Recovered these two out of a large, wounded Aoudad ram yesterday.....

Both shots at 536 via suppressed 6.5 Creedmoor, impact velocity was 2100ish. Right bullet was a quartering shot entering high shoulder and found in the offside ham. Left was a broadside follow up shot entering mid shoulder. Broke shoulder going in... Broke shoulder going out, found under offside hide.

Pretty good performance IMO... But not surprised.




#OUTDOORLIFE

Nice, thanks for posting those. Need to get a few more boxes of them.

That looks a lot better that a lot of the ELD-X bullets we have seen pictures of. Someone was saying the ELD-M is actually a bit better bullet on game than the ELD-X, maybe it is true. Might have to give them a try in my 260 Rem.

Thanks for the report. I'm using the 162gr 7mm ELD-M in my 7-08 but haven't got to shoot game with it yet.

Agreed.....

I keep hearing the M is the same construction as the AMax, which I've used a lot of, but these make me think they may be a bit tougher. Granted it's just a sample of one.

Have had the 143 Xs in several deer and a couple large hogs but have not caught one yet.

They look great. I'm curious about the 143x's performance on game as well, both short and long range. Have some 143's waiting to be loaded up right now...couldn't find any 147's.

How does the Bc match up with predicted data. Hornady's claim on BC seems high but I could be wrong. I am Looking to use these out of my .260 when I can find some in stock.

Seems spot on from my experience FWIW...

A few others here that are way more experienced/knowledgeable than I am have found the same to hold true.

I've run a couple three hundred out to 1,350 and they line up good out of an 8 twist .260.

Was out today plinking in some crazy (20+)wind. I'm still trying to wrap my head around why I have any other guns in my safe.

That looks like a winner!!! I always believed Boots Obermeyer when he said that 8 twist was a little too much for 140 grain bulllets, he advocates for a 8.25 or 8.5.

Following that logic, the added weight on these 147's should be about perfect in the standard 1 in 8"

With this kind of performance on game, I might have to start messing with these bullets in my 1-8" .264 win mag, I don't know if you could get there in the Win Mag but in the 26 Nosler you might be able to run them over 3000 at the muzzle, my balllistics appp says they should hold 2100 fps and get this kind of performance out to 800 yards...

Boots certainly is one to listen to, but depending on when he said this, it may not apply. Bullets have gotten quite a bit longer due to VLD design and plastic tips. Length, not weight is what determines twist rate needs.

Me too, at 2725 fps. Have killed 9 animals with them. Had exits on all (half fist sized holes in ribs). Only one ran and left a good blood trail. I did not like them in my 7mag, but slowed down in the 7-08 they are excellent.

Mine are right at 2800fps from a 26in barrel. Looking forward to using them next fall on a few deer.

Thanks I also shoot a one in 8 twist .260, but the gun is 30" barreled 16 lb. behemoth so I know why I have others. I will be trying these and Reloder 26 as that seems to be a good velocity getter with heavies in a .260. I am sure they cheat the wind nicely....

What powder are you running?

According to the Berger bullets stability calculator they should be fully stable at 1500 ft altitude out of my 26" 6.5 SAUM at 3000 fps. With a .350 G7 bc and these performance reports it sounds like some serious long range whupazz.

What is the length of the 147? Thanks.

Nice looking bullets.
Congratulations on your hunts and your critters.

I'm using H4350 in my 7-08 and getting great velocity. The ELD-M and the AMAX are definitely not the same bullet. The same amount of H4350 I use with the AMAX gave me 100fps more in the ELD-M. No problems with bolt lift but definitely too much pressure. I'm using a grain less and getting 50fps more than my AMAX load. My OAL is 2.930 and not compressing powder. I easily hit 2800fps in my 26in barrel.

Kodiakisland,

Plastic tips don't matter much in overall length for twist-rate, because they're much lighter than even hollow-points without any lead inside--and usually "pointier" than even essentially closed hollow-points, like those on many match bullets, or Berger Hunting bullets.

The late Don Miller, who devised the twist-rate formula that both the Berger and JBM programs are based on, eventually decided plastic tips don't count at all in overall bullet length when using his formula. But he may have modified that if he'd lived longer.

JBM's twist-rate formula has a factor for plastic tips, while Berger's doesn't. When using the Berger formula I add 1/4 the length of the plastic tip to the jacketed length of a bullet to calculate stability, resulting in pretty close to the JBM results.

I have barreled several 6.5-284s with 8.5 twists and find it ideal for 140s including Bergers and 142 SMKs. My current barrel is 8 twist because that is what Shilen makes. I feel like I give up 30-50fps. Possibly could be the cut rifling makes the difference but it is there.

147 may well justify that extra 1/2".

I just picked up a box of the 147 gr Hornadys today, so I hope to start working with them by the weekend.
.260 and Reloder 26. Wish me luck.

I loaded and shot a few this afternoon. I started with Reloder 26 and the only three shot group was under a half inch so I am happy. I started on the conservative side with powder so I will work my way from there.

Sounds like a good start, maybe you can keep us up to date on what your final load ends up being. May try them both in my 260..........

This is what I started with.

COL 2.95" just touching lands in MY rifle
Reloder 26
Federal 210 primers
Remington cases( 3rd loading)
started at 45 grs.and worked up to 46.5 grs. thus far.

Last three shot group at 100 yds with 46.5 gr load measured .156"
I am happy thus far.
Gonna load ten and get the chronograph out. Mud made me leave it home again.
If muzzle velocity is even close to my guess then I will probably stay were its at now. I am pretty proud of the bullets Hornady is turning out for the price.

A friend shot a cow on a depredation tag. 175 yds 308 eldx. He said it was a perfect broadside shot, plowed a rib onside and the bullet broke in two one half went south the other north. A follow up shot was needed. Not a good showing for the eldx.

I shoot a lot of pigs with Barnes bullets. The kill fast, very accurate too. I use the 62 TTSX in our 223 piggie rifle. I'm amazed how well such a small bullet kills.

I am a huge Hornady fan. Having said that, impact velocity of 2100 fps doesn't really stress a bullet.

The 6.5 140 ELD-M blew right through my antelope's ribs and kept going. Exit wound the size of a quarter, hit bone in and out. Roughly 2800 fps impact velocity from my 6.5 SAUM. Planning on switching to the 147's after the season for the "massive" ballistics improvement haha but I had the 140's and my rifle bugholes them so....

My Barrett LOVES the 140 ELD-M's so that is what I am going with on this upcoming Coues hunt.

Fully agree, but the beauty of the ELD-M is how far out they hold 2100fps due to the high BC.

Yeah, they just keep on moving on.

Can someone give me a measurement from tip to the boat tail/bearing surface junction on a 147?

1.275

I have burned some 147s through my .260, just for testing purposes. My go-to is still the 129 Interlock, but I really like the ELD-M, also. I load it to 2825, with Re 26 and it is amazingly accurate. I shot a doe antelope with it at about 200 yards, through both shoulders and it performed as expected. I also shot a doe white-tailed deer a few days ago and it worked well there, too, at about 100 yards. It has no flies on it, for sure, but I will stay with the much-cheaper 129 deer smucker,

Thank you

Just started with the 147 4 days ago and today at the 500 yd line shooting in 10 mph wind with heavy gusts I can say.........this bullet is a serious confidence builder 😎


Trystan

Good..... maybe you can use them in the video we’re all still waiting on.

"All day long!!!"

Your the ones who want to see it and I could give a schit less if you don't know what you don't know ☺ If you really want to learn how its possible then humble yourself and beg for my mercy and I will show you. This week out of three groups fired at the 500 yd line. one on Monday, one Tuesday, one Wednesday produced two groups in calm conditions pushing the 1" mark hard and one group just under 2 1/4" in 20+ mph wind. Ya, I know! Tell me again how its not possible with a fixed 6 SS on a stock tikka. That's not three groups out of a hundred. I shot THREE groups and that is it. Was I surprised how they performed in calm weather. No! Was I impressed with how well they bucked the wind yesterday. Ya! That one got my attention.


Trystan

Hilarious....

Humble yourself and beg for mercy?

You're a lying fool.

Them's the facts.

Then you will have no problem putting your money where your mouth is?



Trystan

Huh?

I'm not the guy making stupid claims and promising videos there Darlene.

Ya, that's what I thought you [bleep] idiot. Put your money where your mouth is or keep your sniveling coward trap shut!

Your turn.

I bet your middle name is "Christmas."

And your last name is Turkey.

LOL, sounds like Trithtan got into the beers.

Tanner

You better be careful or he'll have you begging for mercy.

And besides, I'm thinking Zima, that sounded like a Zima-fueled outburst to me.

dammit Tanner, how many times do I gotta tell you, it is 'thounds'....

You dumbass..... I DID post a video of a 3” group at 500+.... in slow-motion so your 1-watt intellect could comprehend what it was seeing. There’s a bunch of videos on that page..... just don’t feel bad watching my wife and kids actually do a lot of the schitt you only bump-gums about.

Am I an “idiot”.... a “coward”?

If any of you lying fuucking cowards want to meet up and go shoot in person lets get together and go find out who the real people are, and who the lying fuucking COWARDS are!


If you don't want to then keep your sniveling, coward trap shut!

Don't they have a get together once a year for the long range forum guys? Videos tell lies all day long. I would love to go to the get together. Any takers? Or are we back to accusating Cowards who CANT nor NEVER could back up there sniveling COWARD lies


Trystan

Haha... I've spent many primers with Dogshooter. I'd gladly meet up and see who can and who can't.

Tanner

Dude. You're the one who offered to post a video backing up your claims.

All anyone did here was ask where it was. Either post it or STFU.

Tanner,

I'm sure most of you guys are more than likely pretty good fellas. I'm getting pretty tired of folks claiming some things are impossible when its not and that's all this is. If you and a few other guys want to get together to go shooting I want to. I will make the trip so you fellas don't have to. I tried to set something up last year but the quick to make accusations crowd had zero takers. Go figure.

If you want to go shooting sometime I will buy the beer. If Dogshooter wants to go that would be cool. I'm not much of a drinker but I'd be more than happy to drink a few beers with whoever would like to tag along


Trystan

From 2/3/17....



We agree.....

Videos are full of bullshit and lies you fuucking idiot and you know it. I've pointed that out more than once and a video is not going to tell you a fuucking thing. Seems pretty fuucking pointless when a man is offering you an in person demonstration or is real life schit not good enouph for you. Or maybe your worried that through all your made up accusations and bullschit you might have to try to prove what you can't do


Trystan

Kinda like your posts.....

If videos are no good, why'd you offer to post one? It was your idea, remember. And you want to call me an idiot.

All I know is, you wouldn't call me a fu*&ing idiot if you were talking face to face.

Appreciated, just for the record, I was followed around by accusating, lying fuucking trolls for months on end. Why the fuuck would I make a video to appease the likes of people like that. I was respectful enouph to agree with what was being asked. Most everyone was disrespectful in return. Its a two way street and if respect would have been returned you would have seen a video. My asking to go shoot and doing the driving is both a courtesy and respect. I have nothing to gain other than I like to shoot. I consider your accepting my offer also a courtesy and respect in return. Lets try to continue our courtesy and respect for one another until we can go shooting here in the near future


Regards
Trystan

Smokepole,

Tanner and Dogshooter and I and hopefully a few others are going to go do some shooting. If you want to come along I will buy the beer. That's a hand reaching out and asking to put differences aside


Trystan

You gotta pay for the pleasure of my company.....

Sounds like weasel words to me..

Cool, I'm in. As long as Tanner promises not to wear the camo wifebeater. Let me know when/where. You sure do have an unusual way of makiing friends, LOL.

PS, you do know that Tanner invented Tannerite, right?

I love everybody, but i'm too far away. Can I send you guys my address for the free beer?

Leaving the camo woman-respecter behind is out of the question. Sorry pal.

Tanner

I'd pay good money to make Dogshooter hang with Trystan for an afternoon.

Would it be too much to ask Trystan to make a video?

I respect that. Just don't forget the Tannerite.

Is accusator a word? Wouldn't it be accuser?
A video camera, free beer, pleasure for pay and lots of guns. What could go wrong with this meet up?

I didn't know that but now that I do I guess Tanner is the coolest person I know

I have no idea when or where and I'm kinda thinking Dogshooter doesn't want to go anyway and that's fine. I'll spend all my money buying you and Tanner beer instead. ☺ It would sure be nice to plan the shooting during hunting season so wherever I have to go I can make the trip worthwhile. Don't they have a campfire event called the icebreaker? Maybe that would be a great place to show up If they still have it


Trystan

No! But you could make a trip to western Oregon and I'll take you Salmon fishing and buy you oyster shooters ☺ .....Or beer.....or both.

Can we refer to this meet up as "Trystans Gang Bang"?

You bastids organize a gang bang in my thread and don't even extend an invitation.....

Trystan...Can you pick up that David Walter guy on the way?

You’re invited.... you can carry my rifle... this pack has been brutal lately....

Does David drink beer? This is getting expensive ☺

Dogshooter,

I'll carry your rifle if I don't have to pay ☺

Trystan

You’re not invited.... thanks for the beer though.

The 147s shoot pretty good in the '06 Ackley with H-1000.

Josh,

Another well founded insecurities post?

Bring your DD214 and your rifle (google the DD214 you dumb fuque so you can say you've seen one) and we'll shoot service rifle and another rifle you want for the title.

Google "service Rifle" as well, so you don't show up with the wrong equipment.

laughin'

Yeah...you're right. This probably isn't the "Gang Bang" you're used to receiving....
#OUTDOORLIFE

Oh Joshie,

I take it from your answer you've got no DD214? Just scabbing your way into free speech on the backs of others, and while the rest of us are deploying to Iraq, Korea and Puerto Rico to help the good people there, you're our exercising your God-given right to be an a$$hole?

Thought so.

BTW, I don't think less of people who don't serve in the military. Its not for everyone.

I just think less of you, because you're an a$$hole.

follow?

The beer is to give you some liquid courage because you can't seem to find any sober. I offered to pack your rifle because I'm only gonna be packing 3 rifles and a 90 lb pack. The money I was going to give you is so you can get your nails done.

I'm going to the Icebreaker......pretenders generally don't show up. See you there.....Not!




Trystan

Don't bet on it........

This just keeps getting better and better.

Just an update on how well the 147 eld-m does out of a stock tikka T3 with a fixed 6

I shot my third group at 500 yds that was pushing the 1" mark this week. Shot 5 groups total so not a bad average. This bullet impresses me as far as accuracy considering I haven't weight sorted nor special hand picked any of them. This post is intended for informational and learning purposes concerning the 147 eld though its bound to piss off those who are incapable of learning. Tomarro a special treat just for the crybaby crowd.


Trystan

147's today.

Video tomarro.

What load and what velocity are you getting . Thanks for your time. Cheers NC

What caliber are you shooting the 147's out of Trystan?
260?, 6.5 Creedmoor?.... 8 twist I am assuming....
Thank You.

6.5X55 Swede 8 twist at 2730 fps


Trystan

You leaving some velocity on the table? Not that I chase FPS, just curious what you found above this load.

That's what I'm running these at out of a 24" CM and a X47 with H4350/Varget. What powder you running?

Josh,

I'm using Reloaded 26. I loaded from 47 grains to 50 grains and velocity was 2500 ish to 2760 ish. I stopped at 49.5 only because it was stacking em. There is no lab pressure data for reloader 26 and the 6.5 Swede so not really sure where I am pressure wise. The bolt opens with the lift of my pinky finger however and primers are very rounded. IMO there's 100 fps on the table easy which would only be about 1/2 a grain from where I stopped. I posted my results of my load workup in the gunwriter section if you want to take a more informed look

I'm headed to the range today and a good buddy showed me how to do a you tube video ☺



Trystan

I've heard good reviews of that combination of R 26 and 147's. The guy that I talked to shoots alot more than me, but I have yet to stumble on any of that powder at our local shops. Looks like I'm gonna have to order online....

Thanks for the info Trystan.

You Tube: Shooting at 500 day 6 and 147 eld-m consistency

Look it up on You tube because I can't get it to download

Still working on downloading video of shooting today....give me a little time and I will get it figured out

Thanks


Trystan

Thanks Higbean,

I edited to put the video of of shooting today on the previous post...You Tube: Shooting at 500 day 6


Trystan

That vertical and consistent POI looks AWESOME! Thanks for the video....

Are you going to take more than 2 shells to the IceBreaker?

So, all this time it was two shot groups?

Its not a varmint rifle or a competition rifle. Its for hunting and in a hunting rifle I want to know what I can expect my first 2 shots cold bore. If consistency isn't good enough to make the first 2 count then I don't take the shot. That's been working pretty well for going on 30+ years now. I would argue that a 2 shot group for one day doesn't mean much. 6 days in a row IMO starts to tell a story. This story isn't done as I need to shoot in zero temps a number of times to get the rest of the story



Trystan

It's all starting to come together now.

Thanks Trystan.

Your welcome and I will post the result of my zero temps shooting with a You Tube Video. If you would like to see some 5 shot groups I would be happy to do some for you also

Trystan

Whatchout trystan, the do nothing, no buck killing sumbitch, liar Larry suck ass is on to you!!! Grin

Oh, and she likes guitars!!! Haha

Don't hate.

No hatin here.... that Westinghouse is gorgeous!
Have a Slim with Westinghouse and polished pins that will be here next week your pic has me looking forward to it's arrival!

I'm not a big knife connoisseur (<spell check on that one). I've used a cheap Frost skinner at camp for years and love it, but wanted something that would fit in my pack. The semi #1 I had him make me this summer is so fuggin awesome, it's probably gonna retire my Havalon.

He's hoookked...

I'm only on the list a couple more times.

Those orange liners make the handle pop, I'm up to five and need to stop..........

Five?

Jane, you ignorant slut.....

Trystan,

Posting those videos took some cojones as it opens you up to some serious public criticism (which is sorta well earned quite honestly), but I appreciate your candor.

Two shot groups are a huge cop out after all the accuracy claims you made, all the while pounding your own chest and accusing others of not having a clue.

Go shoot some 3 and 5 shot groups at 500 yards (wether you post them doesn't matter) and then take an honest look at what you've got, because it aint gonna be what you were claiming.


Higgins

Just love this site ------ keyboard warriors abound !

"Funny how tolerant we are of those who agree with us --------- and how we attack those who we don't ---------like the member from Georgia.

just sayin'"

Doe permit?? Haha

Higgins,

I 've shot many 3 shot groups and some 5 shot groups at 500 yds. 3 shot groups make the grade 5 shot groups don't. Your half right which is about what I expected. Don't worry about calling me out, I'll go forth and make a video. While I'm at it since you are the grand schoolmaster why don't you make a video of your shelf rifle groups at 500 every day for 1 week. Or better yet use a custom rifle. Ya, that's my way of saying I think your full of schit. Thanks


Trystan

Wow.... spend a couple days up on the mountain hunting elk with your wife.... and all this goes down?

I should hunt less and spend more time on here.... so as not to miss out on anymore jems.

Trystan.... thanks for sacking-up and doing what you said.

I don’t shoot too many 3-shot or 5-shoot groups anymore. I’ll occasionally shoot one to verify that all is still well.... I ain’t into who can shoot the smallest holes in a piece of paper anymore.... but I’ve done enough of it to know what’s what. I do shoot a lot of 1-shot groups.... hits is hits.... and misses is misses. Pretty sure that’s the point of all this “hunting rifle” talk.

Dogshooter,

I hope you had a good hunt. Best of luck to you and your wife this hunting season.

PS: If I'd learn to shoot 1 shot groups my group would tighten up considerably ☺


Trystan

Good stuff, and I agree.

Hey Dog....I thought that was going to be YOUR tag??????

We’d both have tags.... but she’s the elk hunter.... I much prefer hunting deer and coyotes. I’m really looking forward to my mid-November Mule Deer tag.

I’ll tell you this.... my wife is a bad ass. She put on 20 miles, slept on the tent for three nights in 25-40 mph winds and temps from 20-50. She hunted as hard as any man I’ve ever shared the field with, and smiled the entire time... just like always.

Cool deal. Lucky man. Good luck on the muley hunt.

Grand Schoolmaster?

What claim have I made that makes me full of schidt?

I thought videos were nothing but lies and bullschidt, but now you want me to make you one?

Go kick rocks you inept, lying, unteachable fool.

Trystan,

I don't recall Hig making any claims at 500 yards, with any rifle. You're the one claiming 1" groups at 500 yards, with a factory T3 hunting rifle. That would be world class shooting, if such a class existed.

Since you showed 2-shot groups, it's not easy to judge the accuracy/precision of your system (rifle, load, scope, shooter). However, if we look at what you did show, in composite, then it tells us that your actual accuracy/precision is not inline with your 1" at 500 yard claims. I know that you did some scope tweaks along the way, but still, you're not fooling anyone who actually shoots at these distances.

I'd quit, while these dudes are still being nice and polite to you. Reread the posts. These guys are cutting you a ton of slack. Probably more than you deserve. I figured that they had the bail open, were letting you run with the line, and were going to set the hook deep. Actually, they didn't. They were pretty gentle with you.

Hig, Dog, Greg, Smoke... all those dudes know what they are doing. A simple change in attitude, and you'd probably gain some knowledge and advice from people that would be willing to share.

Jason

I found a blast from the past....

Here’s a “3-Shot Group” of “1-Shot Groups”... fired by our very own... the one and only... Tanner.

Damn fine field shooting... and he’s only gotten better.

I have much respect for Dog, Greg, and Smoke! You, your a fuuckking liar! I never claimed 1" groups not ever! I said groups under 2" are common in my world and they are! When someone tells me something isn't possible and it is that tells me I cannot learn a fuuckking thing from you because you don't know what the fugg your talking about. Right? Why don't you and ole hig take me up on the offer to go shooting so we can all see how much you stupid fuuckkers are going to teach ME!






Trystan

Is a “Pair”.... a “Group”?

It is in Savage 99's world...

John

If you want to see the so called "IMPOSSIBLE" 3 shot "GROUP" then let school begin...........video coming soon

The offer for an in person demonstration still stands


Trystan

Funny thing is.... none of us give a crap what kind of groups you actually shoot... or that anyone shoots for that matter.

But since we’re calling well respected members like Jason a “F’n liar”... let’s set the record straight. You said your factory Tikka, with a 6x SS, shot “too many two inch (or sub-1/2MOA... I can’t recall exactly) groups to count”. I, along with others simply requested to see that... and called a little BS. You offered to oblige... even calling yourself a schmuck if you didn’t.

Now videos are Fake News... There’s a Kumbiya circle jerk planned... oh, wait, I hate you guys again.... here’s a video... WTF man? This isn’t 24Hour-90210. How bout you, Dillon, and Donna go shoot some 2-Shot Groups then hit the Peach Pit for lunch?

Watch the video above... that wasn’t shooting groups... that was hitting stuff with a rifle in rough conditions... at various ranges. Which is what it’s ALL about. None of those shots impacted further than about 3” in any direction from center... at 400, 500, and 600 yards... I’d call that sub-MOA easily...

Look man,

Jason said I claimed 1" groups! That's a f'n lie

Have a good night




Trystan

nice.

You may think shooting 2-Shot groups at 500 is a new thing.... hell, you might have thought your 2” group was pretty solid shooting... even though the point of impact wasn’t centered up.

Here you go man.... another blast from the past... an actual 2”, 2-Shot group, at 500 yards, on video. Also, please note the point of impact... that’s a 1 MOA target that he hit... twice. Again... damn fine field shooting.

PS.... those were the first two shots of the day.... under real conditions... shot by my then 13 year old son Ben. You can hear/see... he needs little instruction.

No one said your claim of a 2” group at 500 was preposterous... the BS flag went up when you so flippantly stated that it happened “too often to count”... with a set-up that everyone here knows simply isn’t capable of that kind of accuracy.... with that kind of consistency. You puffed out you chest in response... you were simply branded a Poser by those in the know... and we all moved on, with an admitted occasional trolling by a couple of us. Hey, you deserved it... you self-professed “Schmuck”.

Should we end this now.... or should I let my kids and wife and friends continue to show you what real field shooting at 500 yards looks like?

You are the gift that just keeps on giving.....

Damn fine shooting from both your boys there Dog.

PS.... Trystan.... that man you called a “f’n liar” is a pretty bad ass dude with a rifle himself. He’s been there, done that, and has the pelts on the wall. Though he’s far to good a guy to toot his own horn. Jason has done some VERY thourough testing on rifle “systems”, on his own time/dime, and posted highly detailed descriptions of his endeavors. Some of the success you see in the videos posted above, is due to things learned directly from Jason’s posts. He is a great guy, and when he speaks here... most of us lend an attentive ear.... I’d encourage you to do the same.

Accidentally misquoting someone does not make him a “f’n liar”... it makes him mistaken. Again you should reread that post, disregard the misquoted portion... and dig into the meat and potatoes... it’s solid advice.

I made you eat Crow and your pissed! I already ended it when I shut your mouth by posting results that are supposedly impossible! There really is nothing left to discuss unless you feel the need to keep making excuses about being wrong. In the future if you don't like to be proven wrong "Think before you insert your foot"




Trystan

I hear ya... it’s tough being outshot by Kids. I can sure relate... hell, it happens to me all the time.

God I love this stuff.....

How old are you Trystan?

Boys,

Lay off Trystan. He’s just a guy out there trying to shoot small groups, and like him, I’ve been extremely impressed with the accuracy of modern bolt rifles. He made a claim that he shoots sub-2” groups at 500 yards too often to count, and that’s really not all that hard to believe- after all, I’ve shot sub-1/2” groups at 500 yards too often to count. In fact, every time I shoot at 500 yards it’s a sub-1/2” group. Well, unless I’m shooting a .50 BMG, I guess. See my pic below for proof. Each of those “groups” is sub-1/2”.

Just for conversation........................

The Trouble With 3 Shot Groups

Written around AR platforms but applies to all shooting at all ranges, even with a 6x scope.

MM

Jordan....

I hear you too... I concur on the astounding accuracy of factory rifles... and as I said above, no one ever said his claim of 2” groups (or whatever) were preposterous. They just smelled a little fishy. Particularly when he had just shown up a little while before, asking about putting together a 600 yard rig... and was pretty humble.

It’s a jungle in here man... kinda like an Internet MMA Gym. Everyone has a little different background... but we’re all trying to accomplish the same goal, by modifying a standard set of skills and equipment to fit our personal strengths. As such, if you come in humble, and stay humble... you can learn a lot and progress fast. If you come in strong... or you get a little ahead of yourself... you better be prepared to defend yourself at all times. At least until you prove your mouth and your ass are in the same weight class. Been there more than once... waking up to a flashlight in your face sucks...

Calling 4th a “f’n liar” was over the line man... period.

Dog,

I guess I didn’t lay the sarcasm on thick enough...

I agree with you on all counts. First off calling 4th a f'n liar was uncalled for. He was mistaken and there is a difference. Other than that understanding which weight class a man is in is important I agree. I can usually tell where a man is by the quality of the information I receive. Is the info reliable or is it accurate. If it is that's when I make a decision to pay attention and learn. Its how you weed out the posers and from those you want to look to and learn more. The problem I see here is men who are at pay grade 3 but think there at pay grade 9. It accounts for all the inaccurate statements and misinformation and is only perpetuated by a group that is eager to pat each other on the back. If I mistakenly thought this is where the answers are I've been looking for, well, I'd likely never get past pay grade 3 would I

You boys aren't that good.


Good luck hunting this year



Trystan

First, I'm no expert and never claimed to be. If I've shot more sub-half MOA groups at 500 than I can remember it's a reflection on my memory, not my prowess.

Having said that, why don't you point out the inaccurate statements and misinformation that have been supplied by the guys on this thread.

Either that or just (once again) STFU.

Smart folks look for answers with their eyes and ears... not their mouths. That’s first day Pay Grade 1 material right there...

Your post, from 10/18/17, is below. I guess I should have known that "pushing the 1" mark hard", should have been interpreted as "under 2" are common". Sorry I missed that



So, am I understanding you correctly, that you want to argue over 1" groups at 500 yards vs. 2" groups at 500 yards? With this T3? Either claim is tough to defend.

Are we still talking about 2-shot groups?!

I suggest that you look at your composite group, and see how your POI compares to POA. What you have shown so far doesn't look good, and doesn't make your case any more believable. In fact, it supports what several people have been trying to tell you.

Once you "know" the rifle/load/scope/shooter are sound, then shooting at various distances, as Dogshooter has tried to show you, is a great test.

Jason

A 147 at 2780 drifts a little over 1” per MPH of wind at 500 yards (22” in a 20mph with the atmospherics here on the Milford).

That means to shoot even a 1/2 MOA group in the conditions you stated... you’d have to judge the wind within +/- 1 MPH (5% margin for error)...and have the wind be exactly the same on both shots... and the hold would have to be identical (with 6x glass). The statistical probability of all those things aligning... particularly “too many times to count” are astronomical, at best.

Even if it did happen that one time at long range camp.... what we have here is a good old fashion case of luck being represented as skill... happens all the time. The only one here that doesn’t know that... is you.

Back on topic, now that seasons are underway is anyone rolling anything with the 147 ELD-M. My only M experience was with a 7mm 180 and wasn't a fan. Curious as I have a stack of the 147s.

WTF??

I keep checking on this thread to see if anymore real world results have been found about the 147 gr ELD-M , and I have discovered it has become yet another peter pulling contest. Why can't y'all get on Twitter or some crap for the middle school stuff????????

Reports too on the 143 ELDX too..

Kurt....I've had them in 7-8 other animals since the original post and they've all worked flawlessly. Haven't caught anymore, but they still seem harder to me than the X version on both game and steel. A member here from MT sent me pictures of a good bull elk taken with them out of a 6.5x47L, I didn't hear any complaints from him either. Maybe he'll chime in.....

I saw your elk results and I'm hoping that was a metal issue beings they were seconds. There are some 180s here waiting to run in a fast twist 7/08, but all I have been able to do is get some seating depths and load a pressure string. Hoping to get them in some stuff this winter.

Posting for smokepole...damn, makes me crack up every time!

LOL, thanks!

This thread is a rare gift.

It started out good then went way south.......... too bad

Ya! Fellas with 40 years experience loading and shooting show up and try to add something to the thread and every dick pounding troll shows up and immediately has to challenge you. Then you finally get sick and tired of listening to em so you post a video doing what they likely have never done thinking the nasty little trolls will stop but no!!! Certain individuals have been doing this long before I showed up and will likely still be doing it long after I'm gone. And the funny part is there not even that good!

I no longer frequent the long range part of this forum.





Trystan

well, bye........

Handed a few people there ass and put some big mouths in check ☺

Not a bad way to leave........LMFAO


Trystan

Horeshit! You made claims to BS groups and when called out produced a video featuring 2 rounds, hardly a group at all.

Most of these guys would take your lunch money shooting for groups myself likely included. But [bleep] like yourself are easily weeded out by themselves as you so eloquently showed us all extolling your imaginary supremeacy of your tikka versus custom rifles.

Phrases from that movie come to mind on a regular basis. There are just so many lines that fit real life situations, exactly like the one you quoted above

de·lu·sion·al
dəˈlo͞oZH(ə)nəl/Submit
adjective
characterized by or holding idiosyncratic beliefs or impressions that are contradicted by reality or rational argument, typically as a symptom of mental disorder.
"hospitalization for schizophrenia and delusional paranoia"
based on or having faulty judgment; mistaken.

You're a riot! I'll do you one better- THREE whole shots, and barely over 1" at 600 yards...

Jordan, do you sleep with that thing, to maintain a close relationship............ Nice shooting!

That's two different rifles.

And....*GASP*....one is a Kimber!

Maybe LR shooting's just not your game, Trystan.

Nor poker

LOL, a legend in his own mind at least.

I took a stroll over on the competitive shooting part of this forum. I did not see a single one of the keyboard warriors "over there"

Probably because its where real people who know how to shoot and like myself can sniff out the BSers from the real world in a hurry

It's pretty sad this part of the forum has become diluted with delusional backpatters not to mention Cowards. Why not try your poker hand over at the Competitive Shooting section and see if everyone over there laughs as hard as I am right now. I've noticed a hell of a lot of good long range shooters don't frequent this part of the forum. Ever ask yourself why?

You boys aren't that good.....not good enough to be offering advice on a long range forum


Trystan

Mebbe it's because this is the LR hunting forum, not the competition forum. Ya think?....

Trystan, weren't you asking about what rifle to buy a short time ago as you were clueless? And now you are lecturing? What am I missing here? You go shoot a 2 shot group and now you are a pro?

Not a damn thing. He also said he was done posting on the LR forum, I guess he cant help himself.

Greg, nobody asked about my experience. Lots of people assumed. How long a person has been on a forum is not directly related to how much experience one has. Smart people who are pretty damn good ask questions all the time. I got called out by a bunch of wannabees and so knowing my experience said lets go shooting then boys because I'm game. That's when all the COWARDS started backpeddling as fast as there big mouth would let them.

Not my problem is it. A Coward is someone who talks the talk but is shaking in there boots at the thought of having to prove it for real. I've never met so many cowards as I have here at the long range hunting section. I'd ask again if anyone want to go shoot but I wouldn't want anyone to piss there panties



Trystan

Nobody had to ask to discern your level of experience.

Trystan - Just walk away with some sense of dignity. Nobody is fooled. A quick perusal of your recent posts reveals a lot of basic beginner questions. No shame in that, I fit that description myself. But then you show up here a few months later bragging about your silly 2-shot groups, scattered all around the poi and trying to argue with truly advanced LR shooters. It's painfully obvious, even to me, that you're nowhere near their level. You've found a new home on the competition shooting forum. Great, but don't go thinking you fit in there either, at least as anything other than a novice. Be yourself man... own who you are and where you're at. Scroll up and re-read the advice Smoke gave you about learning and being humble. Print it out and tape it to your fridge. It really should be required reading for all who post here.

What is your experience then? I can assure you, the folks you are talking to are not shaking in their boots, nor are they posers. They simply have significantly better things to do.

If you have better things to do with your time perhaps you could post something about the 147 eld? Or.....maybe you really don't have better things to do?


Trystan

There are plenty of competitors who don't talk about competition on forums. I'm currently waiting on a premium action that I won off of the last PRS prize table- going to put together another match rifle.

I'd be happy to smack some steel with you, if you manage to get here with your Tikka.

Jordan,

I'd already figured out who you are a long time back and I've learned a lot from reading your posts. There are a couple more around here like you. I'm not one of them but I am eager to learn from those who can teach me. I know who's who and who isn't so rest easy


Trystan

Enlighten us then chief..... who’s who?

My vids have been up for years....

There’s 100+ teenagers and their parents in the area that have made 500+ yard hits with that rifle you see in those vids. I’m taking one of them hunting for the first time next weekend. Maybe you should call and tell his Grandma what a “coward” I am.... see what she says?

I’ve been here since this site was “shooterstalk.com”.... I’ve seen 10,000 clowns like you wash-out....

I’ve got SRM scores....

I’ve got a WA State IDPA Class/Rank Win certificate around here somewhere... and the XD45 that came along with it...

I have my rifle merit badge....

I’ve shot and hunted with dozens of guys on this board, past and present.... who can vouch for my abilities to hit schitt with a rifle, as well as my ability to nut-up, and go hard in the schitt whilst packing one.

I (like you are now) have been b1tch-slapped in the past on this very forum, by guys more knowledgeable than me on particular subjects. Something about LR elk hunting and a Subaru.... RIP BobNH.

Take it like a man.... and move on...

Did I ever tell you guys about the time I won Camp Perry with my Marlin 336? Open sights nonetheless.

Camp Perry, that's a band camp, right.

I’m not really concerned with what people think of me personally, I was just tying to make a point that like me, there are other guys commenting here that likely shoot on a competitive level, but don’t talk about it online very much.

Ya well, the difference is I can shoot......yes.....3 shot groups under 2" with a factory rifle at 500 and do it often. You want me to take the fact that your wrong like a man. Why don't you take it like a man? I offered 3 shot groups if that's what you wanted. I hate to rub your nose in your own stupidity but you were wrong in your assumptions since day one. You honestly think I can't turn 2 shots pushing 1" hard into 3 under 2"


Whatever man......being right or being wrong about something doesn't hing around how long you've been here.

Its good you take time for them kiddos. I can say I respect that

I agree to disagree and I'll move on



Trystan

JFC, Can't anyone keep their word anymore?

Showing up for a few days every month is not considered frequent. Showing up every day for a month is. I'll leave when I'm good and ready Cuuntsman!




Trystan

You're thutch a pill!!

Ironic Try-Stan that this whole thread started because a hunter showed up in camp with the same dipshit, "I been shooting longer than you been alive", self inflated, schitty attitude. He never had a problem telling me how good he was shooting targets and how many Long Range (band)camps he'd been to.... Blah blah blah....

Was pretty easy to read through his bullshit, cause course like these guys here, signs not hard to read for me. Much like your shifting POI from day to day, he was lucky to keep more than two shots grouped together at 100 on a paper plate, prone with no wind.

Put that guy in a hunting situation 2 days later and he melted on a 180 yard broadside shot. But I still got to hear how good he was for the next 4 1/2 hours and 2 miles till we found his wounded ram high up on a narrow outcropping. PRICELESS moment when he looks at me and says..."you think you can finish him off for me?"

I'll take the humble guy that knows his schit any day...

I think Trystan is about 20 and his mom had a 90210 fetish. Or he's got a lisp. He might have a lisp either way.

Trthtan.....might be a hellova waiter at buffalo wildwings.

Lol

So, I'm a little late to the party, but how does $1,000 on you not being able to shoot 3(three) out of 5 (five) three-shot groups into under two inches with your stock Tikka and fixed 6x SS at 500 yards sound? I won't even make you do it in 20 mph winds......

Neutral place maybe. There's a range in west-central MN that goes out to 1200 or so. Rush Lake Range. I've heard Alliance NE has a range that goes out a ways too.

Whenever you are up for it, you just let me know. I'm sure a few others will come to watch you collect your winnings.

2 out of 6 and you come to Montana. If I lose I give you $1000. If I win you give me $2000



Trystan

The offer was 3 out of 5 three-shot groups sub 2".

YOU said you did it frequently. 3 out of 5 is frequent, 2 out of 6 is occasional.

A simple yes or no suffices.

As for the odds, well, I ain't yapping my gums and I ain't giving the guy who was talking big 2-1 odds.

You want 2-1 odds, don't act like the second coming of David Tubb on the Internet.

If someone was shooting sub 1" that would be the second coming of David Tubb but not sub 2" Tubb would sort brass and bullets, hand pick loaded rounds under 1/2 thou run out and I haven't done any of that. You think its something special because you can't fathom it! Trust me, I haven't done anything special so you can unwad your panties now!


Trystan

I think I see the problem here. When I talk about what I can/can't do with a rifle I'm talking about what I can do most of the time. Not 2 out of 6 times. Two out of six is good odds for prairie dogs, not so much for say big game.

Lots of people can shoot small groups/hit small targets at distance 2 out of 6 times. Make the standard most of the time, and that changes.

To be fair to Trystan, he didn't say he could do it most of the time, but I think that's what people heard because that's how most think. At least I do.

I've never been able to shoot a sub 2" group at 500. Here's a video of one at 550 yds. Not all in a 2" group but all within MOA.
https://youtu.be/zhXwAuBIyNE
POA was at the base of the horn.

Zombie post........it just won't die. Hope we hear some more about the 147 ELD M's, maybe a new thread. I have no experience with them but I'm interested in reading more.

My Barrett seems to want to shoot the 147. I hope to use it on something furry in the next few weeks.

First groups fired were between 0.4-0.8 MOA...

So you process information rationally, not like a retard the way Trystan does.
Reminds me of what a co worker told our boss 25 years ago.....
"I'm trying to see your point of view, but I can't get my head that far up my ass.

Let me guess.......ya you can shoot circles around me but you'd rather run your mouth like a Coward than prove it! Your a big touph he man and your coworker is to because he told the boss what's up 25 years ago Lol. Glad you remember one act of bravery from a coworker. Perhaps the memory helped you to muster enouph courage to tell someone like me what's up right. Especially since you can hide behind your keyboard. I for one am glad you have your keyboard to help you out with your cowardice issues. Keep on being brave man.....you got this. ☺


Trystan

Trystan, are you older than 25 years of age?

You should've asked if he has a vagina.

Trystan, serious question.... Are the buttons on your shirt/blouse on the left or right? Does your underwear have a pee hole or no pee hole?

Lol.....good one ☺


Trystan

Trystan let it go. This still has a chance of being a useful thread. You've made 20+ posts (no I didn't count) and if you haven't made your point by now it's not going to happen.

Love me some Randy Travis.... was humming this tune all afternoon... whilst packing out my bull.

Seems appropriate.... might wanna read it twice Trystan...

Deeper and deeper... Still goin’ down...
Driving his future right into the ground.
He thinks he’s closer... the further he goes...
But he’s still on the bottom...
‘Cause you can’t dig out of a hole.

...but sometimes you do gotta haul a critter outta one.



PS... agreeing to disagree is what women do when they know they’re wrong....

I'm impressed you put that much thought into me Dog.

I'm ending the little child games here. Have a good one bud and good luck hunting this year.


Trystan

I put exactly zero thought into you.... other than for the comedic value.

He's less than 25 years old. Types like a 12 year old....

So, I take it you're declining my offer of a wager?

If so, you may want to quit calling others cowards.

Jordan I may have missed it, but how fast are you able to move the 147's out of your creedmore. My initial results indicate that I can get about the same velocity with my .260 as I could with other 140s .

Worked up to about 2775fps, but so far 2700 seems to be the sweet spot.

Jordan,

Different cartridge 6.5X55 Swede but 2700 was also my sweet spot out of an 8 twist. I pushed it just over 2800

Trystan

Another data point:

147 ELD-M from a 6.5x47L, 516 yards, ~ 2150 fps impact velocity. Hit 1/3rd up the body, right behind the leg bone twice. Quick but not instant kill. Quarter sized wound through the fleshy part of the onside leg, no exit, no autopsy. Would use again, would only recommend to someone who understood the penetration qualities and limitations.

DIBS on that rifle when you decide to churn gear again.....

Roger that

I actually came close, not cause I think any other rifle would do better but just to free up some cash. Decided to hang onto it instead, I like the matching Bighorn battery, very flexible.

Dandy bull! Still digging your choice in "camo"!

Nice work Carl. I killed a bull with my 6.5x47 this year as well, but not a good one like that. Can't say enough about that cartridge.


Tanner

Thanks pointer! You just have to put them at ease by looking like every other backpacker they've seen all summer.

Your buddy, SM in WY, has the same philosophy! I use real camo as the critters aren't used to seeing fat backpackers...

Those Lever revolutions shoot flat Buddy!!!!!!!

Nice, should be more then effective. I am hoping to get one into a deer , Only God knows if that will happen though.

More data, two 147's launched at 2670 or so (6.5x47L not pushing it). 375 yards. One shot a couple inches behind the shoulder, smaller than a quarter exit. Slightly quartering towards, may have only caught one lung. Was still on his feet after 10 yards so I put a second shot in the shoulder. Broke the bone but didn't make a big mess. Got into the chest cavity but didn't exit. No chest autopsy, so no bullet recovery. Would use again.

....show off......grin...

Seriously, congrats on a good year.

Nice buck Carl!!!

Love the big 3’s.

Hell ya,

That is a cool old dark horned 3x3. Well done!

Carl, that is a beautiful buck! Congrats!

Very nice buck! Congrats!

Wow! What a thread.

I posted some data from using 143gr ELD-X in another thread here. They have been performing great for me. I’ve shot 9 animals with them this year and last. I’m starting them at 2,947fps from a .260AI.

I hate to poke the bear, but some facts about shooting at distance take time and experience to learn. By the way, I’m over 25 years old and do not live in my mom's basement.

I tell guys that want to learn distance shooting to buy a good rifle in a reasonable chambering, a decent scope, some steel and 1,000-1,500 rounds of ammo or components. Get it zeroed at 200 yards then get off the bench! Shoot from field positions in field conditions, like rain, snow and wind.

Shooting a few good groups out of MANY that are shot is not very impressive. Being able to - pull up, range your target, calculate the environmental conditions and make a first round hit is the goal.

There is a lot of good experience and knowledge here. Asking good questions and listening to the answers seems like a good plan.

Bob

No doubt
But no matter how you slice it- this is a killer thread. Really good entertainment all the way

Fugging megauberepic! Thanks Rick.