Well after two years of coming and going back to Iraq, I finally got my Mauser 98 257 Rob. AI sited in and it shoots soooo good. Me and my Dad were shooting frostbitten pumkins at 300 yards! I put a Timney on it and pulled my groups in tight! Made the brass from 6mm Rem. with 117 gr. Hornady Inter-Lock in front of 47 gr. of IMR 4320, Win. LR primers. The book says 3322 FPS, wish I had a Chorno! Deer season opens next Sat. and I'm going to kill me a big buck opening morning. Leopold 2-7x32 VXII with a one piece Redfield mnt. Also sporting a Houge over-moulded stock fully beded! It is not from some big named builder, but my Dad has built guns since '64 and they all shoot the same, damb good!

Have fun and glad all has worked out well for you my friend.

The 117 grain Hornady BTSP at 3322 fps from the 257AI seems like it would be a pretty hot load, where did you find it? Hornady only claims 2940 fps from the 117 grain Light Magnum factory loads, so another 300+/- fps seems like a pretty significant velocity gain.

Jeff

P.O. Ackley 1964 shooter and handloader pocket guide! It is a stiff load, but the primer still has the round radius on it and there is no hard time opening the action and no bolt marks on the base of the cartridge! I have seen some hot loads where the primer pocket has no tension when putting a new primer in the case. These still have good tension when installing new primers! He also lists 49 gr. of 4350 which shows even less pressure! The load is super accurate too! Who knows it might not be that fast, its just what P O Ackley listed it at! Todays reloading manuals are very conservative because of all the liabilities law suits!

More like they USE pressure testing equipment today. I was going to say BETTER pressure testing equipment but that would imply PO used it.

Your probably right, but he admitted when he blew the barrel out of his 6.5 Jap rifle, and found out how much was to much! Maybe not as technical as today but the results were still the same. I have never blown a case up in my life. I always start out with the starting load and work my way up. If it start showing pressure signs I would surely back off. I am just burning powder, I will probably go to IMR 4350, the velocity is down 100 fps but the pressure is down considerably. Whats a hundred foot a second when shooting game!

Whats one hundred fps for anything? Perhaps the exception of 1000yd competitions (but even then B.C. comes into play alot more) but most benchrest shooters I know are more concerned with shot to shot consistency and absolute accuracy than top end speed. And we all know that animals don't notice a difference, especially considering that the average animal is taken within 300yds, usually well within....we're just brainwashed with velocity because it looks impressive on paper.

You got it, speed doesn't kill, shot placement does! I just built my first 257 Ackley, I never worry about speed! Heck I shoot and old 284 Win. in a FN Mauser that is slower than the 7mm Mag. and everything it hits dies, if it didn't die fast enough I get I would get one of those 7mm STW,Rem. Weatherby, WSM, whatever rounds! Most of my shots are a thirty yards anyway. I built this gun to go and shoot speed goats in NM again someday! Right now just shooting crows and cyotes or and on occasion deer in the pasture!!! There we get long shots, 200 yards or so!

The max load from Hornady listed on LoadData.com with their 117 ILs and IMR-4320 is 38.1 gns for 2700 fps. I think a better powder choice is either 4350 or 4831 with the heavier bullets in the 257AI, at least IME. Max loads produced 2900-2975 in my 22" bbl rifles. IMHO your load is well over accepted pressures.

Out of curiosity, I ran the IMR-4320 47 gn load at 2.8" OAL thru QuickLoad and got 70K psi max chamber pressure with MV = 3094 from a 22" bbl - I tend to believe that's a pretty good estimate of the pressure. At 3.0" OAL - maybe possible in your M98? - max CP = 64K and MV = 3000FPS.

As highly as I think of P. O. Ackley as a pioneer experimenter, his load data is highly suspect and for the most part either wildly optimistic with respect to MV and/or well over acceptable safe pressures.

Very glad you've gotten back OK - thanks for what you've done. Enjoy your hunt.

No disrespect intended, but I think that anybody who believes 1/2 of what POA wrote needs to go buy some NaCl and take a healthy pinch for a reality check. It is quite likely that your load exceeds the safe operating pressures for your rifle, but it is your rifle and if you're the guy behind the trigger and if you feel comfortable, why not tempt fate? Until you're blown up a rifle or 2, you can't really appreciate the importance of safe reloading practices, utilizing modern reloading equipement, a particularly useful item being a good chronograph.

Remember that POA was in the business of hyping POA, but there aren't any secrets to getting higher velocity, other than "burn more, of faster, powder to get higher pressures", so be careful!

Jeff

Otis:

Congrats on your new rifle.

RE Ackley's data.......
He claimed that he got it from "various sources".

MUCH of it is deemed excessive by modern standards.

IF you look at the additional load data presented in the back of Ackley's
Handbook for shooters & reloaders volume II you will see that he tamed down much of the data to about where we are today with modern manuals.

I used to pour over Ackley's books as a young man.

They are very interesting. A lot has been learned in the last 50 years.
Things like the accumulated affect of hot loads on a rifle action.

In the end, it just does not pay to load too hot.

Otis-first off and formost thank you for your service.

Secondly, from my workings with a 257 AI your 117 will be top end in and around 3000-3050 to a bit more tube depending.

3300 is a good range for a 100 but I sure wouldn't want to be running a 117 at that speed.

PO did some cool stuff and pioneered some cool stuff but his speeds were a bit in red line district.

Dober

Well thank you all for your concern, as I have been trying to be safe most of my life! Running the streets of Iraq was not the safest thing I could do, but it was quite interesting! I always watch for the warning signs and thats why I'm here and those other guys aren't! I will keep an eye on my rifle! Maybe I will get a chronograph and we will see just how fast she is shooting! Live life like there is no tomorrow, we are never promised it anyway that's what the Good Lord says! I will not post any more of my loadings on this site as many think I must not know what I am doing! Who knows,"You might be more right than your right"!

If you are using 44 year old reloading data from a source that is known for being (at least) suspect, then you are (IMO) putting yourself in a potentially dangerous situation. Since I don't know you, I don't care what you do. That said, a wise man once told me that I'd never live long if I was going to learn from my own mistakes, so I would be well advised to learn from the mistakes of others. Having blown up a rifle, or 2, when I was young and pushing the reloading safety envelope, you might save yourself some aggrivation by learning from my mistakes. If not, oh well, it isn't me or mine behind the trigger of your reloads!

Jeff

Otis, I've had a couple 257AI's, at present I own one. A nice old custom built on a Pre-64 M70 action. I also own a chronograph. I would view it's capabilities (action wise) as similar to yours. It has a 22" barrel.

In it I use H4350 with 100 and 115 grainers. The 100 grainers get a very safe 3250 fps, and the 115 grainers about 3050. I haven't got my notes with me, but I think I use about 52 grains with the 100 grainer. Use your chronograph to work up to those velocities.

IMR4320 is a good powder, but a lot fast for best results with 100 grainers or heavier. I think it's safe to say that if Ackley had todays choice of powders, he wouldn't be using 4320 with heavy bullets in the 257AI! I'd be using it with 75 grain Hornady V-Max's to blow up coyotes. I haven't personally used it, but have used Ramshot TAC and RL15 with good success. H4350 works fine here as well. You can get 3500 fps easily.

Hope this helps.

Worked with 2 257 AI 20" & A 24" 2950 to 3K is about where I want to stop with 120 Gr bullets in my 24".

Tell you what, Otis...

It would be a shame for you to come back from Iraq in one piece and then blow up your new deer rifle and maybe hurt yourself. If you PM me with your address, I will send you a chronograph. No charge, no strings (well, maybe one.) It is an old one that I don't use any more. Nothing fancy, but it worked the last time I used it.

Consider it a thank you gift for your service. But then back those loads down to sane velocities (that is the string.)

For all who wish me well, I usually don't quote loads as I never try to go by memory. After all the flack I have got from everyone, I looked at my loading data and it was for 100 gr. Spitzers, not 117 gr. The load for the 117 gr. bullet was IMR 4350 49. gr. it is listed as 3050 FPS. The 100 gr. bullet using IMR 4320 is 47 gr. @ 3322 fps. Sorry for all the upsetting info. Out!

FWIW, I don't think that anyone was giving you "flak", since "flak" has a negative connotation, just ask any Vietnam era pilot/weapons officer who flew into Route Pack IV how negative flak really is.

I think that what you were getting was a warning message from the thousands of years of combined reloading experience resources here at 24HCF when folks saw that what you said that you were doing was dangerous. Sort of like saying "whoa" or "cool your jets" or "settle down", you get the message.

Good luck with your reloading and please use modern reloading data and current components.

Jeff

Yeah, but there are to many self proclaimed experts who think they know more about the wheel, than the guy who envented it! I have grown up in a gunshop of a man who designed a 6mm/06 in 1960 and everyone told him it would blow the gun up! Well its been shooting 100 gr. 6mm bullets so fast, and we have never had a chronograph to see just how fast its going. There is no substitute for experience, all the equipment in the world is no good if your an amature using it! Thanks for all your collective wisdom! I hope you folks help others too!

If you're talking about POA, he has been dead for awhile and most folks generally agree that his loading data was often beyond what is considered a safe maximum these days. But you're the guy behind the trigger and if a case seperated because you're push the ceiling of safe loading technique, you're the guy who suffers. It's like driving fast with bad tires or brakes, if you keep doing it, eventually it's likely to catch up with you and the outcome might not be so good.

Without a chronograph, it is pretty hard to judge how hot a particular load, in a particular firearm, is, as the conventional signs of high pressure often don't show themselves until the pressure is well beyond what is generally considered the safe maximum these days.

Jeff

Just when I was getting excited about the numbers! Damn Sure sounded nice.

19 months?

Otis,

Thanks for your service!

I fulfilled the dream of a 257 AI on a Mauser action a few years ago and have been loving it ever since.

It sounds to me like your conclusions were the same as those of us (I just saw your initial report and read through the thread) who looked at your load and were a bit concerned about things. When we have a fine solder who has served the cause of freedom in the field, I hope you'll excuse us if we don't want you to get your face blown off state-side. I totally understand the brain-fart though... I actually had a more dangerous one back when I first "discovered" Ramshot powders and confused a load for Hunter (similar to 4350) with a load for Big Game (similar to RL-15/Varget). That is, I loaded the Big Game using Hunter numbers. I knew I'd done something dumb first shot... first time I'd ever had a sticky bolt, and the primer pocket was toast. Now I keep my load info right in front of me when on the bench...

As to the original topic, mine really seems to love 50.5 gr of IMR-4350 topped with a 100 gr Speer HP at about 3330 fps (chrono'd), and a half-grain less of the same powder under a Hornady Interlock of the same size for 3300 fps even.

Thanks again for your service, and I hope that rifle continues to serve you well!

The man did all this in a time when chronographs were crude and the powders were probably a little different in the burn rate dept.
OTIS just use your head and go Hunting,Have Fun you deserve it.
You may not know i,but there are folks that don't like to run them fast at all. GOOD LUCK to you SIR
PS;I have 3 of PO's improved rifles now and look forward to trying more.

Just found where I started this thread as I have been to Hawaii and Colorado, Mississippi, Texas, and now headed to train Seals in VA. Someone posted to use a set of calipers to measure the brass and the web before and after shooting, on Ackley cases only, no more than a .001 growth. Anything more is considered too hot. I did this and had to drop one grain to stay within the limitations. Have purchased a chronoy, and its at the house. Just don't know when I'll get there to use it and work on some more loads. Thanks for all the concerns. I too, read more than I need sometimes! Go by what you do, if the Wright Bros. would have listened to public opinion we would still be sailing to the far away lands too! I train the military all over the world, I'll probably get killed by a little bastage, who never even learned to read or wipe his azz, or shot by a jealous husband while crawling out a window! PS no offense, but Marines are called Marines for a reason! Semper Fi!We are not Soldiers, they are in the Army!

Bluedraeux, I didn't get the 19 mos reference!

Otis are you going to Little Creek?
If you are look up wolfman in group 20. He is my son and he has been training folks in the deep south for the last year.
Good Luck

Been 19 months since the last post on this thread until yesterday

Oh, I had to go to my post to see where I was with 24cf. I thought it had run its course too! Everybody love to worry about me. My Mother said of all her kids, if someone was handing out tickets to the moon, I would be in line! She's right. The reason I went in the Marine Corps was everyone in my family were Sailors! I wanted more adventure! I think if you don't think out side the box, you end up in one at a nice quiet cemetary!
Yes I am going there, can't wait, I used to launch our boat at the seal base marina when I was a kid with my Dad. He was the one who got me started. Never let fear keep you from doing something everyone dreams about!

Pushing the envelope has its risks and sometimes you pay the price. If you think that the risk is worth the reward, its your choice.

For me, I'm willing to risk money, since I can always get more, while I am very unwilling to risk my eyes, since once your sight is gone, it is gone forever.

Jeff

I'd much rather 25-284,instead of 257Better Bob............

I have both, no meaningful difference between the 2, all other factors being equal.

Jeff

Greater capacity,shorter trim length and incredibly robust brass of exceptional quality...if only for starters.........

Yes, there is quite a bit more case capacity, 13.79% if you assume 58 grains for the 257 AI and 66 for the 25-284, but that doesn't translate to a lot more velocity. Given the 1 to 4 rule of thumb, a 13.79% increase in capacity should generate about 3.45% more velocity, all other factors being equal. A 3.45% increase on a 3,000 fps starting point adds about 103 fps.

Shorter trim length is just 2mm or 0.0787", assuming that the 257 AI case is 57mm long and the 25-284 case is 55mm long.

I think that Winchester/Olin 284 brass is great stuff, but I've never had a case failure with any of the hundreds of Winchester/Olin 257 Roberts cases that I've fire formed into 257 AI.

Jeff

My initial 25-284,was first a 257Bob,then a Better Bob and finally 25-284...via the same tube.

You couldn't run fast enough to catch me,in order to hand me a free 25Mouser.............

In case you are wonderin',100's went faster at every stop up the ladder............(grin)

I had a 257 AI and didn't much care for it. Would have just as soon had a 25-06 for all the trouble.

You need to screw that tube on a WSSM action, then you'll be rockin...

I'll take the existing 100X's at 3400fps+ and their bugholes...........

My initial 25-284 was built on a 24" Remington 722 barrel that went throught the same 257 Roberts to 257 AI to 25-284 sequence and 100 grain bullets did go faster each time, but not enough faster to make a meaningful difference in down-range performance, at least within the 400+/- yards maximum range that I feel comfortable shooting game.

My goal in reloading is to find an optimal balance of accuracy, speed, and case life at safe operating pressures, with accuracy being at the top of the hierarchy. But as with most things, people start from a different place and have different perspective, goals, and objectives. I can only relate what my experiences have been and my experiences were partly a result of my perspective of what was "right" for me at the time. I am certainly not telling anybody at 24HCF what they should do, based on my experience, but this thread started with a guy claiming 3322 fps with a 117 grain bullet from a 257AI, using POA's reloading data, and I thought at the time (and still think) that somebody was obligated to issue a routine POA caution, so I took it upon myself to do so.

Jeff

Never seen a Bob/Better Bob...that'd hang Agg's in 25-284 accords. That whether through the same barrel or of like build.

Then there's the COAL benefits,performance,yada,yadayada.

Win/win/win/win.................

It appears by some of these posts, that all thing related to rifle development and handloading ammunition that were developed before 1980 ( or so) were done by people who had no idea about what they were doing. If that is the case, then where in the hell did all the rifles and cartridges that we now use come from. I have both volume's of P.O. Ackleys Handbooks for Shooters and Reloaders, and have read them numerous times. Nowhere in these books does he, or the many other contributors to these works condone improper or unsafe handloading practices. If you take the time to actually read these great books, you will find P.O. Ackley to be the most knowledgable gun guy on the planet. He did not as was posted earler accidentally blow up a Jap action. He did it on purpose! He wanted to know the strength of military actions, and tested all until they failed, so we would all know how safe or unsafe they are. The loading data listed in these books, is like data in any manual. Start low and work up to what is safe in YOUR rifle. I have 257AI in a Ruger 77ts with a 22" barrel. The Ackley handbook says 50gr of 4350 will give 3257 fps, mine does 3130 fps. No doubt a difference in barrel length. Lastly; there weren't as many lawyers on the payrolls back in those days, and their predisposition to slow things down. P.O. Ackley's advise was the same then as modern experts is now, start low and watch for problems. Luke

You should be asking questions,not trying to "answer" them..........

OK Larry, you win.

As you know, I've been shooting the 25 WSSM more than any other .257" bore cartridge over the past few years and am happy with the performance from the slightly shorter package.

Jeff

I'm not answering any questions. I'm just pointing out the fact that Ackley was not a loose cannon, as he is sometimes made out to be.

I'm sure that POA was a great guy, but he was also interested in promoting the ideas of POA to the exclusion of most others. Take, for example, his treatment of the 250AI and 25 Souper. These are 2 cartridges that are so similar as to be twins, but POA makes the 250AI sound like the next great hope while treating the 25 Souper as if it was something of an also ran.

The problem that I see with POA's data is that lots of people accept it as if it came down from Mt. Sinai ialong with the 10 Commandments. They believe it unconditionally, plus it was published long before there were the technological test equipement that is available today.

You're not going to get any fight from me if you want to trust in POA. I don't know you and don't care what you do.

Jeff

There is no "win",it's just pro vs con.

The greatest pro of the 25-284,is that there are no cons.............

Propellants have changed and made ALL chamberings better. $99 chronographs have seperated much Wheat and that is a good thing.

I'm a fan of minimal taper,for alotta reasons.............

It's not that I trust Ackley's data anymore or less than any other source. No matter who's data, start low. I looked in both of my Ackley manuals and cannot find a load of 47gr of 4320 with 117 bullet for 257AI. Maybe there is another book.

Not to change the subject but, for all you 257AI fans. The Howa 1500 short action or Weatherby Vanguard actions are about 1/4" longer than Rem, Win, savage and work very well for this round. Any cartridge in that family 6mm 257 7-57.

It's not that I trust Ackley's data anymore or less than any other source. No matter who's data, start low. I looked in both of my Ackley manuals and cannot find a load of 47gr of 4320 with 117 bullet for 257AI. Maybe there is another book.

Which is still a long road to travel,to reap less than 284Win parent case capacity.

Howa boxes are now crowding 3.1"? That would be nice,in 6-284,25-284 and especially 284...............

EVERY rifle was "fast",prior to the widespread use of chronographs...just as every Critter killed was "far",prior to the LRF................(grin)

[Good point all good cartridges for that Action. They are good actions and less weight than the M98. Also stainless steel if wanted.
Which is still a long road to travel,to reap less than 284Win parent case capacity.

Howa boxes are now crowding 3.1"? That would be nice,in 6-284,25-284 and especially 284............... [/quote]

I've long been a Howa fan and much prefer two-lugs to a 6 or 9-lug Howa.

A 3"+ COAL box would horn me up............

Has anyone worked up a load with RL17 for the 257imp

I have but refuse to post load data anymore because I don't need someone who buys guns instead of building them or haves someone else build them, tell me how reckless I am. Sounds like they need a dog to tell what to do, or some kids! I suppose Roy W. had people tell him he was out there too, good thing he didn't listen to them either or we would all be shooting 225 Win. as a fast gun! I only know what I read and do, mostly do! I never let anyone, and I mean anyone howl me down or brow beat me into thinking they know best for me. Been there, done that. Some guy who couldn't find tatta's on a girl in the front seat of a pick-up with a road map and both hands! Who said I need your seal of approval to be safe. I thought this was a friendly forum, not a panel of judges! If I see someone doing something stupid I don't say a word, they'll live, if they don't less people to add to the gene pool!

At some point in time, the following question was asked of a very experienced reloader:

"What do you think of the reloading data in P.O. Ackley's Volume 1 & 2?"

His answer (paraphrased) was:

"There are a bunch rather dim-brained handloaders out there who believe that loading data almost a half-century old is still valid.

Some of the data in the books was pressure-tested by Ackley himself, and would be OK if most of the powders shown hadn't changed somewhat over the years. H4831, for instance, has gone through at least two changes since Ackley's data was shot with mil-surp H4831.

The rest of the data comes from either handloaders and wildcatters (who often estimated not just the pressure but the velocity) or from loading manuals that worked up loads the same way uninformed handloaders do today, by assuming that if the rifle and brass don't show any severe signs of stress, then the load is safe."

'Guess that I'm not alone on the issue of POA's reloading data.

Jeff

Hi Guys, Built up a couple of 257RobAI's, First one was on a K98 but the action was too long and so was the lock time. Subsequently purchased a shot out .243Win, M55 Tikka and had a barrel smith friend rebore it and chamber it for BOBAI. It shot 1" groups on fire forming and has held that or better forever.
I have shot a whole mob of goats with it over the years using Sierra 100g SPBT's with an ESTIMATED 3000 fps - All of them perfect shoulder shots although I was amazed out how often the shoulder tended to relocate itself to various parts of the goats anatomy, really quite surprising. While I fell in love with BOB after reading POA, the data I used came from the Sierra loading manual(s). I am not velocity crazy and wanted to make sure this beautiful rifle was going to last me a life time. That was some 30 years ago. Using the Sierra's I don't actually remember any second shots, (I'm sure there was, but none that I remember)death was either instant or with in a few yards, mostly at ranges under 150 yards. Go the mighty BOB, from a friend DOWN UNDER
Bravo 27

Run the original load as you typed it in your first post and I'm not terribly sure your rifle would survive.

A max load of IMR-4320 in my rifle is 45 gr WITH AN 85 GR BULLET rather than the 117 you cited up front.

If you're in the military you let people tell you what to do all the time... its called the chain of command, and people in the private sector do it all the time. The smart ones whether there is a chain of command to respect or not. If someone with more experience than me tells me that I ought to take a step back and double check what I'm doing because I'm not on the right track professionally I listen. I certainly would not be where I am today if I didn't, and it sounds like you wouldn't be where you are if you didn't. Same goes here. Even if a person or group doesn't have as much experience as me, I'll at least listen and thank them for their concern.

People saw that data and called for caution. You yourself have said that it was wrong, have you not? So what the heck is wrong with people looking out for you and anyone who might read your misinformation and not know enough to call it into question?

Your reaction to all of this seems to me a bit naive and quite sophomorish; I'd have been like, "Whoa I misquoted my data; sorry! My mistake." and left it at that.

I have done limited work with it and the 100 gr Sierra Pro Hunter but it seems faster than IMR-4350 and doesn't produce as much velocity or as push 'em as accurately as that powder in my rifle.

Good on ya Bravo 27!

Since I live in Nebraska, I'm required to use a few Hornady bullets and although I probably shoot more Noslers, the 100 grain Hornady InterLocks are an excellent medium game bullet in any .257" bore cartridge in the 250-3000 thru 25-06 case capacity range. I'm currently shooting them in a couple different 257s, with H4831, and a 25 WSSM with H4895.

If you can get these bullet in Aussie Land, I think that you'll like them.

Jeff

Just a note here about loads in PO Ackley's loading manuals.
I started using them around 1960, and found that many of his loads were way too hot for my particular rifles. I always started low, and worked up with powder charges, fortunately. With most of his loads, I never got to his recommended loads as I had reached max well below what's in his manuals.
If someone STARTS testing with his recommended powder charges, they may be in deep trouble pressure wise.
Start 10% below, at a minimum. Better yet, compare his powder charges with modern manuals, and start testing with the min powder charge in today's manuals.
Been down this road many times before, w/r to POA's load data.

Well, you've got a number of years on me, as I only started reloading in 1970, so that I could feed my 218 Bee, 219 Zipper, 25-35, 250-3000, 257 Roberts, 7x57, and 30-40 Krag. The shooters and reloaders who influenced me around Bill DeVaux's shop generally viewed POA as sort of a failed Roy Weatherby. Old habits, like preferring Winchester/Olin brass over Remington/Peters brass because JO'C preferred it, are hard to break.

Jeff

Thanks 260 Rem, I'll give them a go. Back in the day when I first built this rifle Sierra was the bullet of the day, they worked so well I kept on with them. I do shoot Nosler 70gr BT's in a tricky 6mm Imp I have and they are a beaut and I'm currently building a 7mm Imp that will shoot 130gr & 140 gr, that will flatten anything here short of buffalo

Bravo 27 - a FRIEND DOWN UNDER

REACH OUT AND TOUCH SOMETHING - 500 YARDS!

I built my 257 AI in 1969 using a Pre-64 M70 action and a Douglas Premium Grade barrel. Using 100 gr. Nosler Partitions and 50 grs. IMR4350 she spits them out at 3200 fps (chronyed). Great little efficient cartridge that has taken many whitetails, muleys and antelope. If I need something faster then I'll use my 257 WBY Mag.

Good Morning, I'm new to this forum and still finding my way around it but I have to say I'm very impressed with the overwhelmingly friendly comments and advice I have read. Here I have found a group of like minded enthusiasts who have been willing to share their experiences with us all and generous with their time to do so. I built my Roberts after seeing 2 different rifles owned by staff of my then local gunshop, I went home and looked up all the info I could find (Long B4 the internet) and decided to give it a go.
Had the "Net" been available then I would have reached out into the the ether as we do now and considered the advice offered with the ultimate goal of achieving the best possibe result. As it was then I talked to every body who had more experience than I did ( which was just about everybody) and glad I took the time. No, I probably won't follow all the advice I get but if I don't consider it I might miss something important. Having said that I'm embarking on a new project at the moment 7mm/303 Improved on a Greener Martini action that will have the facility to have interchangable barrels !

From a friend DOWN UNDER

Bravo 27