Home Forums Reloading Big Game Rifles With todays new bullets, what role does bullet weight play today?

I've been loading 7mm-08 for three different rifles for a few years now. I'm now starting to develop loads for my new Browning BAR 7mm-08 and need you to help me think think this through. In the past, I've basically been a "Heavier for caliber" kind of guy, thinking this benefited penetration. (I like two holes) Now it doesn't seem to me that weight plays near as big a role as it use to and my focus is shifting toward accuracy above all else. (Please straighten me out if I need it :-) )

Given all of the new bullets on the market today, for a given caliber, what role does bullet weight now play in the scheme of things? It seems that now there are lighter weight bullets that now can do what it took heaver bullets to do in the past.

For example, the 7MM 120gr Nosler Ballistic Tip is one of the highly lauded bullets on these forums, with many many examples of excellent accuracy, deep penetration and deadly performance. At the same time there are much heaver 7MM bullets that accomplish the same thing.

So.... given equal accuracy, trajectory (under 300 yds), and performance.. what would lead you to pick a lighter vs heaver bullet, or vice versa? What's the trade off?

Looking forward to hearing your thoughts!
firstshot

If performance will be the same and you're happy with it then accuracy of the heavy light bullet in your rifle.

I still don't think you can really beat the 140BT/139IL/140PT trio in the 7-08 - if you like variety.

Well, if you're limiting yourself to 300 yards, then there really is no reason to go with the heavier rounds. The benefit of the heavier round is it extends the range and keeps its energy at longer distances. If you want to extend your range, then the heavier rounds are your best choice.

Thanks Rusty815

The absolutely most accurate bullet I've loaded in 3 different 7mm-08's is the Hornady 154gr Round Nose. They clover leaf at 100 yds if I do my part and they are absolutely devistating on Deer and Hogs. I'm getting 2,830 fps muzzle velocity out of them with my 22" barreled BAR and H414. Sighted in 1" high at 100, I'm 2" low at 200 and 5 1/2" low at 250 which is no prob for where I hunt here in central Texas.

I will stick with this as my main hunting load for now, but I love to reload and will do my due diligence working up other loads for my new BAR with focus bing on accuracy.

Thanks again for the input!!
firstshot

if everything else is the same, recoil will be noticeably less with the lighter bullet.

More speed is more better on deer sized critters.

FirstShot -

That is the coolest animated avatar ever. Looks like a CT NPTG, except the partition is a bit far back. Surprised I've never seen/noticed it before.

Back to the original topic -

Old school thinking was a higher SD (weight) yields greater penetration.

I'd be real interested in a test of TSX or TTSX that looked at penetration vs weight for a given cartridge. Let's say .30-06 with a 110, 130, 150, 165 and 180 gr bullet, just to see if the conventional thinking still pans out.

Nothing has changed. Only the hype. The little additional velocity that the lighter bullets gives you does little for lethalness nor trajectory. A well kept secret is the 154gr round nosed bullet in the 7-08. It is a HAMMER. And out to 300 yards, it gives nothing away to a spitzer for trajectory.

It still comes down to inertia, weight X velocity. To my mind penetration isn't the major factor so the bullet design and BC doesn't matter that much upon impact. Bigger IS better!

While the 154 gr round nose is a good bullet in the 7mm's it's gotten a little difficult to get them. I believe that's another one that hornady has dropped. Building a load on an obsolete bullet is maybe not the best use of time. Unless one has good stockpile of them.

You are not thinking clearly about why the lighter mono-metals are so superior to your round nose bullet. Stick a 120 grainer and that round nose bullet into an STW at maximum velocity to see what the hype is all about. You hit even a deer at full throttle and it will disintegrate. I know from personal experience. You hit an elk in the shoulder at fifty yards with a velocity of 3,550 feet per second and you will get a dead elk and an exit wound.

They are getting hard to get. Called Hornady today and was told that the 7mm 154 RN's have in fact been discontinued. So... I started my stockpile by ordering 400 of them.

At <300 Yds the 154gr RN gives up nothing on trajectory; however, they drop like a stone after that. I use a Ballistic Plex reticle & sighted in .5" high at 100 here is what it looks like. With the B-Plex aim points I'm basically dead on out to 300 Yds


I've been hunting with these for several years and terminal performance has been exceptional. A bunch of dead dear and hogs, most of which were DRT. I have never recovered one of these. All shots have been complete pass throughs. Got two pigs with one shot weekend before last. Pig#2 moved into path of Pig#1 just as I fired. Bullet went through the head of Pig#2 and then through neck of Pig #1.

I am working up some "Longer" range loads though. Starting with the 140gr Accubond. Am also ordering some of the 120gr NBT's (which I belive I can push to about 3,200 FPS) so I can see first hand what all the small/fast "hype" is about. :-)

I'll stick with the 154 RN "Hammer of Thor" as my main hunting load, but it is good to have alternatives.

Thanks to all four your input
firstshot

Hey Ringman.... we're talking 7mm-08 velocities. I can't speak for the 120BTs as I've never shot them and don't know how they would hold up, but the Hdy 154RN definitely was not designed to be shot at STW velocites and I totally agree with you that it would totally disintegrate at those speeds. It works great as intended though!

Regards
firstshot

What Klikatarik said! powdr

I'm thinking quite clearly thank you. I don't believe the 154gr RN was designed for velocities in excess of 3000fps. But what it does, it does well. FWIW, I've never shot an elk with a mono bullet nor have I shot an elk with the bullet going in excess of 3000fps (at the muzzle). But, guess what, in every case, I got a dead elk with two holes in him. I'm sure the non-shooting fellows hanging around the water cooler are really impressed with the velocity of your whizzum.

Assuming your preface is true and you are not looking for agreement with a preconceived notion.

Two holes are a very notable characteristic of all the copper bullets. Remarkably so compared to cup and core bullets.

That penetration combined with equally notable killing ability across the board for the copper bullets of significantly less weight is an indication that weight plays a very different role today. Simply put, those little light copper bullets going fast consistently do an outstanding job. For example, there is little to no difference between an 85 grain TSX out of a .270 and 150 grain TSX out of a 270 inside 300 yards when it comes to shooting deer. Having put enough 80/85 grain copper bullets through deer with a .243 I know they'll work just fine on bigger things and still make two holes. I literally cannot see any difference in the holes an 80/85 grain TSX/TTSX makes through deer and the holes a 150-168 grain TSX/TTSX out of a 300 WM makes. They go all the way through even when very long penetration distance is necessary and they tear up what they go through.

In 7mm leaving range beyond 300 yards out of the equation there is no earthly reason other than hunting in 30 MPH or more winds to want anything heavier than the 120 grain TTSX for deer. If a 90/95 grain TTSX was available, it'd be even better.

As long as you can hold a bullet together, more speed kills better. I have yet to see a copper bullet come undone and I have used them at speeds of 3600 FPS and shot deer at 25 feet at those speeds. I do know of one bullet that lost at least one petal like that. I cannot say that I did not lose petals on any other bullets, but I have no evidence of that happening and I have examined a lot of deer shot with copper bullets. Some of those deer had a lot of bone crunched.

The fact that the people shooting deer with .224 cal 53 grain bullets don't recover bullets any more readily than anyone else and the "holes pictures" they post look the same as much larger calibers tells me that the answer to your question is the only role left for bullet weight is to buck wind a little better and carry speed a little longer. Inside 300 yards, those are much, much smaller considerations in most hunting.

I have to find the quote, but the late Finn Aagaard once said something along the lines of that once you have sufficient weight to penetrate the vitals any more weight adds zero to killing power.
Finn always made a lot of sense.

Lou

stillbeeman,

You posted you didn't understand all the hype about the light bullets. I tried to help you understand. It sound like you sitll don't.