Home Forums Gear Free Classifieds Why FFL to FFL??

My last three transfers were involved three rifles no longer made and 2 that hadn't been made in 80 years so my local shop doesn't carry them.

The still make money charging $25 for a phone call, so cry me a river.

Ken...In October we will be paying sales tax on out of state internet purchases, Amazon ect...now it was only if they had a store front in Michigan they had to collect it .....Cabelas. Thanks to that Azz Hole Snyder.

He is the enemy of retirees in Michigan forcing us to move to a tax friendly state. I retired didn't have to pay Michigan income tax on my pension also receive a property tax brake. 2 years ago he change that at a cost to my wife and me of $600 a month, plus the extra $800 a month for Obama care.

I was a FFL for 18 years always excepted from a private individual with a copy of a drivers license. If I didn't get one in the shipment or before receiving the gun it was $ 10 extra for me to chase down getting it, sure gave the buyers a incentive to make sure I received one.

There is no way that a FFL can log a gun in there book if they don't have a Drivers License or a FFL to put where it came from. If they get audited by the ATF they will be shut down on the spot. When that gun comes in the door by closing of that business day it better be on the books.

I like my middle man and the law doesn't phhucking matter. Anyone with a FFL is aware of it, they just prefer not to do it.

His shop...

Way to many business owners don't have a clue about running a business. If he can make a few dollars and get you in his store at the same time, it is a win for him. He will eventually cash in on it with some sales, assuming that he is not way out of line on his products. If not, then he will blame it on Walmart. miles

In the 'enlightened' state of California where I live, it costs at least $35 for an out of state transfer, and tax is charged on anything not purchased from an individual, including the shipping charge! And the state uses the tax revenues to bedevil gun owners at every turn. How do you like them apples? The weather's good, but the 'climate' sucks!

I asked my guy about this and the above was essentially his reply. If there's a problem later on law enforcement can make their life miserable.

When I moved to AL, I had ordered a Montana 1999 barreled action while I was still overseas. Once it was ready, I had to find an FFL to ship it to. Walked into a gunshop, explained that I was brand new to the area, explained about the barrel action and wanted to know if I could transfer it there. He gave me the answer that since I didnt order it thru him, he wouldnt accept it. Tried to tell him that HE couldnt order it. He refused, because it didnt pay the bills for him.

You know how much money I spent in that shop in over 6 years? None

Found a local pawn shop that was full of gun guys, lots of new stuff in the rack. No hassle what so ever on transfers, ever. I got to know them by name and they knew me by name. Ordered quite a few guns thru them and bought a few used guns from them as well. They always let me know that they appreciated my business.

The shop that acts like the $25 transfer fee is easy money in their pocket and welcomes the business, will get me in the store buying stuff. Because, eventually, buying a new gun locally will be the same price when transfer fees and shipping are added in to an online purchase.

When its a used gun that isnt made anymore or just something that a local shop cant compete with, 25-30 bucks for a phone call and 10 minutes worth of paper work is better than 0 dollars.

I have local FFL's that receive from individuals but charge a large fee to receive since they are in the business of selling guns not receiving them for free.

You just have to shop around for one that is the best deal, right now $35 plus dros is the lowest around. They will do up to three guns at a time so I bunch up my purchases. Just tell the wife I have to buy three guns to save money

Does that actually work out for you??

Robert-
Sad but true in New York. All handguns are listed on an individual's pistol permit. So let's say you want to buy a handgun from your friendly local dealer and already have a pistol permit. You pay the dealer, he will give you a sales receipt showing the serial number, but no gun. You take the receipt to the county clerk, stand in line, pay the fee and the clerk will add the pistol to your permit and give you a coupon. Take the coupon back to the dealer, give him the coupon and show him the amended permit an then get your pistol. If you sell, the dealer will give you a receipt and you use that to gave the clerk remove the gun from your permit.

It's really a bit more complicated. For example, you really want all your handguns on your wife's permit, because otherwise when you die the state can end up wit your handguns. So that adds another trip to the clerks office and Moore schedule coordination.

It's all worth it though - there is no crime in New York as a result.

Mark

This is the issue some run accross you have to put in the bound book where the gun came from

I only go by what my experience has been and what the receiving dealer requests from me when I ship. If they don't request it, they don't get it. Not really my problem, as long as the buyer gets their gun.

As far as the tax- Michigan can beg and plead with the national big sellers like Amazon, but ultimately, it's up to the dealer. If Amazon refused to collect MI sales tax, it wouldn't happen. And I guarantee there will be no agreement with Joe's gun shop in Podunkville or any other gun shop out of state. If the gun is from an individual, it is not taxable either.

Sellers are also required to pay income tax on firearm sales based on their cost basis. How often does that happen???

A couple of points.

1. The receiving FFL has to have the potential new owner fill out 4473, then call it in, to get the approval for the transfer. Any serial number issues will arise from this call

2. The 4473 does all the tracking the firearm will ever need. A copy of a photo ID, such as a DL will suffice for ID of seller. Now do people and can people use a fake DL, sure, but that is a lot of BS to sell a gun that may be stolen or not reported being stolen yet. Along with that UPS and USPS require a photo ID to ship a gun.

Well, I'm glad I know my guy. He is beyond easy to work with and charges $15 for transfers. He has quite a bit of business but he is not a big retail store.

I agree with the comments about some people not knowing how to run a business. A shop that gets hung up on a transfer either does not have enough product to choose from other than guns or just doesn't have a clue about retail. The biggest challenge for a retail store is getting people in your store. Hell, offering the transfer for free with purchase of something in the store is smarter than pissing people off with a greedy, short-sighted business model like "If I didn't order it I don't receive it". That attitude drives people away.....

The call in check gives no specific gun information other than "handgun" or "long gun". Any model or serial number info is retained on the form. This may be different in states that have their own check system.

When I moved to a new town 15 years ago, I was psyched that there was a gun shop in town. I anticipated happy hours of browsing, yakking, buying. At the time, I wanted to get a Colt Lightweight Commander and send it to a great 1911 smith I knew to get it tricked out to suit me. The LGS of course did not have one, but I found one in another state for a good price and had the LGS do the transfer. For $70. I was gobsmacked but at that point I didn’t want to hunt around for another FFL.

When we did the transfer, he started running the gun down, its condition (which was excellent for my purposes), the magazine... I’m thinking, you peckweed moron, who cares about the magazine? I’ll never use it anyway, I’ll buy a boxful of Wilson’s or McCormick’s.

The shop owner’s business model was that over time, as I proved myself to be a loyal customer and bought from him, he would lower future transfer fees, and eventually maybe waive them entirely.

Well, that’s one way to develop a relationship. My perspective was that if he charged me reasonable fees for opening a box, filling out paperwork, and making a phone call, I’d feel good about the place. I’d feel like he wanted my business. Feeling good about the owner and his business meant I would spend more time there and buy from him, and even be willing to pay more sometimes because I liked the place. That’s a relationship.

His business model worked out real well in my case. Fifteen years of buying guns and ammo and reloading components and scopes and accessories and cleaning supplies—I spent every penny somewhere else. In fact, I've got a couple of items on order right now, waiting for ATF paperwork. Could have done the transfer with the LGS. Nope. I’m going to drive 90 minutes each way to go through another FFL.

bws

In my parts it's a liability issue very very hard to find an FFL that will accept anything from a non-FFL. Also cost about $90 to do a full transfer then you have sales tax. Handguns are the worst, has to be on the accepted "list". Be thankful that you do not have to deal with this BS everywhere.

.... where is Bricktop when you need him.......?? He should have some encouraging words on the subject. ;-)
I don't blame an FFL for whatever rules they want to have..... of their own chioosing. There seem to be plenty of FFL dealers around these parts. If I don't like one, another may suit me. My favorite just moved, but I may go back to him once he gets settled in. I told him he was too cheap.... losing $$ on every transfer isn't a good business model. Unless he likes working for $8 an hour.

Two ffl holders locally require it to come from another ffl holder. One says it is the law. I quit buying new guns from him after arguing about it. Another said he knows it isn't the law, but the local ATF agent made it clear she wanted it done that way.

Instead of them, I drive 40 miles and use a small town hardware store that has a big gun selection. He says the $10 transfers ( yes, $10) is the easiest money he will make all day. Because of that, he also sells me bullets and powder and bolts and plants and rat poison and gun cases and whatever else can be imagined from a small town hardware store. He said he knows what the local ATF chick can want , and that she can keep wanting but isn't going to get it.

It is easier and cheaper for me, an individual seller, to ship it dealer to dealer due to the UPS and USPS rules. Besides the home based business I use is easy to deal with and I don't have to deal with any legal issues.