I have been using Butch's Bore Shine for a while now and have been well satisfied. Lately Montana Extreme has been getting a lot of good reviews. Your opinion of one over the other? Your pick and why?

How bout neither and get Boretech elminator? I have used the other 2 and will not ever again one does not clean well enough BBS and the ME smells to high heaven . I have used every single product made by Sharpshootr ie the Wipeout line and Boretech trumps it every time.

There is no comparison. BB Shine does a horrible job of removing copper and Eliminator is a bit better. Montana works but it stinks to high heaven and is labor intensice. You should try Wipeout Bore Foam.

Get wipeout and forget about cleaning products ever again. Yeah

Not quite , the product has been eclipsed by boretech eliminator. I don[t use brass brushes or anything of the sort. I have used wipeout,patchout,accelerator since these products came out. None of them touch boretech eliminator. I have not had to try their copper remover yet.

Interesting, couldn't imagine anything better. Ill give that a go next time I run out of wipeout.

I haven't used all the products mentioned; this is just a comment on Butches: I have found quite a difference in effectiveness from one bottle to the next. My first bottle was OK, 2nd worthless for copper removal, 3rd works very well.

I think Butch's works fine for a few patches down the bore when cleaning at the range etc. For real cleaning I use Wipe-Out, but the Boretech has peaked my interest.

FWIW I've also found BT Eliminator works great.

How strong is Boretech? Like Sweets or c-10, or less so. I've used Butch's for a long time. I'd give Boretech a look if it isn't too caustic. mtmuley

Wipe Out for bad copper fouling, Eliminator for everything else.

Sweets smells so bad and from what I've heard, not to be left in a long time. Butch's does OK, smells less than Sweets.

To me, Eliminator is the least noxious of the regular cleaners and Wipe Out, the "nuclear option" for a big job.

Since treating with Dyna Bore Coat, I don't use Wipe Out that much, a few Eliminator soaks usually does the trick.

DF

I got suckered into trying that stuff about two years ago.. Once - was quite enough.. It did NUTHIN'....

Until now I'd not heard of Boretech..

This ^^^^^^

I've used nothing but BTE for the last several years and a nylon brush. I [bleep] canned the brass brushes at the same time. A little JB in the throats every time as well.

BTE is water soluble and no smell to stink up the joint.

I hardly ever use Wipe Out. But, for gross copper fouling, it's very good. They have an accelerator that can be applied before the Wipe Out. I plug the chamber with a big patch or a rag, which keeps the stuff from getting everywhere. The secret is leaving it in the bore for a while.

Eliminator is a good product. I think it was Precision Shooter Magazine or similar publication that did a piece on bore cleaners. IIRC, Eliminator came out on top for copper fouling. It's not as smelly or nasty as some of the others.

DF

Bore tech eliminator is the best bore solvent I've ever used. Almost no smell and works quickly. I have a storage bin full of cleaners and lubes so I've tried most. I haven't used Butchs for years. It's highly toxic with nitrobenzene and doesn't clean copper as well as others. You will not be disappointed with Boretech Eliminator. I've not used their dedicated copper cleaner since the standard cleaner brings out blue/green patches almost instantly. No smell.

I'm always looking for something to improve the cleaning job. I have been using Montana Extreme and Wipeout for the last year or two. I'll have to give BTE a try.

I just don't see how that is possible. Wipeout Foam COMPLETELY removes the copper and fouling. Sure rough bores need more attention but I've tried everything and while Montana Products, Sweets & Barnes' ammonia based solvents work, they require a hell of a lot of elbow grease.

You'll be SORELY disappointed...

Not possible, unless your barrel was clean already. Even after about an hour you can stick a qtip in the muzzle and it will turn blue. Were you letting it soak? I usually leave it overnight, then give it a zip with the boresnake.

IMHO, letting it soak long enough is the secret. I hardly ever use the Accelerator pre Wipe Out application. I've heard that you don't want to leave that stuff in over night. An over night Wipe Out soaking, no problem.

DF

I just cleaned a gun with KG and Butch's. Then I took the Wipe-Out challenge and they were right, barrel was not clean.

IIRC, the Precision Shooter article on bore cleaners had Eliminator as their choice of copper cleaners and Slip 2000 as their choice of carbon cleaner. I got both products and have yet to be that impressed with Slip 2000.

Eliminator became my go to solvent for general use. I have most of the others products mentioned on this thread, just don't use them.

DF

Get a borescope and you'll see why the Wipe Out challenge works. Many "clean" rifles aren't clean. And, it's often hard to tell what the bore looks like by the appearance of the patch. Patches can lie, the scope tells the truth...

My initial argument against buying a bore scope, I could get another very nice rifle scope for the same amount.

In reality, there is no rifle scope I use more than my Hawkeye. Rifle scopes get used in sequence, the Hawkeye gets used every time I clean a gun.

DF

Ive been using Bore Tech Eliminator for almost 2 years and love it. No smell at all and is safe to leave in your bore I believe they recommend putting a wet patch through before putting the gun away for bore protection. Try it

Per a Campfire thread a few years ago, I've been using WipeOut (letting it set for an hour), running patches through until clean, and then using some Butch's. This has worked very well for me.

If, however, BTE is better I'm ready to switch. I dislike cleaning guns...

I use wipe out with a bore guide, foam it, let it sit overnight, run a acetone soaked patch through it in the morning and the bore will be bare metal clean. The bets stuff ever for cleaning a rifled barrel!

Be careful with acetone getting on your stock finish. A bore guide with a cloth over the stock helps a lot.

DF

I love wipe out, my blaser R-93 7mm RM barrel cleans with little effort, most of the time I get by with a bore snake. I love those, I carry one always in the field. At the end of season, I do a more through job. I use J Dewey rod and new brushes and bore mop. I use wipe out then a light gun oil and that it. I enjoy cleaning guns, always had. The blaser is easy, you pull the bolt out, take the barrel off the stock/ receiver, and it simple straight forward cleaning job. Put it back together and you are done. And the rifle always returns to zero.

CR-10

Thats what do and also apply the acetone inside the bore guide via its solvent port, instead of trying to push a soaked patch through.

I've used both, and currently have both. Of the two, Montana Extreme is a bit more aggressive, but only a bit in my estimation. However, I would not choose it over Butch's.

I was given my first bottle of Montana Extreme by a gentleman who made the mistake of taking a big wiff of it in his not-well-ventelated shop. After he recovered himself, he promply gave it to me.

If both are on the shelf, I'll choose Butch's. Otherwise, I'll buy what is available.

When I need to get the copper out I put the Barnes CR-10 to it.

If running patches incessantly through a bore floats your boat, then by all means CR-10, Sweets or Bore Tech are for you. Me, I just shoot it with Wipeout foam (some barrels require two or three treatments to be sure), leave it for an hour or overnight and I'm done..

jorge:

Leave it overnight and run a boresnake through it, your bore will be spotless.

When you guys leave WO foam in overnight, that's just straight out of the can, no accellerant, nothing, nada, just foam?

Does everybody's accuracy fall off so quickly that they're needing to clean to bare metal all the time?

I do run it overnight but never with the accelerant as that has been found to be a bit corrosive. Mathman: I dont use it all the time but it does a great job with powder fouling

Negative. But when I do have to clean, I hate it. So, I treated all my bores with Dyna Bore Coat and it works, but since you can spray it in and forget about it for a while I'm interested.

I knock back powder fouling in a couple of minutes with a bronze brush and Ballistol.

Stuff a rag in the action, give it a quick squirt in the muzzle, and let it soak. I am not positive, but I feel in the hot summer months the stuff can evaporate, so if you leave it overnight it might be too long. In the winter it stays wet all night, since I clean it in my garage.

Really is a lazy man's product. If I shoot 20+ rounds at the range, I just come home, blast some wipe-out in the muzzle and forget about it until the next morning. Then I just run a bore-snake through it twice, and put it back in the safe. Done.

Good stuff.

CAS shooters love it, especially the BP crowd.

I use it it on my guns for corrosion protection. It won't hurt wood or finishes and isn't a petrol product.

DF

You can do the same thing with Kroil or Kroil mixed with Butch's or Hoppe's too, but one squirt with Wipeout accomplishes the same thing.

In two minutes?

Another vote in favor of BTE. I've used it for a few years. Only use nylon brushes and jags because anything copper alloy will melt away quickly. No smell, no color to speak of.

In one hour, or you can leave overnight.

Moly.....

Hmmm. Kroil and a Butch's mix huh? Got both; may have to give that one a whirl.

Good point.

Many shooters will clean down to bare metal--then shoot a couple of fouling shots before hunting. Seems like defeating the point--of taking it down to bare metal.

I shoot until accuracy falls off. Then I clean. I don't try to take it down to bare metal. I take it down until the bore feels smooth as I run a patch down it. When I'm done, I don't need to fire several fouling shots to settle the barrel. But then 300 yards is a loooong way for me!

YMMV

Hey, whatever works.

I have a 6.5-284 Krieger that just doesn't foul. It's Dyna Bore Coat treated and wasn't much of a fouler before. It seems to shoot best dirty, so I shoot it all season without cleaning. I do clean it at the end of the season, just because. Powder residue is about all I see with the borescope and it's gone after a few passes with an Eliminator soaked patch.

Other rifles do better kept pretty clean.

DF

Another one for Eliminator, the best I've used, I use it with Dewey aluminum jags otherwise you'll never get rid of the blue patches...incredible stuff!

Just a few general comments:

I've tried Butch's and Butch's with Kroil, and quit using both after getting my bore-scope a decade ago. You DON'T know how clean a bore is until you use one.

I can't believe people are still using ammonia-based cleaners that have to be shoved down the bore every 15 minutes to prevent harming the bore. There are so many good products that can be just left in there for an hour or overnight that actually take both powder and copper with no more effort than letting them soak.

Of course, I've also noticed rifle loonys often choose to do tasks that make no difference at all, even after they've learned they make no difference, just so they can fuss over their rifles and ammo.

I used to think only a few people owned bore scopes. After reading this thread, I came to the realization that I'm one of the few without one.............

Good points, I for one have never been comfortable leaving any solvents in my bores for hours let alone overnite since I'm not sure whats in them, but BTE seems to work fairly fast!

I use Tiptons truly remarkable bore cleaner or whatever its called

Don't sniff test it for ammonia......it'll drop you like a rock!

Mule Deer,

Is Butch's an ammonia-based cleaner? I thought it was not, that's why I use it.

Can you reccommend some cleaners that are not ammonia-based that work as you described?

Wipeout....

If it smells like ammonia, about knocks your head off with a good whiff, it's ammonia or an ammonium compound.

Some say "no ammonia", meaning no NH3. Ammonium compounds (NH4+) aren't technically ammonia, but produce a similar effect. Some ammonium compounds, when in the presence of certain chemicals, give off plenty of ammonia. And ammonia is pretty corrosive.

I go with the sniff test. If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck...

DF

In fact, no elbow grease at all with Montana. It's an oil based ammonia. Leave it in the barrel over night or a week. It won't harm the metal like water based ammonia aka Sweets.

wipeout/patchout with the accelerator will remove duracoat for sure. was doing a bit of 'sperimenting to see what would take it off on a barreled action that I wanted it off. got a rag wet with it and wrapped it around the barrel for the night and it came off with a toothbrush.

very interested in hearing more about the accelerator not being safe to leave in overnight. doesn't seem to have caused any issues for me but perhaps I just don't know it has.

i did use butches for a long time and when I switched to the Montana line I realized how lousy it was. headed to BTE to give it a try.

GeorgiaBoy,

To my knowledge Butch's isn't ammonia-based, but in my experience it doesn't work all that well either.

Evidently you misinterpreted my post. There are SOME ammonia-based cleaners that you can leave in the bore. As SU35 noted, Montana X-Treme is an ammonia cleaner in an oil base, so can safely be left in the bore. All of the older ammonia-based cleaners I know of (Sweet's, CR-10, etc.) are in a water base, so another patch has to be shoved through the bore every 15 minutes or the ammonia starts to oxidize and etches the bore.

I just honestly wonder how many of the folks who promote CR-10 have tried newer products such as Wipe Out. I used to use CR-10 as my standard, but once I gave Wipe Out a try, there was no going back.

While people on the Campfire sometimes seem more willing to try something new, in general shooters tend to be pretty conservative and traditional, which might be putting it mildly.
I know guys in their 50's who still use Hoppe's #9 and have never even thought of trying anything else.

A friend of mine came to me a few months ago with his .270 Weatherby that he was afraid was "shot out" after around 500 rounds. It took two days for me to get the copper out of the bore with Montana X-Treme Copper Killer, one of the fastest copper solvents I've tried. The rifle went right back to being quite accurate. It turned out he'd been cleaning it with Hoppe's #9.

Similarly, CR-10 was the first real copper solvent many shooters ever used. It sure works, and I've used many bottles of it myself. But today there are far easier solutions.

Only thing better than having a bore scope is having a good friend with one, especially if that same good friend will clean out 500 rounds of copper build up.

Hmmm. Wish I lived closer...

DF

Wipeout!

DF,

My buddy has a private 100-yard range that I often use. Have donated time and materials to it over the years, as well as some of the paper and steel targets from various manufacturers that occasionally show up unannounced on my doorstep. So it's a fair trade! Hell, I probably come out ahead, since aside from the range use I also come up with some good stories....

I haven't tried everything but I haven't found anything easier than running 4 or 5 wet patches through with something that works pretty good on carbon- I have some water based stuff I use and then foaming it with wipe-out. IF one application doesn't get everything out, turn the gun upside down and do it again- sometimes it runs around the inside of the bore and pools on the bottom. Putting it scope-down allows it to work the top of the barrel over and then it is really clean. IF you absolutely have to have it clean right now, I have found that you have to use abrasives. I clean best I can then wrap a tight patch around an undersized nylon brush and scrub with Iosso or JBs. Like JB says, the bore scope doesn't lie.

I use BoreTech because it works and doesn't stink of ammonia.

Have used in this order: Hoppe's #9, Shooter's Choice/Sweet's, Butch's, Montana Extreme, Wipe Out/Accelerator, BTE.

Was amazed with WO/A until I started using BTE. I will stick w BTE for now. Best yet.

I switched to BTE a while back, good stuff.