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I loaned my current backpack to my brother in law and he really likes it. I think I'll let him keep it. Least I can do for all his support bringing horses for our hunt this year. Now I am looking for what to get. I was able to get all my stuff for a backcountry hunt into mine which is 4800ci with an additional 3500ci bag attached for the trip in. My desire is for volume to haul camp in, lightweight, compresses down nicely for day pack (hunting) use and good capability hauling up to ~100lbs of meat/hide/rack.





I am really interested in the Paradox, but looking at the website they have the Unaweep and the Evolution. Which is better for elk hunting and why? I don't think I need the freighter pack option. My first guess is a Unaweep, 4800, side zipper. Thinking I would add the dual Talon. Sound reasonable?

Also looked at the Stone Glacier or Kifaru. Lot more coin, what's it going to do that I can't with the Paradox?

My 4800 Unaweep with side zip and Hydro Talon comes in at 3 lb 1 oz in the Cuben fabric, I still have an Evolution but I brlueve the Unaweep will do it all for me.

Perfect, thanks Ed T. One of your stoves will be part of my load. Love that thing!

At first I thought that was a J.O.B., a little messy but I will pass you!

I really want to like the Paradox. In fact, I like almost everything about it and if 95% of my hunting wasn't with a bow I would own one. Quiet matters at 25yds.

I still might get one for my annual elk/rifle hunt.

The 4800 Unaweep is on my radar. How noisy is it?

Vendor, User , Designer , whatever I will give a pretty unbiased answer, or try at least.

In really cold weather , Cuben is noisy as are most XPAC materials. The soft hand Coyote VX21 is not bad at all IMO. I've been out skiing 3 days in a row, with a 4800 Unaweep , Coyote / Side Zip in tow and I have not been like wow it's noisy and I don't think I have been in a temp above 15 F. As a plus the soft hand coyote is a little lighter than a standard vx21.

If noise matters, the Coyote VX21 is pretty good IMO, especially in the cold. Obviously , sub freezing and bow hunting are not really in the same environment. Above freezing, I think most (Cuben , any XPAC ) are fine when worn. Perhaps not a quite as a soft fleece or wool when struck by a branch but no louder than a Cordura IMO or not much louder.

In summary, at least as a user, above freezing, none are much different than Cordura , below freezing some get real loud, and some (Coyote) do not.

As for sizing / style from a user perspective. I gravitate to the Unaweep 4800 Side Zip a lot. I have a Cuben 3900 no zip, I have Evo's etc but IMO , the EVO with a talon only is not large enough for off season / winter stuff on it's own. With a pack bag, they are both about the same, except the Unaweep is lighter. The side zip is handy for day access and thus the 4800 gets the call even on day skiing trips when a small little pack is just not enough.

Packing animals, I packed 4 with the Unaweep this year. The Evo allows you to use the load shelf which is a positive, but in my cases, I either put it in the pack bag or compressed it between the bag and talon and got camp on the next load, or put camp outside the pack and meat inside. I stuck the unaweep bag in the washer, no detergent and ran it and stuck it in the sun and it looks like new.

Everyone has their own style and what they prefer. For me, I end up gravitating to a certain setup most of the time.
Kevin

Kevin, you mention the Coyote being quiet. You do have the grey in the same material? Coyote is the brown color right?

What you describe for hauling meat is what I envision. I just put the meat bag in a trash bag and slide it in the pack for the trip and then remove from the trash bag to hang.

Another thing that has bothered me the last couple years is that my old pack would extend above my shoulders enough to make working through branches more difficult (noisier) than desired. All the elk I find are in really thick stuff. How far does the Unaweep with a 4800 extend upwards? Have a picture? This would be while hunting and thus the pack nearly empty and cinched down.

Also, on another note, I have a BCS Tipi, and would really like to upgrade to the BCS 2 with two doors. Can an original BCS be modified?

Thank you Kevin.

Good info Kevin.
Especially regarding the different materials at different temperatures.
Thanks

I'm going to get festive here in a few and cook up some Elk for friends, so anything else will be later this week

BCS can not be modified to a BCS 2 sorry.

You an use extensions on extending above shoulders. I am 6'1 and a 24 inch frame is fine but for big loads above 60 a 26 inch is better. If you are 5'7" obviously a 24 may be sort of big in relation to branches. This is where the EVO has an advantage, you can trim the frame to 23 or 22.5 if you wish for non load hauling and be ok.

Gray is "technically" the same, but not soft hand. Different finishing method on the fabric. FWIW , I anticipate having a lighter gray that is a bit more quite at some point, but I am not 100 percent sure at the moment.

Coyote is the brown. There are photos in the shopping cart. It is almost exactly the same as the "Redwood Brown" tents. It is not the Tan .. which there are a few photos floating around of. Of topic, the Tan is not a bad pack fabric in it's own right, but just wasn't popular enough. It's not great for rock climbing / scree / talus , but not that much is that is lightweight.

I am very happy with my Paradox Evo. Cut 5lbs of weight from my old crewcab.

5lbs.

Put lots of miles on the pack this year, hauled out 2 elk with a partner and have packed camp a couple times as well.
I opted for a 4800 bag and base talon, both in vx42.
The bag was a bit noisy at -18, same for the snow, shell mittens, and gaiters. Not noticeable in milder weather for a rifle hunter.
Not a factor for me at all where/how I hunt, YMMV.
I have hauled some huge drybags with the Evo and talon, the flexibility to do so is nice and was the reason I chose the Evo over the Unaweep.
Well worth the money for a VERY light system.

Appreciate it. Happy New Year!

I got the Seek Outside Evolution with the 3900 bag, the talon with space inside, and the lid which adds A LOT of space. On summer hunts I can drop the bag and just use the lid and talon for gear. The 3900 bag seems pretty huge to me - I can't see why anyone would need more space. But we do not put meat in the bag either. We use game bags and tuck the meat under the talon (see photo).

And it carries heavy loads really well. I carried a couple of deer and a couple of elk this past fall. One of my loads was in the 160 pound range (for only a 1/2 mile or so thank god).

The Evolution is a really good pack and I've used a lot of different packs. I've used everything from a Bullpak (really BAD suspension but strong), a Kifaru Longhunter hauler (great suspension but fell apart), to a Granite Gear Stratus (amazing pack but heavy), and even a few others but those were the last 3.

I'd go for the evolution over the unaweep for the added versatility.

I am trying to attach a photo of me with an elk front quarter in the pack. In the photo I've dropped the bag - just the lid and talon on the pack. I took out a hindquarter and my gear in the bag on the first load. This photo was taken at the end of the second trip - hence the rack on the other pack (an adapted unaweep).

prm, forget the "hunting packs" and go direct to those that got it right first.

Get a 90's Dana Terraplane or Astralplane.

Get a 90's Osprey Vector Silhouette or Xenith (I like the early 2000's Crescent's in 75 liters or less too).

Get a 2000's Arcteryx Bora 80 or 95.

That's about all you need to know about comfortable packs with 100 lbs... but the truth is, "comfort" is relative at 100 lbs.

Kifaru makes a nice pack too, but I can't fathom spending that kind of coin when you can pick up an Arcteryx Bora 80 on ebay for around $250 that will be as or more comfortable.

Aside, the pack in your photo isn't something I'd be interested in carrying... too squatty and fat with the weight to far away from your core... just my observation. And the Stone Glacier I tried felt like a brick on my back.

Thanks Brad, I'm always open to ideas. Lots of very good reviews on the Bora 80. Why did they stop making it? Or, I should ask what did they replace it with in their lineup and why is it not as good? Yes, the pack pictured above did have the weight a bit too far back. Although, the bag attached to the back was mostly bulky but light items such as Mtn House meals. One of my issues was the way the built in scabbard allowed the main bag to pull away from the frame a couple inches. I believe they changed that in later versions though by changing the attachment point of the horizontal compression straps.

My intended use is to haul camp in about 6mi from 8,000' to 10,500' at a total weight of ~50lbs. Then hunting with it only carrying an MRE, game bags, knife(s), water, snacks, small medical kit and possibly rain pants. For that I want it as compressed as possible for moving through the thick timber. Then, if all goes well, hauling out ~230-250lbs of deboned meat and the rack in three trips. Four if I bring the hide out too. That's about all I'm comfortable carrying any meaningful distance at 10,000'+ and countless deadfalls.

Take a look at the Exo packs they look kind of interesting
Tim

I have a Bora 65 it is a great pack but it has seen better days. I also love my Dana Bomb pack although it is a little beefy.

PRM, arcteryx, like most of the pack makers, have given into the obsession of grams over comfort and have trended to lighter packs. Lighter packs are good to a point, but most just don't carry truly heavy weight like a pack with a bomber, adjustable suspension. Adjustability is paramount in an internal. That genuinely means they need to come in multiple sizes. One-size-fits-all, generally means about half or more aren't fit by it.

Get your torso measured and start looking for a Bora 80. It's about the most comfortable hauling pack I've ever used. Beefy, shapable aluminum stays, and the brilliant "outrigger stays" pioneered by Dana. No internal used for carrying truly heavy loads should be without those IMO.

The state of packs today is depressing. You can find light, but it's difficult to find comfortable. I've been trying at least one, new. light pack every year for backpacking, and I haven't found one yet as comfortable as my heavier packs.

I'm not going to quit just yet, and will likely try a ULA Catalyst, and the new Exped Thunder 70 for this year's summer backpacking, but they'll not be going hunting come fall. I'll either use my Bora 80 or Crescent 75.

My torso is ~18.5". Puts me in the top of the short or bottom of the regular sizes for the Bora 80. 5' 8" tall and 170lbs. Thinking a short would be preferred. Nothing seems to fit me exactly.