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Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 6,162
Campfire Tracker
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OP
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 6,162 |
If you're fixin' to put a hole in something, make it a hole to remember.
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 23,543
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 23,543 |
have you paid your dues, can you moan the blues, can you bend them guitar strings
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 28,387 Likes: 1 |
I like this idea - swarms of smaller, basically expendable drones since anything that flies can and will be shot down eventually. They can attack targets directly or identify and illuminate them for a larger attack craft standing by with a heavier ordnance capability or stand-off type munitions. The size of them would be adaptable to mounting on a mobile land based carrier which could be stationed just behind the lines or close to areas of combat in dispersed regions with no front line like Vietnam was or Afghanistan is today. LOCUST swarm
Gunnery, gunnery, gunnery. Hit the target, all else is twaddle!
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Joined: Jun 2003
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 42,620 |
What can you expect from an obama appointee and other idiots...?
A good principle to guide me through life: “This is all I have come to expect, standard lackluster performance. Trust nothing, believe no one and realize it will only get worse…”
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Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 6,162
Campfire Tracker
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OP
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 6,162 |
What can you expect from an obama appointee and other idiots...? I knew I could count on you. :-)
If you're fixin' to put a hole in something, make it a hole to remember.
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Joined: May 2005
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 17,133 |
Sure, always a good idea to make sure that your armed forces have a small number of options. It makes it very nice for the potential opponents too since they can use a minimal defense budget and pretty much be sure that they'll be ready to ensure the USN Power projection isn't a factor. Growing up my Dad had an extensive collection of Popular Mechanics an such from the 60's predicting the same demise. Wasn't true then. Isn't true now.
If something on the internet makes you angry the odds are you're being manipulated
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Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 4,625
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 4,625 |
Not seeing the issue with going to attacking via program. Indoctrination of a human to do anything they are ordered is close to, but not 100%, guaranteed.
"My message to my troops is if you see anybody carrying a gun on the streets of Milwaukee, we'll put them on the ground, take the gun away and then decide whether you have a right to carry it." - Milwaukee Police Chief Ed Flynn
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 56,150 Likes: 11 |
What can you expect from an obama appointee and other idiots...? I knew I could count on you. :-) KW, regale us with your expertise in combat, planning, strategy, tactics etc.
I am..........disturbed.
Concerning the difference between man and the jackass: some observers hold that there isn't any. But this wrongs the jackass. -Twain
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Joined: Aug 2005
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 15,680 Likes: 3 |
I like this idea. You could cut back the manned aircraft back =by half and replace it with twice the number of unmanned drones.
You'd still have to keep pilots and conventional transport and combat aircraft, because there are just some missions that couldn't be done any other way.
Z
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 12,192 |
So what is to be done when someone learns to jam the control systems on the drones, or even worse takes controls and turns them against us? Can't be done? Maybe not yet but anyone willing to bet their future against someones future skills? A man in the bird has hands on the stick and feet on the rudders. Difficult to take over that system.
Last edited by Tracks; 04/17/15.
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Joined: Feb 2009
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Campfire Tracker
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OP
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 6,162 |
What can you expect from an obama appointee and other idiots...? I knew I could count on you. :-) KW, regale us with your expertise in combat, planning, strategy, tactics etc. Oh disturbed one, my experience is not relevant to the discussion. In case you missed it, the point of posting this story was to solicit the views of those with extensive military aviation experience -- such as Jorge and Pugs, who I respect -- on SECNAV's comments about taking pilots out of the cockpit. I was not an aviator and I make no claims to any special martial prowess, but I did my job and served honorably, mostly forward deployed in WESTPAC and the IO for roughly 3 1/2 years, during a never-dull period of history. I make no apologies for that to you or anyone else.
If you're fixin' to put a hole in something, make it a hole to remember.
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Joined: May 2005
Posts: 17,133
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 17,133 |
I like this idea. You could cut back the manned aircraft back =by half and replace it with twice the number of unmanned drones.
You'd still have to keep pilots and conventional transport and combat aircraft, because there are just some missions that couldn't be done any other way. Correct. There are things drones do very well. long endurance Intelligence Surveillance and Recon (ISR) are sweet spots for sure. When it comes to boys in green in trouble though I want a guy looking down with eyeballs on, transport troops? No CO wants to tell a parent his child was killed by a robot aircraft software glitch. Don't think drones are cheap and they still have a lot of issues. Predator loss rate run about 10/100,000 hours. This compares to the overall Navy rate of less than 1/100,000 hours in manned aircraft. That's class A's so it doesn't include combat losses. Numbers like that mean that the technical and operational maturity of drones is still quite low.
If something on the internet makes you angry the odds are you're being manipulated
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 28,387 Likes: 1
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 28,387 Likes: 1 |
I believe part of the development is to make the UAV's autonomous or as autonomous as possible. Just point'em at what you want attacked - i.e. GPS coordinates or whatever - and they do the rest without a human pilot either in a cockpit or 5,000 miles away in a control room. No outside data link, no jamming them.
There will always be a need for manned aircraft for certain missions but for ground attack or CAS which are very high risk missions, especially with the portable anti-air capabilities available to even guerrilla forces these days, it makes sense to have a smaller, extremely maneuverable vehicle capable of G-force turns no human could stand, and without the risk of a very expensive to train pilot becoming a casualty or POW.
Gunnery, gunnery, gunnery. Hit the target, all else is twaddle!
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Joined: May 2005
Posts: 17,133
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 17,133 |
I believe part of the development is to make the UAV's autonomous or as autonomous as possible. Just point'em at what you want attacked - i.e. GPS coordinates or whatever - and they do the rest without a human pilot either in a cockpit or 5,000 miles away in a control room. No outside data link, no jamming them. That's called a Tomahawk land attack missile. They work really well.
If something on the internet makes you angry the odds are you're being manipulated
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Joined: Dec 2002
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 15,860 |
Curious on how you'd preprogram a drone for CAS...
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Posts: 56,150 Likes: 11
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 56,150 Likes: 11 |
Well, continue to stir the pot to no good end. SecNav is here today, gone tomorrow. Irrelevant as a tick on a dog's butt. Just as knowledgeable as McNamara.
I am..........disturbed.
Concerning the difference between man and the jackass: some observers hold that there isn't any. But this wrongs the jackass. -Twain
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13
Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13 |
What can you expect from an obama appointee and other idiots...? I knew I could count on you. :-) KW, regale us with your expertise in combat, planning, strategy, tactics etc. Oh disturbed one, my experience is not relevant to the discussion. In case you missed it, the point of posting this story was to solicit the views of those with extensive military aviation experience -- such as Jorge and Pugs, who I respect -- on SECNAV's comments about taking pilots out of the cockpit. I was not an aviator and I make no claims to any special martial prowess, but I did my job and served honorably, mostly forward deployed in WESTPAC and the IO for roughly 3 1/2 years, during a never-dull period of history. I make no apologies for that to you or anyone else. Don't forget to add "I think New Braunfels is awesome" to your resume. It says a LOT. Clark
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 4,625
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 4,625 |
Well, continue to stir the pot to no good end. SecNav is here today, gone tomorrow. Irrelevant as a tick on a dog's butt. Just as knowledgeable as McNamara. Over half a million Americans plus their friends and families would disagree about Robert McNamara being irrelevant.
"My message to my troops is if you see anybody carrying a gun on the streets of Milwaukee, we'll put them on the ground, take the gun away and then decide whether you have a right to carry it." - Milwaukee Police Chief Ed Flynn
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13
Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13 |
Well, continue to stir the pot to no good end. SecNav is here today, gone tomorrow. Irrelevant as a tick on a dog's butt. Just as knowledgeable as McNamara. Over half a million Americans plus their friends and families would disagree about Robert McNamara being irrelevant. How do you sustain your energy sans Bluedreaux's COCK these days? Protein bars? Clark
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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