I don't own any AR's or such (yet) but do own semi auto shotguns. How likely is it that the government could take someone's semi's.

How were semis ("assault rifles") handled under the last ban? Could you transfer ownership?

If it was preban, you could buy and sell it. You just couldn't buy the new ones, or mags for them, which were reserved exclusively for cops, agents, and soldiers, and marked as such at the factory.

No, I do not.

I don't think it would even be possible.

No gov. in there right mind would go about confiscating millions of weapons. That would pretty much trigger the response that many of those gun owners purchased them for in the first place. As protection from a oppresive gov. that has far exceeded whatever tiny amount of power given to it by the Constitution.

Who said they'll even have luck reinstating the "assault weapons" ban?

One step at a time.

Though if they do, I hope the confiscate every last semi in the USA. Will create a backlash AND show the IGNORANT ones that don't care for ARs, but want to keep their 1100s what the real goal was.

Wouldn't have to confiscate them. Just declare their possession a felony.

"When guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns"

Paul

Lets see...
350,000,000 fireams divided by 5000 employees of the ATF.
Uh my calculator says there aint enough hours in the day to get it done by the end of the century...SOOOOOOOO... Im gonna say NOPE!

I think they would go after ammunition first. Look what they have done to cigarettes because they think people shouldn't smoke.

I'm betting that's the route they'll take.

With the EPA running around doing whatever it pleases,..they'll try to classify lead and copper as dangerous substances and ban its use.

Limiting the amount of ammo one purchase's will be the 1st step if anything changes imo.

the cat is already out of the bag. Pandora's box opened long ago. There are probably better than 100 million firarms in America.
No freaking way they can be 'rounded up'.........

Exactly. As I told my wife, confiscating even an unrealisticly high 95% of the guns in existance wouldn't stop the rampages by the crazy and demented. If a $500 gun today would cost $5,000 on the black market then, that's not even a speed bump for a lunatic who plans to not even be alive tomorrow. Those guys aren't exactly known for worrying about blowing the monthly budget when locating supplies for committing horrible crimes against humanity. That all assumes that such an individual would still be interested in using a firearm for such a thing, as opposed to a high-speed automobile or a 5 gallon can of gasoline. Man could never pass enough laws or ban enough items to keep true wack-jobs from trying to take out lots of people. It's just not feasible.

Yes I do and more then so AMMO..

How do they know who has what, and stock up on reloading components.
I just bought LOTS of powders and primers yesterday.
Enough to reload for the rest of my days. No need to worry about feeding my toys now.

Another thing they'll try is to get the Treasury Sec. to reclassify everything as a "destructive weapons".

Remember what Lloyd Bentsen did in 1994 when he successfully changed the classification of the Street Sweeper shotgun.

He did it all with the stroke of his pen and totally circumvented Congress.!

There was no argument, no dissent. It was sign and done, just what the Dems want.

And since they were [b][color:#3333FF]successful at it once[/color][/b], there's precedence for them to try again...

Remember what you are doing though.. basically you are saying in so many words, screw everyone else, I'm gonna protect myself.

And like I've told others if things get banned and then told to turn in but you refuse like many will.. what real good will it do you because you can't make noise or get caught at that point, you'll be a felon in jail. The only thing they can be used for is an attempt to overthrow.

What should be done is keep the pressure on. No bans, no taxes, no limits, just enforce the laws you have out there RE murder and such. Damn novel idea, but I kinda suspect it might work.

And I"m not singling you out, just saying too many think, hey if I buy it before the "ban" I"m good. All you have to do is look at history and other countries to know that may not be the case at all.

And I feel for those in panic buys right now.... market rules and that sucks. Me.. i"mt rying to build a suppressed 300 whisper.. it'll suck for me too, cept I have some of the major parts.... but I'll even get hammered trying to buy an M4 stripped upper I bet....

There are a lot more than 100 million firearms in this country. And of course, that decreases the feasibility of any confiscation plan. It decreases the feasibility of any plan given the large public outcry (and subsequent voting at the next election).

I seriously doubt the Democrats will be satisfied with the previous ban. It really didn't take anything off the street. Maybe the Street Sweeper I suppose. On the other hand, it's not a certainty they have enough votes just to pass the previous ban again.

But that large an amount of weapons could be taxed out of existance, and or ammo priced so high with "safety" taxes like cigarettes taht you could never afford to own or shoot....

State and local PD's could surely be tasked with the job, and perhaps even a million newly hired TSA-style agents.

I am not saying its going to happen, but there are ways that would break the backs of all but the staunchest hold-outs. And they'd be on the news as right wing kooks.

Again, not agreeing with it, but its not like the media would raise a stink.

Its doable.

I think we are closer to confiscation, that at any time in our history.

http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-...ult-Weapons-Ban-On-First-Day-Of-Congress

no and they'll never use your SSN as an identification tool

nor monitor the transfer of cash


nor read your emails


nor spend us into oblivion

you boys have a lot more faith in what this gov't will do and won't do than I do

yep that's right, there's a load of doo-doo when it comes to what our gov't will and won't do

Every state and local Police Officer I know is a registered republican and a NRA member. Its not going to be that easy and the antis know it.

yep that's right, there's a load of doo-doo when it comes to what our gov't will and won't do
-----------------------------------------
And then there's the point that it ceases being my government.

Here's my opinion..

First, after they pass SOME SORT of assault weapons ban [they have before, and they will again,] if not this time, eventually.. but I am going to say that this most recent tragedy involving 20 little ones is going to be the straw that broke the camels back.

Once the bill is enacted.. you will have so long to voluntarily hand them over to the nice BATFE agent seated at every county courthouse, or some such.. "and we will grant you amnesty and give you a $50 Wal-Mart gift card!!!" ..exactly what happened in Australia and the UK.

Take that what? 80 million gun owners, and lets say that one third own an assault rifle or high capacity pistol magazines for conversation sake.. though that seems a bit high.

Of those 26 million assault weapon owners, or owners with high cap mags for their pistols, subtract twenty million who will hand them in no questions asked. Take the remaining 6 million, and once the arrests for possession begin to happen, you are going to been down to tens, or at best, several hundred thousand who say 'come take them!'

...and then they will 'come take them!"

A few new prisons will open to incarcerate the remainder of media hyped, villain-ized felon assault weapon owners and, no doubt, a few errant shoot outs with police killing the newly appointed felons that refuse to comply and wah-la! No more assault weapons.

It's pretty much that simple. The Brits and Aussies caved upon realizing that their lives and their family's lives could be ruined upon discovery of an item that you can't even use anymore without drawing attention to yourself.. as will most, if not all Americans.

We are powerless.. the stroke of a pen and bye-bye high capacity magazines and assault weapons.

..another stroke, bye-bye to the Remington Model 8 pappy gave you because it's semi-automatic.

..another stroke, bye-bye to ownership without some ridiculous fee or tax on either the guns or ammunition [think Class III items now..]

..another stroke.. the REAL question is, where will it end?

Thinking it won't happen, NOT HERE! This is America! ..or "those guys don't want to be voted out of office!" ..look at the unpopular stimulus, Obamacare, all of these incredulous EPA regulations, and so on.. PUBLIC OUTRAGE!!! We are going to vote them out!!! ...for a whole week. A couple episodes of Honey Boo Boo later, your favorite team wins the Super Bowl, or some catastrophe or natural disaster strikes, and 99.9999% of people either forget, or move on while grumbling about it.

I'm not trying to be a pessimist, it's just reality. It's a matter of time, and I think our time is about up as gun owners.

More blood dancing.
The real problem here is mental illness. Loughner was a nut, Aurora was a nut, this Adam dude was a coconut. Most of these people are crazy.
Remember that America de-institutionalized hundreds of thousands in the 1970s. Most were not violent, at least not on meds. But a whole bunch of unintended consequences resulted.
The problem with mentally ill people goes right to the heart of our liberty. As John Adams said, the Constitution fails if Americans are not moral citizens with self-restraint.
Mentally-ill people don't have that self restraint, therefore they cannot be "moral" and fully cognizant of their responsibilities as citizens.
Then there is the larger issue of whether citizens truly understand their responsibilities. We aren't teaching Americanism in school, the moral side of liberty. The religious institutions that inculcate moral self restraint in people are playing less and less of a role in shaping citizens' outlooks and bolstering their moral strengths.
This is an incredibly complex concept for people to grasp, and not enough "get it" any more. If we do not focus on the need for moral behavior from citizens in a free republic, including a recognition that certain forms of mental illness lead to amoral as well as immoral acts that put liberty itself at risk, then America itself, the very idea of self governance, is toast.
I am not quite ready to concede that.

I agree, wholeheartedly, with your entire post.. very well written sir.

Mental illness is, along with just about everything else, a sensitive topic these days. Prior to deinstitutionalization, as you pointed out, anyone having a mental illness that could not be relied upon to regulate their own behavior was simply locked away. Whether or not that was appropriate, well, books have been written on the subject, but one comment you made really touched home.

Most mentally ill people who commit crime HAVE been, either through a doctor or the courts, deemed mentally deficient.. and the �fix� is medication. Property medicated, they are productive members of society, and generally, good, well meaning people. The problem is, there is no way to �force� them to take their meds, and many people just stop, either because they can no longer afford them, or more frequently, they stop because they are feeling better, and believe that they no longer need them.
They commit a crime, occasionally, a heinous crime, and, quite frequently, because they HAVE been deemed mentally ill, they are excused from any punitive measures, remedicated, and released back into society where they reoffend; it�s cyclic.
Where I used to live, the neighbor across the street, a 50 some year old woman, who lived alone, and was SERIOUSLY schizophrenic, would about every six months, quit taking her meds because she felt fine. On her meds she was the quiet lady across the street who tended to her flowers and kept to herself. Off her meds, she was a menace to the neighborhood with untold amounts of damage was committed against her neighbors in the form of broken windows, keyed cars, killed pets, scared children, ect. Once she tried to run down some school children getting off of their school bus with her car. Aside from being locked up for a night or two before her sons bonded her out, and a circus hearing where she claimed mental illness and was slapped on the wrist or outright let go assuming she would receive medical care, she received nothing. NOTHING in the way of punishment or restitution for the victims was ever adjudicated.
For the neighborhood, there was, let�s face it, no recourse. So did she deserve to be free to live a �normal� lifestyle? What was the cost to other law abiding neighbors, children, ect.?
Calling her a nutjob, or demanding her incarceration at a facility [which is impossible, long term anyhow,] or FORCING drugs into her is illegal. Anyone preaching that route is deemed �heartless.�
As far as I know, the cycle continues with her. I�m sure she�s not the only one. Political correctness is killing this country.

I agree Jeff.
They would be just like a schmeiser machine gun an old German guy tried to give me that was hidden in his basement.
There will never be total confiscation of guns.
Maybe ammo taxed to death z
Was just sayin i am not worried about feeding my toys.
Good luck coming for mine. I won't make it, but i won't go alone.

I'm with you brother. I seriously think they may have a problem if that ever happened....

Maybe we are a step closer to finding out the true meaning of the 2nd Amendment....

I will support and will defend the Constitution of the United States of America against all enemies, foreign and domestic;.... So help me God..

since they started counting (mid 50's) up till 2008 he count was somwhere in the neighborhood of 350,000,000.
As well there are 350,000,000 single family homes in the CONUS. And apartments and office buildings, storage buildings, wharehouses, ect ect ect.
There is NO WAY a force smaller than the chinese army could conduct a search. Not even if every man, woman and child were to stand in the yard with the doors open and offer ZERO resistance. Its not a realistic idea. Anyone who proposes it obviously needs a lesson in geography, math and history.



And whos going to be doing thier job while they are out going thugh peoples cubbards? Who is going to be watching the banks? Running radar to write tickets so that the state highways dont go broke?
While the cops are searching storage buildings who is going to answer the 911 calls? So while they are taking away peoples guns they are ot going to be enforcing any laws?
Really guys.
Heroin is illegal.
Cocaine is illegal.
The same dolts enforcing those laws are the dolts who would be trying to stop guns. And just like suburban grow houses sprang up the day the DEA started using choppers garage machine shops will spring up.
I assure you, that if an 11 year old arab boy in Peshwar can put an AK47 together in a tent, theres not going to be any shortage of NEW homemade firearms.

Agreed

Support and defend the constitution??? .... Better get used to being branded as a violent, hateful, extremist, radical right wing nut case. I can forsee that crap coming down the pike already. That means that YOU will be DOMESTIC enemy. Because anyone who doesn't agree with the enlightened, elite, all-knowing, all-wise, oh-so-tolerent left automatically becomes the scum of the earth.

No.

Not a military man nor politician that has not taken that oath... Treason anyone?

This right here!! It's mental illness and for some reason the politicians do not want to touch it. they are still allowing it to run rampant. kwg

Nope , if they do then i can build them and sell them on the Black Market

Sadly, I have to agree with you. I think you summed up what will happen pretty accurately.

Anything is possible. With that said I firmly believe the earth will be struck by an asteroid the size of the state of Texas before this .gov tries a comprehensive confiscation of any type weapon from the hands of private citizens.

Most people do not understand that the founding fathers gave us the second amendment to guard against the government exceeding the constitutional powers they were limited to, not so we could hunt or just plink for fun. This was such a serious issue that they made it second in the list of amendments.

It appears that the first amendment is being routed by an entrenched media that refuses to objectively shed light on issues that they favor. Our schools do not teach the constitution and the value to each individual to keep it sacred.

The need to have weapons on a par with those who have grabbed/exceeded power at a government level is critical in this regard. Therfore, at a minimum, semis must be available to all citizens to guard the constitution. It is a duty of every American citizen to defend the constitution regardless of personal loss.

Our founders put everything on the line to give us the United States of America. We have not been challenged internally as a people since the Civil War when brother fought brother. The fire to be American, as in the spirit of the Founders, appears to be dimming.

Many of our kin have given up their lives in defense of this once great nation. Will their sacrafice be in vain?

So many in this land are so far removed from understanding the principles America was founded upon, that I fear there will be few who answer the call to defend freedom.

+1

While I share your skepticism regarding the education of our children with regard to AMERICAN history, there are 300,000,000 guns in the hands of 80,000,000 private citizens. Fully 25% of our population owns one or more firearms. There are many gun organizations that seek to educate anyone who will listen about AMERICAN history and the role the 2nd Amendment plays in safe guarding us from a tyrannical government. Politicians are concerned with only one thing - getting reelected. They can count and they all remember 1994.

Oblahblah and feinswine can posture and pontificate until they turn blue in the face; we won't have an AWB near as sweeping as the one klinton got through and signed into law...if we have one at all.

Why wouldn't they seize them?

On a deep down level I would like to see them try and seize them. They might find out what the 2A was about to begin with then.

First and foremost the threat of violence from the people they were trying to seize them from, and two, they are most concerned with getting reelected.

Where was the violence from the people after Clinton's "assault" weapons ban? Other gun control laws?

Politicians weren't all that concerned in Nov about reelection. In fact, those who threaten the Second Amendment did pretty darn well, which is foreboding for the too few of us who cherish liberty.

With as close to 100% certainty as I can be, if semiautos are tomorrow decreed illegal and must be surrendered, nearly 100% of those who own them will surrender them. How many would risk a minimum of ten years in federal prison or die trying to keep them only to have them confiscated while they're being embalmed?

Better yet is to think of ways they can be seized, and I can think of plenty.

In the end, there will be a few who will die trying to keep their guns, but most will comply.

Good grief you guys. The hyperbolic drama here borders on silly'

There will be no gun confiscations nor any EOs. As I said earlier, there may be some attempt to add something clever inside the fiscal cliff bill as a rider but it dies in the House.

It's all feel good political talk based on the heat and trauma of the moment but once folks settle down and grab back their hold on reality, it will likely play out with some vanilla feel good legislation having minimal impact, if not enjoined by the fed courts or the Sup Ct.

To think a gun control EO is at the dawn is just silly.

What would you suppose is the objective of incremental gun control laws, especially considering they've had the opposite effect their intended purpose?

Why'd you change your handle,chicken schit?

What's an "EO"?

Executive Order.

Ahh...thank you.

I could almost envision so-called "assault weapons" and other heinous "weapons" du jour pushed over to the purview of NFA/Title II weapons. Not quite banned, but transfer and interstate transport would be heavily restricted.

Why haven't you answered my question?

Try to accentuate the positive...

Ask Australia if it can happen................

When your worthless ass was shown the door, that positive was accentuated.

Now, why'd you change your handle chicken schit?

Answer my question, agent provocateur!

In all fairness to my Aussie freinds, Australia let it happen.

As someone mentioned there are 300 million + guns in circulation, and an estimated 80 million gun owners...I dont think they have enough to send after us, and as for us marching down and turning our guns over....

Who showed him the door? Was he actually banned? For what? Disagreeing with you?

I knew you were the advocate of censorship. You abhor liberty and our First Amendment. And you have the unmitigated audacity of portraying yourself as a defender of freedom. Now there's no doubt in my mind that you were an Obama shill all along.

You are one of the 'fires Benedict Arnolds.

I think your wrong.

Since this comes right after an election look for an all out push on everything since they believe they have a mandate and a limited time to get it done.

That includes weapons, the ability to ship weapons and ammunition, limit the ability to buy ammo and components. Any goofy idea thrown out in the past will come out soon. Watch it.

They learned that the last AWB didn't accomplish crap and they will push the envelope even further.

I hope and suspect he's wrong.

So do I. But I'll never know...I'll be one of those who died trying....

I can hang with that. After all, it's nothing more than my opinion.

TRH,

Don't forget that via executive order, FDR got Americans to surrender their gold. And Americans complied.

Gun owners are law abiding citizens, which, of course, accords their ability to own guns. Men have to work in order to provide for their families. How many are going to risk prison in order to keep a semiauto .22?

================

Yo' dipschit, I wouldn't waste one minute of my time outside of calling you out for the dumb [bleep] you are here. It's laughable you could think you're even worth it. If you were banned, you ain't too bright when it comes to flying under the radar.

Depends on how good of a shot you are

Again, I'm not trying to rain on anyone's parade, nor am I suggesting I know everything.. but if you look at history, and you take a look at the current situation, it is hard to deny that, if not this go'round, but eventually, the forces of liberalism are going to win out and SOME sort of ban will be passed, restricting ownership to some degree [which of course will never be enough, each one of these anti-gun bills are nothing but a stepping stone to a gun free America.]

Historically, for goodness sake, look! Ask your friend Mr. Canadian how he likes shooting his handguns and his AR15's? Half of the British Police force aren't permitted to carry a sidearm.. and Australians lined up en mass to hand in their semi-autos.. and I'm sure if you could go back in time, there were discussions amongst them all that, "I'm not turning anything in!" or "Not here, they're afraid of a civil war, or being voted out of office!

As someone previously pointed out, I didn't see any large scale, or even small scale protests during the Clinton AWB? Most people complied, and if you look through the archives of most forums that were around during that ban, you will read posts such as guy's asking who makes the 'coolest looking compensator?' There isn't going to be any large scale riots or uprisings, at best, you will have a select few who resist through non compliance, and are imprisoned, or some kind of repeat of Ruby Ridge.

These liberals aren't afraid of anything. They have learned that the vast majority of this country don't care. The ones that do, assemble peacefully with their little signs and are belittled nationally by our liberal media. Our society is fed a diet of crap from the media, and our children are being indoctrinated into socialism every day in school, while you work so a healthy portion of your paycheck can support welfare drug addicts, people abusing SSI disability, people trading their food stamps for money and dope, and our government spending it on ridiculous budgets that none of us agree on. And we all take it, everyday, lying down. Ok, I'm not paying my taxes. Fine, the IRS will take everything you own, or ever will own, and lock you up for a healthy portion of your life. That's why no one 'resists' through noncompliance when it comes to taxes.

Again.. look at the way they shoved the stimulus, these bailouts, Obamacare, and all of these EPA regulations [most people don't even realize the damage the EPA has done in the past few years!!!] down our throats, as we gagged while trying to complain about it.. several weeks later, we were on to something else. Look at, most recently, this Fiscal Cliff ordeal. People complaining with enthusiasm.. I haven't seen the liberal big government spending crowds shaking in their boots. They are holding their ground, and holding it hard. They aren't budging, and they aren't going to budge on gun control legislation, just like they didn't budge on the bailouts, the stimulus, and Obamacare, where they freaking VOTED ON IT, SO THEY COULD SEE WHAT WAS IN IT!!!!

Liberals don't worry about being voted out of a liberal jurisdiction, in what is becoming a liberal country. Look at Feinstiein. Look at Harry Reid. Reelected each year without so much as a hiccup. Heck, look at OBAMA!!! On paper, it's hard to fathom how he got elected in the first election!!! BUT HE DID.

THE MAJORITY OF VOTERS DON'T CARE, OR THEY CARE FOR FIVE MINUTES THEN FORGET. These liberals know that, it's no secret, and that is how they are going to shove this piece of junk legislation up our rear ends, just as they have Obamacare, stimulus, the bailouts, the purchase of GM and Chrysler with our tax dollars, ect. It's gonna happen, and probably in 2013.

Yes.

J23,

You are 100% absolutely right on the money.

The demos stole the last election, everyone are under estimating the demos now. The door is open and they will steal another election and outlaw guns too.

http://weaselzippers.us/2012/12/16/...rack-down-on-guns-during-newtown-speech/

Form my understanding Australian's were paid generously (ie at or above market value) for thier semi-autos. Most then took the cash and bought other firearms. Incedently the sales of poly pipe and end caps was vigorus during that period

Australian firearm owners were divided over the issue of semi-autos in 96 (ie bolt guys = 'who needs one' attitude)and were defeated. We've lost them for good.

Trafficing and criminal use of illegal firearms mostly pistols is higer than ever. 14 year prison sentence for posessing a unlicenced firearm.

Now every LAFO is licenced (tested and background checked)and ensures safe storage (ie a steel safe). Licences are segregated into categories and you need a 'genuine' need for that category which needs justification. Licences are renewed every 5 years. Criminal charges such as assult or domestic violence result in instant suspension of licence and seizure of firearms.

Every firearm is recorded and tracked through a firearms registry and needs brokering through a dealer. Purchasing a firearm cost $30 (Permit to acquire) and a min of 28 days cooling off for first firearm after that as long as it takes (between 1 week to 3 months) depending on backlogs at police HQ. Each permit needs a genuine reason (if you have one .308 Win why do you need another?) and a beurocrat questions you.

Firearms amnesty are still in force here and if you have a fire arm you can take it to a dealer or police station to relieve your concience.

I have just scraped the surface, we really do have to bend over to ge a firearm here. We are told its a privelge and not a right to own one. We cant defend our homes. UK has it worse. Heres an example of the leglislation: www.legislation.qld.gov.au/legisltn/current/w/weaponsa90.pdf


Stand united and fight hard.

A photo of the Australian confiscation. Guns ariving at the smelter

http://www.unlirec.org/noticias_det_eng.aspx?id=20

You and J23 oughta' go [bleep] each other........than make a suicide pact.

Where's the goddam troll spray ?



GTC

If it's registered it's possible, they'll lean your house.

Well in most states that would require going to each and every firearm dealer and getting the original copy of the 4473 and then tracking it down thru multiple owners once it left the original point of sale.

Good luck with that, any seizure or confiscation isn't going to last long at all. A few knocks on the wrong door and they'll get pretty skittish and rethink the entire thing quickly. It won't take many and don't tell me there aren't gun owners out there with nothing to lose.

They aren't very efficient at collecting taxes either

I really hope that you are right!!!!!!

Mulga,

That it such a sad photo. I'm sure your government & the British government are advising our politicians how to effectuate confiscation. And it all begins with lies. "We only want your semiautos..."

All truth passes through three stages. First, it's ridiculed. Second it's violently opposed. Third, it's accepted as being self-evident. Our self-evident truth will be exposed when confiscation occurs in America.

That just pisses me off.....

NathanL,

As Mulga explained, violation of gun confiscation in Australia exposes the violator to a 15 year prison sentence.

I don't envision much door knocking. I envision Americans being told where to surrender their guns and the severe punishment for noncompliance. Therefore, nearly all Americans, being law abiding by nature, will report to specified kiosks in order to surrender their weapons. Further, I envision rewards for Americans who inform on their friends, neighbors, etc. who have not complied with confiscation law. Moreover, at every range I have used, I have had to record my name, which is a record of gun ownership. And then there's records of Internet purchases of ammunition and gun supplies.

I honestly do not believe it will be difficult for our government to confiscate our guns. And I don't think it will take much time to complete. Voluntary compliance will be substantial, especially under threat of long prison sentences. Just the cost of hiring a lawyer to defend an allegation of violating confiscation law will cause financial ruin to those charged. How many Americans will be willing to expose themselves to such consequences?

Just grist for analysis. I might be wrong. But I doubt it.

I still think you are wrong. Without records what is the motivation to surrender them, it might have worked in other countries where they knew where all the guns were.

So if I don't hand over my guns that they don't know I have I become a crimminal with up to a 15 year sentence...but if I keep them they have to find them via some other method in my house like a warrant. Yeah I'll play that game all day long and about 80 million other gun owners.

Of course there's a lot of people who own guns with nothing to lose. The old saying about how "when it becomes time to hide your guns - it is time to start using them".

Even if they outlaw some guns they would have to rewrite 200 years of case law about getting the information on who has them via records and sales receipts. I don't think the country has gone that far over the cliff - not yet anyway.

NathanL,

A credible informant who knows you have a gun subject to confiscation law that you have not surrendered would result in a search warrant.

NathanL, as a retired cop, I can tell you that there are many methods of obtaining information of criminality. I wouldn't rely upon records as the sole method of triggering an investigation. If your neighbor told a cop that he saw you in possession of a gun that you were supposed to surrender under confiscation law, your freedom would be momentary. If a search warrant is issued, all guns in your home will be seized as you will become a felony suspect.

Remember that in the few cases in which cops or national guard troops would have to respond to a home to seize guns from those not in compliance are following orders of those who were ordered by politicians who crafted confiscation law. I will not harm anyone, especially a cop, who is following orders, which will assuredly be issued under threat to the officer/troops. It will not be their fault your guns are seized.

We should have seen this coming a long time ago. When politicians duped us into accepting gun control compromises we should have predicted that their agenda was incremental confiscation.

To my way of looking at this, dying before your guns are confiscated ain't wise. It's a better idea to try to reverse such legislation by electing authentic American patriots who'll adhere to our constitution and restore our rights guaranteed by Madison's Second Amendment. Dying and killing people ordered to do a job they assuredly would rather not is not the right response.

As a retired cop how many doors would you knock on an execute a warrant after a few of them started shooting back when you pulled up in the driveway? That's my point. It won't take many.

Hear! Hear!

Molon Labe means more to me than just an ancient quote.

NathanL,

Please read this. I am trying to help you. If cops/national guard troops even remotely believe you pose a threat to their safety, you will not win. That, my friend, is a bankable fact. I was told by a former LAPD officer who was at he SLA shootout that another LAPD officer threw a road flare into the SLA's fortified house and burned them out. If I remember correctly, no SLA member lived. And they were very heavily armed. Cops do not die. Bad guys do.

I recently watched a Military Channel program on the British's SAS, the original special forces. They and Navy Seals are the epitome of special forces responding to deadly threats. The SAS has an incredible record of not losing. In fact, the SAS does not lose. When they are called in to action they do not take prisoners. They do not lose. How many SAS units do you think the British government would loan to Obama in order to effectuate confiscation?

If confiscation becomes law, my advice is to comply and then try to reverse it. If your response is to fight, your guns will be seized while your body is transported for autopsy.

AHHHH. my new best friedn.
I have been preaching this for years. If were gonna do this thing lets do it before I am chiting in a bag and too old to be of any use.
To add... it isnt gonna happen becasue 40% of this counties men are not able to do 10 push-ups or 3 pull-ups. They are fat lazy pieces of cowardly chit who wouldnt turn off a football game to save a child. The other 60%...well half of them would turn in thier guns if they were threatened with losing a tax write off or told thier insurance rates would go up.
I ask WHO? look around today at the "men" you see. Those guys? These people are gonna fight it out in the streets? My Black ass!
No this country is doomed becasue no body has fire in thier sack anymore.

Either you guys are watching too much TV or your starting to belive the chit tales yoursining at the gunshop counter yourself.
These Americans...If they are told that having X is now illegal and if they turn it in they can get a $400 best buy card there will be a fking line around the corner. If they are threatened with jail time they will rat out anyone they know who has them.1
This breed of "men"?
These overweight, high Bp, prediabetic, burger munchers? BS!
How many of these "men" were boy scouts? Served in the Military or police? How many people do you come into contact with that have NEVER BEEN IN A FISTFIGHT? But yet they all talk chit about what they would do if the FEDs came to take thier guns.
Right.
Aint gonna do chit is what. open the safe and stand in the yard with a smile offering coffee tea and a BJ from the wife to stay out of lock-up.
This aint fking Red Dawn and these fkers aint The Wolverines.
they'd be too busy checking facebook, playing fantasy football and checking NASCAR standing to even care.

Naaah!

They ain't gonna worry much 'bout motor bikes for a while yet.

Go back to sleep. It's only a bad dream.

Ultimately, to bring their full agenda to fruition, they believe they must eliminate effective small arms from the population at large, and have, as you say, demonstrated a willingness to ignore overwhelming unpopularity of their activities in the past when they were important to their larger objectives, i.e., ignore the will of the majority.

I'm betting they'll sure as hell try...

You know these liberals - "never let a crisis go to wasted.."


A-holes..

What you dont get is there are more than you think willing to die for our rights. Gun owners in America more than make up the largest army in all the world. We lose our right to own a gun and all is lost!

"The highest number to which, according to the best computation, a standing army can be carried in any country, does not exceed one hundredth part of the whole number of souls; or one twenty-fifth part of the number able to bear arms. This proportion would not yield, in the United States, an army of more than twenty-five or thirty thousand men. To these would be opposed a militia amounting to near half a million of citizens with arms in their hands ... It may well be doubted, whether a militia thus circumstanced could ever be conquered by such a proportion of regular troops."

- James Madison, Federalist No. 46

Madison's #46 was constrained and limited to his knowledge of existing weapons,lethal and non-lethal,in possession of the government during that era.

The principle stands, however.

I was hit by the 1988 semi auto ban after Hungerford, hit by the 1997 hangun ban after Dunblane.
All shooters where vilified by the media as perverts and killers of children. We fought and we lost. We did some of the largest peaceful demo�s in London, and brought the city to stand still a number of times, and this wasn�t covered by the media, and the little that was shown, was a very brief clip at the end of the news.
The media isn't supposed to take sides and just report, but they are only interested in sensationalised B/S.
Your NRA is more powerful than our NRA ever was, and you have to support them. You also have to support each other and all aspects of shooting. Some time shooters are their own worst enemy! Stick together, and fight as one.
We had pistol shooters in 88, saying we will be fine , they will just ban semi auto rifles, then in 97 we had shotgunners, saying �Oh, well it will only effect pistol shooters�..I needn�t worry� and they reduced semi/pump to 3 shot, they just start chipping away , first with , semi autos, then the pistols, then on ammo, then they keep doing a bit more. I've seen it in the UK and also in Australia.

This reminds me of a poem written during the 1940's by Martin Niemoller

First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out�
Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out�
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out�
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me�and there was no one left to speak for me.

Once they start chippin they won't stop. don't let them start.
Cheer's
Paul.

If they try a direct confiscation, nothing else will matter anyway.

Gunner

Sounds like the same folks who run our MSM run yours.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TkS2BRoCd2I

Steve, glad you posted that clip. I was on those protests at the start of the clip run by The sportsmans Association in 1997.
The apathy among shooters was dreadful. At the time we had a membership of our range of about 300. Out of those only 25 went to the protest and that included wives/girlfriends. Infact people still went to use the range on the day of the protests. So many thought they they won't ban hand guns, but this was just over 10 years after the ban of semi-auto rifles.
The use of handguns in crime rose by 40% in the two years after the weapons were banned in 97'
Please don't any one think it will stop with semi auto rifles.
I remember shotgunners saying they will never ban shotguns, "you have never heared of any one going on a rampage with a side by side...well Derek Bird a taxidriver from Whitehaven went on a rampage in 2010 with a 12gSG and a CZ452 .22lr, killing 12 and wounding 11.
But then again, Britains biggest serial killer was a guy called Harold Shipman, who killed over 300 people and never use a gun. He was a doctor who got a kick out of putting people down with an injection. If someone wants to kill large numbers of people they will, either with a firearm or an IED or any way they want.
Its strange isn't it , a guy goes on a rampage with a gun and and every one is calling for a ban to make the world safer, But when a guy gets on a bus with a bomb and blows it up, no one calls for a ban on Islam, or ban mosques, Its how can we be friends with these people and what can we do for them!

Looks like those guys would kill for a Laz-Y-Boy!

Yep. That is coming.

Guns are worthless with the ammo.

stumpy

I could this also. No laws needed, just reclassify "assault" weapons and high cap magazines to NFA Class II weapons. 6month wait, $200 tax stamp, STRONG background check would crush sales.

The Fed coming to get a semi auto you already own....I don't think so.

Ending future sales ------ They are going to try !!!!!!

The retired police officer is right, trying to shoot it out with LEO's coming to confiscate guns would be a very bad idea and totally unnecessary. There are hundreds of millions of us in the this country and if we united they could not put us all in jail. Hell if we all just refused to go to work or buy anything other than necessities until the nonsense stopped it would collapse the economy and the government.

I also seriously doubt that they will try and collect any existing weapons. They seem to be planning a repeat of what they did in 1994. But if it ever did come to a head, NONVIOLENCE is the only way to win.

Personally I think that they secretly want a gun nut to shoot a cop just to further their agenda which is to portray all of us as maniacs. Non violence and economic retribution would be the way to go.

Everybody needs to read what Paul 375 has to say. I believe he is spot on. He also has expienced this first hand. Hasbeen

I'm not so optimistic... I seriously doubt he'd try anything as stupid as straight out confiscation, but he'll try something. And it will almost surely be things that he can just have existing federal agencies do - legally or illegally. Bricktop's comment about the NFA is one thing that has me worried.

I suspect it will start with an another attempt to close the "gun show loophole" as well as another assault weapons ban. They will run a joint PR junket to show the scary guns that any future murderer can buy any given weekend and it will play very well with the general public. They will fortify the campaign with images from Aurora, Newtown and sadly whatever the next incident is because there will be undoubtedly be another.

As for an all out weapons ban - I for one can't see it. Who is going to take these guns by force if it comes to it? We are talking civil war here as the officers, agents and soldiers that would be relied upon for this would be opposing their own friends and family.

Taxes, licensing and permitting could cripple future sales and continued use of weapons and ammo and I can see that as being an issue. The fact that by shear #'s the Democratic party is moving towards being a strong majority.

I for one am taking a look at my current gun and ammo lineup and projecting what my future wants/needs may be so that I don't get caught wishing I would have bought "X" back in the good old days when you still could. Reloading is looking like a real good idea to me right now.

Outright confiscation won't be necessary. If legislation is passed making it a felony to own, the weapons will be turned in under an amnesty program. The majority of owners won't like it, but they'll do it anyway. Think about it - is being incarcerated worth hanging onto a weapon that cannot be used legally?

I personally think that's where it's headed. Since I don't want to be left holding the bag, I'm getting rid of my AR and M1-A ASAP. I never shoot the things anyway. Let someone else deal with it.

Well said, and spot on..

Bot, you are THE most optimistic dude I've ever known.. Somehow, you seem to trust this gov't implicitly no matter what happens..

'Vanilla feel-good' legislation is what has gotten us here today; it's called 'gun-free school zones' - in order to 'make the children safer'..

Please..


Everyone should be worried.. The Emperor has gone rogue so many times in various issues that he'll look at this as a challenge..

Amazing, isn't it?

Andy, I didn't think it was ever possible that Obummer would be elected for a second term...

that one didn't work out so well for me...

I don't trust ANYTHING attached to the government anymore... especially as long as the radical leftists are running the country...

I did a little math the other night. You are looking at 100 BILLION dollars in compensation for that property. If you think it is going to be allowed legally or morally to simply take that much property and destroy it, well, I think the law of unintended consequences may come into play if tried.

Damn, I hope not.

people in this country are predominantly too darn lazy and too self centered to ever organize and make a stand like that...

its just easier for them to complain about it afterwards and shrug their shoulders and say 'what can you do??'

heck, the public won't even organize and resist high fuel prices that are shoved down our throats...

'but what can you do, and I have to go to work and to the store...'

we have turned predominantly into a nation of sheep..

You really think this gov't would compensate you for confiscation of this type of item? After what's occurred? HAH..

They'd just take 'em and destroy 'em.. You'd get bupkis.

On a side note - (but it reminds me) the local hardware store owner told me this morning that the majority of phone calls into the store when it opened were people asking about ammunition..

Expect a spike in demand AND prices..

Taking a few hundred billion dollars worth of property might not result in an actual civil war.

But it might.

One can only hope that people really, really think about what they are trying to do, and at least act according to the Constitution while doing so.

I didn't think it was possible, either. I seriously wonder if we will ever get rid of him and he doesn't end up as some African style dictator for life, a large portion of the country would support it.

I picked up a thousand round case of 5.56 the day after the shooting. The day before the shooting, there was a giant stack of these cases on the floor in the middle of the store. When I went to get mine, there were three such cases left.

It's a funny damn thing but Obama does not meet the criteria to purchase a gun, but with the nuclear football has the ability destroy the world.

Food for thought.

If they don't it won't be because they got overly interested in our freedom.

STFU, Mr. Beans.

You are not US. Your entire history is as a subjagated people. Ruled over by the monarchy and the church.
Americans are NOT [bleep] brits or aussies who bend at the waist for the queen.
The reason you lost your guns is because your a bunch of poofters who were bred to be slaves of the king.
Happened before the printing press so dont blame "the media".
In 1993 it was easy to pass the AWB because very few people actually owned the type of weapons they were banning. I was into it big in 93 and I knew very very few people who activly shot AR's. NONE who owned AK's. In fact, I knew more people who owned MINI's than AK's.
This aint 93. every fkingbody owns AR's. Every fking body has a HC pistol or 4. There aint no putting the Geni back in the bottle.

Wow, you've really got your head stuck up your own @sshole, haven't you!

sure thing Benny. Tell of the woes of your countrymen. Like we give a chit.

Your reasoning is sound. I hope you're right.