfires has increased, and those numbers are from the Foreign Trade Division, U.S. Bureau of Census, and published every year by Shooting Industry. Take Canada for example. In 2013 alone 292,394 rimfire rifles were imported from the Great White North, which was about 30,000 more than the year before. If you are wondering why you weren�t aware of this Canadian invasion it�s because the guns come from Savage�s plant in Ontario. But it�s not just Canadians. In 2013, 29,618 rimfire rifles were imported from Italy.

The number for Germany is even more telling. In 2012, 46,942 rimfire rifles were imported, while 2013 saw that number increase to 60,795. I have news for you: There were not more than 60,000 Olympic Free rifles imported into the United States last year. Of those more than 100,000 rifles, I suspect many of them were semi-automatics that came from Walther/Umarex. We identified this trend in the December 2010 issue of American Rifleman with a story �A New Class of Rifles: The �Tactical� .22s� In it �The term 'tactical .22 rifle' is essentially an oxymoron. It�s unlikely that a single military or police force on Earth uses .22 Long Rifle arms for small-scale combat operations, at least as primary guns. Nevertheless, this burgeoning class of firearms has taken hold in recent years in the civilian market.� The author then proceeded to evaluate eight different .22s in this new category from ATI, Colt, Heckler & Koch, Mossberg, Ruger, Remington, SIG Sauer and Smith & Wesson. And two of those guns came from guess where? Umarex. In Germany. The minimum magazine capacity for any of the eight was 10 rounds, but most were�and are�20- to 25-round magazines. What that means is that when shooters take such guns to the range, they shoot more ammunition.

Let�s face it, if you have a 10- or 25-round capacity magazine, how often do you say to yourself, �I�ve only fired five so far, maybe I should unload the rest, put them back in the box and save them for later.� No. If you have a semi-automatic carbine with a 25-round capacity magazine, odds are you will shoot more rounds at the range than if you had brought a single-shot Winchester Low Wall Winder Musket. There�s nothing wrong with that. It is merely a behavior change based upon the kinds of guns consumers have been purchasing for recreational shooting. So if the million or so owners of the million or so .22s sold over the past few years each bought just one 325-round can of Federal Champion (try not to confuse it with your cashews), you are looking at a minimum increase in demand of 325 million rounds.

External factors also effect demand for ammunition. Whenever major anti-gun legislation makes headlines, people react to it. We saw it with semi-automatic rifles over the past few years (which demand has now slowed). If there is a perception�real or imagined�that one cannot purchase something, then there is increased demand. If word leaked out that the government was about to ban toilet paper, you can be rest assured, my cart would be stocked with 96 count bulk packs of my favorite rolls. The same logic applies if you tell people that toilet paper is rare and not on the shelves. At some point, ammunition demand will reach its real level, not the snow-maggedon-like �bread, milk and toilet paper� frenzy we are experiencing now. At that point, the major ammo makers will look and see if there is sufficient demand for a new rimfire plant or line. I think there will be, but we will have to wait until conditions stabilize at the new normal.

"What are external factors for 200 Alex"

Yes and no. Before the shortage I used to buy online and retail. Now it's an online game only. But I won't bow to scalping prices and I won't buy foreign stuff, so sometimes it takes a few weeks to find anything. In the interim the guns are silent and I find now, even when I've "scored" a brick, it's always on my mind to take it easy on my supply. Subsequently I shoot less.

0.10 or slightly less is pretty common in my area.

Mom and pop stores have it, guess the hoarders forget about them and head straight to wally world.

Stopped in a local sporting goods store today, and they had a bunch of CCI Mini-Mag hollow-points, along with 12-15 boxes of .17 HMR 17-grain V-Maxes and a few boxes of CCI .22 Magnums. All were for fairly normal prices, and while talking to the manager of the guns & ammo section I asked how long the Mini-Mags had been in.

"About a week," he said. "We got 50 cases and we're down to four now." The store does put a limit on how much you can buy, but people are still buying as much rimfire as possible, even though the general deer and elk season is about to start.

I am not going to quote the NRA article above, but I think it makes sense.

I've shot more .22 LR ammo since the 2008 shortage than I did in the 30 years prior to that combined. When centerfire ammo and components got scarce and expensive during the 2008 scare, I switched over to rimfire and never looked back. Since then, I have bought a few .22 LR handguns and plan to buy more. I also bought a .22 WMR rifle and started accumulating ammo and shooting it. .22 ammo is still cheap in comparison and I don't have to sit at a bench and reload, and I get to sweep up the brass and dump it in a recycle bin. No muss, no fuss. We have a new indoor range open to the public and I get to shoot during the worst part of the winter when I could not go outside to shoot. I try to go as often as possible. I figure that I never shoot less than 100 rounds per visit and probably average a couple of hundred. If I do that 3 to 5 times a month, I am running through some ammo that would have been available to the general public a few years ago.

I guess that makes me part of the "problem."

i've seen 17hmr 10:1 over 22lr on the shelves.
So I've stocked up on that. $14/50 on average.

Just dropped by another local store to see what ammo and handloading stuff they were getting in this fall. They also had some hollow-point .22 LR on the shelf, Federals. I don't need any, and didn't see anybody else buying any while there, but then again the rifle season for deer and elk starts Saturday, so most of the customers were lined up buy licenses at the next-to-last moment, so probably weren't particularly concerned about next spring's gopher ammo.

Local shop has had a good variety of 22 LR on the shelves for weeks. Limit 1 brick and two smaller boxes per day.

I recall seeing:
CCI - Minimag, Quiet, SGB
Federal 525 Bulk, Target, Match, Auto Match.
Winchester Super X, Bulk.
Aguila Pistol Match
Eley Club
...and others that I can't remember.

I don't think they ever ran out of 17HMR.

Ordered 20 boxes of Hornady 22 Mag 30 Gr. VMAX the other day from Powder Valley.....they had it in stock at a little over $10/box. I thought I had run into a gold mine, until they called and said they had imposed a 5 box limit per order. So I got 5 boxes.

As long as stupid (sorry if I offend anyone here) people are willing to pay scalpers' prices, the scalpers will continue to buy it all up and resell it for a profit. Take away their profit and they will stop. I can guarantee you that limits are not stopping creative people from buying every box on every shelf.

If demand is so high that people pay scalper prices, that is the real market price. The retailer who has a lower price is trying to preserve good will, and also has to impose quantity restrictions for the same reason in order to spread it around. In your example, I may be willing to pay more per box to get all 20 boxes in one shot than to get 5 and take the chance that I can run around and get 3 more sets of 5, or 15 times one, or 7-1/2 times 2, or some other combination to get to 20, IF I really need 20 as opposed to merely taking advantage of a perceived bargain (or gold mine). Time and gasoline are money to me. It is not my job to adjust my buying decisions so other people can get what they want at the price they want. With that said, I do not buy all that I can buy. I have passed on a lot of store ammo in the last few weeks. But, I do buy what I perceive that I need based upon my �burn rate.� As I said in an earlier post, my burn rate has gone up substantially, so I am competing in the marketplace where I was not before.

You may be right....but I think I am.

When Wal-Mart or Gander Mountain or Academy has it in stock.....it's WAY cheaper than you can buy it on a classified forum or at a gun show from somebody that paid the cheaper price and is scalping it. I'm not saying it's wrong. I'm saying people are dumbazzes for paying $50 or $60 for a brick or bulk pack of cheap .22 LR when all they have to do is quit paying it for awhile and the guys that are doing the marking up will stop.

That's all I'm saying.

I'll never drive around to 10 different places to get a few boxes of .22. I'll shoot 223 or whatever else. I'm stocked up on rimfire and my kids are still shooting it up. They're just shooting single shot Remington bolts now instead of 10/22's with 25-rd mags.

Cheyenne,

All the fact that SOME people pay scalper prices proves is that SOME people feel locked-in somehow, whether by only knowing one way to shop for rimfire ammo, or by never keeping much around before the shortage hit. It doesn't prove anything about the "real" market price, anymore than somebody who buys a scope for $100 more than they could have bought it for elsewhere proves that's the real price of that scope. It all depends on how much somebody feels they need the ammo or the scope.

I have paid $50 or more for a brick of .22 Long Rifle in the past couple of years, but only for target ammo, not plinking ammo, or hollow-points. And there are other people I know who can say the same thing. Does that "prove" that's the real market price? No, not anymore than people who pay $60 for a brick of Thunderbolts.

I agree with that to some extent. The market price is the price at which one can readily find something without going to a whole lot of trouble. A person who pays more than that is paying an above market price. A savvy shopper who can locate hard to find stuff at good prices is actually getting it at a below market price. If demand is too high for supply to catch up at the price offered, the price is probably too low, or below market price.

I dollar cost average and shop around. I certainly would not pay Gunbroker prices for bulk pack. But, there are some other factors that influence the amount that I will pay. For example, I may pay more per box/brick to get more of the exact type of ammo I already have on hand because I know how my gun(s) shoot it, which makes it a better value than to buy something that may not work as well.

I don't agree with that at all. Gun nuts can and do find cheaper rates on most anything. But that stuff can be turned for a profit almost instantly.

Joe Take My Kid to the Range Tomorrow isn't going to fugg with that schit. He's gonna pay $60.00. $60.00 for a brick of 22LR was the going rate a few months ago. I'd say it's about $50.00 now.

Yes some locales have more supply than others. But I'm talking nationwide, overall.



Travis

I agree with you. And I won't pay it either. But the reality is most consumers are not you and I. I have spoken to more than one casual shooter in the past year that was stunned to discover you couldn't buy 22LR. So what do they do? They ask where to find it, and when they find it, they fuggin' buy it.



Travis

Market price isn't a definite number, it's a range- Then if you want to be real nerdy, you you can make a graph of prices versus amunt sold at that price- All of which has about as much meaning as comparitive sectional densities of shotgun slugs

Fred, you never were good at ballistic gack and minutae.....

And two years into this insanity, there are still lots of folks that have no clue about a shortage.

I encounter some now and then at our club ranges, stunned thatcha can't just waltz into a Walmart, Dick's or an LGS and come out with a little box of 22 ammo now.

If they do stumble onto some, then they're upset that it now costs twice what it did a few years ago.

Regulars at the range generally just shake their heads when this happens, for some reason?

Bob, my wife bought a Ruger SP22 handgun from Sportsman's Warehouse and the sales guy pulled a brick of Rem. Thunderbolts out from under the counter and asked if she needed any ammo...$26/box. On the return visit, to actually pick up the gun (waiting period), I asked if they had any .22 ammo, and since a different sales guy handled the transaction, he turned to a different clerk and said "go pull a brick out of my stash".

So, based on this experience, the stores ARE getting ammo, but the monkeys behind the counter are grabbing it (at wholesale prices, I'm sure).

Sometimes the "monkeys" behind the counter are holding on to it to sell when someone wants to buy a .22. It's kinda hard to sell guns if the customer can't find ammo.

A nice older monkey woman behind the counter told me they were getting a shipment in tonight and if I came in tomorrow morning, I could get 1,000 rounds. She read off a list to me and there were even some CCI's on it. Of course, I won't be there tomorrow because I already have enough 22LR ammo.

My dealer has had some off and on. His prices are comparable to Wally World prices. That being siad, it's still higher than the "good ol' days". However, so is everything else. Give inflation a chance. 3% for 30 years means everything basically doubles in price over that time frame. My grandfather bought his first new car back in the 30's. $600.... of course he only made $1200 that year. I wonder what .22 ammunition was in say 1935?
You young guys better be planning your retirement funding now........
What Things Cost in 1935:
Car: $580
Gasoline: 19 cents/gal
House: $6,300
Bread: 8 cents/loaf
Milk: 47 cents/gal
Postage Stamp: 3 cents
Stock Market: 144
Average Annual Salary: $1,500

Of course the cars had no air conditioning, CD players, Blue Tooth, GPS, ETC............

And life expectancy was 58 for men.

Yuma gunshow this morning, several guys had bricks of .22 ammo, prices down to an average of about 32 bucks, down from 60-70 6 months ago. Nobody buying.

Dang you headed south already?

Yeah, we been here since the 21st. All the leaves were down off the aspens, there was morning frost on windshield and Ace Hardware was having a sidewalk sale on snowblowers, time to head south.

Dang snowbirds anyway!

I pick up a couple of boxes of Aquila from academy every so often. nothing at 3 different walmarts in nearly forever. one would think with their purchasing power they could force some into their stores. they do have a 3 box limit here but nothing on the shelves in the way of rimfire.

Saw CCI mini-mags here 9.99/100. What are you guys seeing? This was at a retail.

Local shop had mini mags for 13.99.

But to be fair, his entire shop is overpriced.

Stopped at three local shops Friday and all had at least a few different types on the shelf. Prices slightly high but not unreasonable.

I've heard from friends that our two closest Walmarts have received a decent amount every Saturday for the last month. However, it still doesn't last more than a day.

Kenoh2: We travelled over 280 miles yesterday checking numerous chain stores, sporting goods stores and gunshops in 3 Montana cities and not a single round of 22 L.R. hollow-point ammo was to be found ANYWHERE!
Bulk packs at the Helena, Montana gunshow were priced from $50.00 to $65.00 and one pawn shop had Remington 525 pack hollow-points at $80.00!
One of my travel mates did buy a Deluxe rare edition Browning lever action 22 Rifle at Bob Wards in Butte, Montana for $849.00 and was offered a CCI 100 pack of NON-hollowpoints for $12.00 or a 40 round box of American Eagle hollow-points for $5.49!
Scalper prices nearly there - of ammo that is not available to the 22 ammo shooter but only to a rimfire firearm PURCHASER!!!
Counterfolks at 3 Bears Alaska, 2 Wal-Marts, Bob Wards, Bugs n Bullets, and 2 independant sporting goods stores/gunshops in Helena just laughed at us when we asked for 22 ammo.
Some 17 HMR was seen here and there on shelves (priced HIGH!) but no 17 Mach2 ammo at all.
Locally here, NO 22 ammo has been available in many weeks and EVERY non-resident Hunter that has come into the LGS here seems to ask for 22 ammo and comments from them concur its still extremely hard to find on shelves anywhere in their travels.
Kenoh2, what part of the world are you in? I have been getting the impression that back east and some mail order outlets are getting more ammo of late?
I wish this were over.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Was at the LGS today looking for powder, did not find any.. They did however have CCI target limit 6 boxes per for $4.99 a box. As this is my High Standards favorite I got 6 boxes.

while academy sometimes has .22 rimfire, I haven't seen 17hmr or .22 magnum in maybe a year or more. never seen any of the short .17's.

it has put a kink in any kind of target shooting. just small game ammo is it's assigned use now, and to check the sights. and the choices are so thin or narrow. yeah, I'm complaining but it does no good to complain.

VarmintGuy, I'm in the NW Ohio part of the world. I know of five shops within 25 miles that have 22lr, 22WMR and 17HMR. All of them have daily limits. None have scalper prices. The last I saw 17Mach2 was about a month ago.
I will be stopping at a pawnshop on the way home tomorrow to pick up a few boxes of Hornady 17HMR @ $10/box. He has had them for at least six months.

From my what I see at shops around me, it seems the shortage is easing. Maybe we are in a better shipping route or maybe it's because Buckeyes are the chosen people.

Since this thread started I've had three opportunities to buy 500 to 1000 rounds of .22 Long Rifle hollow-points off the Internet for at most $35 a brick. Didn't because I already have enough, though would have if any had been Winchester Power Points.

Supplies didn't last more than a day at any of the websites, but they were there if anybody was checking.

MuleDeer,

Have you noticed any increase in the amount of misfires with recently purchased .22lr. Friend and I shot a bunch today with recently bought Ely target and Wolf.

We had around 20 that didn't fire out of perhaps 300 rounds. Most would fire on the second try. The ones we looked at all had good hits on the first go and the strike on the second try when they would fire looked identical.

We get in 22 every day of the week. Usually 3-5 cases. Last week we received over 300,000 rounds.....and it didn't even sell out!

22 ammo is still on allocation with the wholesalers (distributors). They're still hoarding some to tie in with stuff they have on the shelf that's not moving well. There is more out there than people realize. We upped out "limit" to two bricks per customer...

battue,

Not really. I did have a couple of misfires with some Remington .22 Short ammo recently, but only in one of several rifles I tested it in, and both rounds fired the second time I tried them.

To be honest, until I became a member of the Campfire I hardly ever even thought about rimfire misfires, because I so rarely encountered them. I don't know why that would be, because my wife and own over 15 rimfire rifles and handguns, so there's certainly a wide range of firing pins and springs.

shortactionsmoker,

I even had the owner of one store recently confess that he'd gotten in 60 cases of .22 Long Rifle ammo, but only sold 50, because he wants to hold some back for next spring's varmint shooters.

Shortactionsmoker: Your "shop's" situation is way, way, WAY more more "fortunate" than the three shops in my SW Montana town!
No American made 22 rimfires for nearly three months now!
I wonder what the difference is?
At a recent gunshow one "trader" surmised that "with the "Republican" win upcoming, that 22 ammo will once again be commonplace on store shelves"!
We'll see - I surely wouldn't bet on that premise.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

VG,

If you checked a couple of websites for rimfire ammo every time you logged onto the Campfire, you'd find a more than during all your driving around. Though I have seen quite a bit on store shelves during the past month or two in my part of Montana during the past couple of months.

I suspect that even if there bug Republican gains in the election (and I bet there will be), shooters will still be buying "affordable" rimfire ammo anytime they can find it. It's gotten to be almost a knee-jerk reaction by now.

I have been able to put in what I think I will need for the rest of my life, Im 60 now... I have 2 bricks (Eley) of sub sonic HP's for tree rats and many 100's rounds of Wolf and S&K for target shooting. My 52's love the stuff. As a boy I could count on yellow bricks of Winchester super X HP's under Christmas tree. My GrandDad kept telling me to use shorts on the river tree rats, its all about the noise and dead is dead. I use subsonics now... Its the sticker shock that has me bumfuzzled.... I got by on fed Automatch as a good all round bulk,plink ammo, 14 bucks for 325 rounds at wally world, that is no more, they never have it and the prices on internet sent me to the pringles cans of 500 S&K... very best WinPoor

I picked up a 325 of Auto Match on the Internet maybe a month ago for $15 from one of the Internet sites that got a shipment. As noted above, you just have to keep checking, but it's lot cheaper to check the Internet than drive around to gun stores.

You sure burn alot of gas.......



(It's on the shelf for sale at the 2 stores I happened to be in on Sunday)
CCI even has some in the company store again.


Good Luck

I haven't seen a .22 shell for sale around here in six months. Oh ya, you can find them at the gun shows at a premium price.

Plenty online this morning. Anywhere from $.06 per round all the way up to $.40 per round. Been buying a bit when I find it at "good prices" in preparation of gifting my grandson a 22 rifle for christmas.
Was planning on a Ruger 10/22 but think a bolt action makes more sense these days for a young man. Will slow down ammo usage at least.

For the past year the only time I've bought "standard grade" .22 Long Rifle was when the brick price was $35 or less, and the only reason I paid that much was the panic wasn't fading a year after the election, thanks to so many people buying every box they found at any price. (Of course, I've paid for than that for target ammo, but still rarely pay much more than $60, the "gun show gouger" price for ordinary stuff.)

One thing I'm wondering is how many shooters who haven't seen .22 Long Rifle on store shelves have asked the people in the store if they have any. I know for a fact that some keep a supply in the back, so every panicker doesn't automatically grab it off the shelves whenever they find it out. As noted earlier, one local store has 10 cases of hollow-point ammo in back, but only for regular customers who haven't been grabbing everything they find out.

Although the rimfire ammo shortage seems to be abating, the tinfoil shortage seems to be holding.

Shooters created this shortage by allowing themselves to panic like a bunch of sheep. This has been a self inflicted and completely avoidable situation.

A buddy bought them at Black Sheep last Saturday.....in your town.

I just keep stealing them from friends.




Travis

So true..

Bunch of .22 Long Rifle bricks in a local store again yesterday. I'm friends with them but didn't steal it, or even buy any.

bought some (3box limit) at Academy sports last month...first I have seen on a retail shelf in 2 yrs.

Luckily, I had a good supply bought up prior to the crunch.

dave

I saw those bricks in a local gun store, and bought one! And it was a brick of 1000, too.

That's where I'm at John. I know there are a lot of guys around here with kids that want to shoot their 22lr's and have had a hard time finding ammo. I've donated a brick of 22 target ammo to the local club, gave away countless bricks to friends with kids and even gave one of my friends a brick to sell at his yard sale. He recently had back surgery and was selling a lot of his stuff to pay for it. He did sell the brick for $50.00 at his yardsale, but I think people felt sorry for him and his condition right now. We will see more 22 lr on the shelves. I am glad to say I've never paid scalpers prices and I never will. The hoarders probably have enough ammo that it's coming out of their ears by now and more and more people are unwilling to pay high gunshow and scalper prices, so the scalpers will eventually drop their prices as soon as the shelves start to fill. That or they can choke on it...

I agree with you. It was a domino effect. Supply and demand with panic thrown in. Scalpers taking advantage, hoarders buying everything they could get their hands on. It's wise to keep a minimum of 10 bricks on hand in any case, so if this happens again we will be more prepared. I had plenty on hand before the supply went south, but I know many people that didn't...

With the success at the polls, I would expect that the shelves will soon be creaking under the load of .22 ammunition (and the price of gas will drop precipitously).