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#104894 - 11/06/02 Re: partition or grand slam for my .270?  
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 6,454
badger Offline
Campfire Tracker
badger  Offline
Campfire Tracker

Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 6,454
Canton GA
Conrad,
<br>I believe impact velocity has much to do with expansion characteristics, particularly with so called "premium" bullets. I have yet to see a bullet like an X fail to perform when driven at decent velocities. Think a 100 grn X in 277 cal won't expand when driven at 3500 fps? Bone or not, its going to do some serious damage at that velocity. JMO.......
<br>badger.


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#104895 - 11/07/02 Re: partition or grand slam for my .270?  
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 18,881
Eremicus Offline
Campfire Kahuna
Eremicus  Offline
Campfire Kahuna

Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 18,881
Placerville,CA,USA
I've used alot of Partitions. They open fast and will shed their front cores at high impact speeds. But, they always have worked for me, time and time again. Regardless as what was hit.
<br> Gun Tests magazine has tested lots of Grand Slams in various cartriage, the .243, the .308, the .30-06, the 7 mm and .300 Win Magnum. When compared to the NP bullet, they didn't work as well. Their front cores are lost more easily than the NP, along with the front jacket portion. The exception is the .243 bullet. It, however, is not a dual core design like the others.
<br> The elk class stuff is much harder to kill, and put down, than the deer class stuff. Again, even the little .243/.257 stuff works on them in the NP design. I mean breaks shoulders and penetrates the lungs. Every time as long as the range isn't too long, i.e. over 200 yds. In contrast, I've seen such animals stay on their feet, and keep moving after one, or more, lung shots with everything up to and including the .338 Win Mag. Not uncommon for such critters, rare, but it does happen with the deer class stuff.
<br> The .270, with NP's, doesn't leave enough of a blood trail with lung shots on such critters ? I've had a few travel on me after taking a 7X57/140 gr. NP through the lungs. Say 400-800 yds. I found them. Enough blood, they were dead when found, and they were shot through the lungs.
<br> The bullet looses too much at short ranges, and leaves a small wound channel ? I suggest breaking at least one shoulder at such ranges. Not that hard to hit as a rule. I wouldn't worry about the damage. If you break a near shoulder and pass through the lungs, mine have all gone right down, like a CNS shot. Lots of damage from the bone fragments, etc. Do the off side shoulder, and even the toughest critter can't move very well, assuming they stay on their feet. Again, the NP can be trusted to do the job. E

#104896 - 11/07/02 Re: partition or grand slam for my .270?  
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 10,934
fish30ought6 Offline
Campfire 'Bwana
fish30ought6  Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 10,934
On the Warrior River
many thanks for all the advice.
<br>
<br>went a whole 'nother direction: bought a box of 130-gr BTs today. will load tonight. hope to shoot a bit tomorrow at lunch. reckon i'll stay away from shoulder shots up close if the BTs shoot as well as they should.


abiding in Him,

><>fish30ought6<><
#104897 - 11/07/02 Re: partition or grand slam for my .270?  
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 1,957
Muleskinner Offline
Campfire Ranger
Muleskinner  Offline
Campfire Ranger

Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 1,957
US of America
Fish,
<br>Pitch them 130 boattails in the deepest river you got round there. Or et least shoot 'em at paper (they'll do thet good). Don't trust 'em on game. Wish I had a picture of ever blowed up 130 spbt I've seed. Go with the partitions. Ain't no sense in playin' 'round with vermin bullets.


Mule
#104898 - 11/07/02 Re: partition or grand slam for my .270?  
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 91,951
The_Real_Hawkeye Offline
Campfire Oracle
The_Real_Hawkeye  Offline
Campfire Oracle

Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 91,951
Northern Florida
Yeah, fish, boat tails have a real tendancy to lose their jacket on impact. Not the best hunting bullets. Probably will be ok on deer sized game though.


"Once we squeeze all we can out of the United States, it can dry up and blow away." - Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, 2002
Alpha

#104899 - 11/07/02 Re: partition or grand slam for my .270?  
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 20,196
las Online content
Campfire Kahuna
las  Online Content
Campfire Kahuna

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 20,196
Kenai Peninsula, AK
How come no one is mentioning Remington Corelokts for factory ammo, or Sierra bullets.
<br>
<br>Was it me, I'd use a plain old standard Speer 130, or a 140 whatever for deer. The Speer 120s always worked beautifully through my .25-06, on a couple dozen caribou 70 to 500 plus yards. Don't know what they'd have been like short range.
<br>
<br>I think I'd prefer 140 grains of standard bullet in the 270 - whoever makes them and what you like, but then, I don't have a lot of experience with the .270, tho I have owned one for 27 years. (I loaned it to my brother about 4 years after I got it, and have only seen it since when I visit him every 6 or 7 years. He lets me fondle it, then. Briefly.)
<br>
<br>Flinch - I gotta agree with whatshisname. Your friends need to (A.) Learn anatomy (B.) Learn to shoot better
<br>
<br>I kill most of my moose out to 100 yards with neck shots - meaning I hit the spine - not infrequently offhand (but not if I can help it). An elk spine at 40 yards ought to be a gimmee - if it ain't running. That calls for the old wing shooting technique through the chest cavity.
<br>
<br>My moose this year was taken at under 40 yds with a .338 Mag 250 grain Sierra Game King, 3 inches behind the head connection. I really wanted to try out the Fed 225 TB this year again, but the Sierra handload is more accurate, and I figured would be better on a long range lung shot if I got it. Thats why that one Sierra GK was on top of the TBs - and I forgot it was there. Anyway, I recovered most of the nicely petaled jacket - the lead was all in bbs of various size mixed in with similar bone bb sized pieces. Blew a 2 inch window right through the spine, and stopped there, pulverizing several inches of bone to either side. Lost maybe a double handfull of meat on the nearside, virtually nothing on the far side. I love the old "Thor's Hammer" shot when it is acceptable. Otherwise I want a big hole through the lungs/heart clear to daylight on the other side for a blood trail if needed. I'm testing the TB to see if it works acceptably for that, to carry if I ever need it on a charging brown bear. That blue Barnes X is also intriguing - but I certainly don't need anything more than a quality '06 180 gr. to kill moose with.


The only true cost of having a dog is its death.
"It would have been a good distance shot if they hadn't been so far away". Seth Kantner in "Shopping for Porcupine"
#104900 - 11/08/02 Re: partition or grand slam for my .270?  
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 16,032
Boggy Creek Ranger Offline
Campfire Kahuna
Boggy Creek Ranger  Offline
Campfire Kahuna

Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 16,032
Leon County Texas
fish I've shot a boat load of deer and hogs with the 270. While I have used them I have never felt the real need for either a partition or g.s. for what I shoot. The 130 boat tail is sexy looking as can be and usually is very accurate. However until you get way to hellengone out there a boat tail has no advantages over a flat base. Sure do load easy though. [Linked Image]
<br>Every body moans and groans over the partion losing the front part. That is what it is supposed to do. The base is to drive on through. The g.s. seems to me to be a tougher bullet in hanging together if that is what you want.
<br>My standard load for my 270 is the 140 gr Nosler ballistic tip over 58 gr of AA 3100. I have never lost an animal shot with it but I don't shoot to break shoulders. I want a bullet to slip into the chest area and go off like a bomb. That is my preference and my load will do it for me. About the best I have seen deer and hogs do is two or three stumbling steps and then dog.
<br>Go ahead on and use your 130bt. It will work fine on deer but don't expect it to be a bone smasher and then drive on through to the next county. It won't reliably.
<br>BCR


Quando Omni Moritati
#104901 - 11/08/02 Re: partition or grand slam for my .270?  
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 10,934
fish30ought6 Offline
Campfire 'Bwana
fish30ought6  Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 10,934
On the Warrior River
been there. done all that. i don't shoot way out there. i know the presumed jacket-shedding tendency of boattails. i'm loading at about 2,800 fps. i'm gonna select boiler-room shots. i want mr. or mrs. deer to run out of air very fast.
<br>
<br>but none of that will matter if the BTs don't shoot very, very well. it they don't do so early tomorrow morning at the range, i'll just use plain ol' winchester power points or remington core-lokts. that little adl shoots those mighty fine.


abiding in Him,

><>fish30ought6<><
#104902 - 11/08/02 Re: partition or grand slam for my .270?  
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Posts: 5,781
Muley Stalker Offline
Campfire Tracker
Muley Stalker  Offline
Campfire Tracker

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Golden, CO, USA
FWIW, I used Remington's old Extended Range Boat Tail 140 grain .270 factory ammo for 10 years on muleys and blacktails and they were instant death, in most cases. Excellent performance. An elk and a couple antelope fell to it too. Rarely a second shot needed and it was a non-premium bullet.
<br>
<br>I agree completely with Flinch and others that you don't need premiums for deer in a .270. The vast majority of non-premium .277's were designed specifically with the .270 and deer in mind.

#104903 - 11/08/02 Re: partition or grand slam for my .270?  
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 14,201
ready_on_the_right Offline
Campfire 'Bwana
ready_on_the_right  Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 14,201
GA, USA
I've gone through both shoulders on many GA deer with regular old 130gr core-lokts!
<br>
<br>It just isn't fun to shoot factory loads though[Linked Image]
<br>
<br>Mike


God, Family, and Country.
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Bravo

#104904 - 11/08/02 Re: partition or grand slam for my .270?  
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Muley Stalker Offline
Campfire Tracker
Muley Stalker  Offline
Campfire Tracker

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Golden, CO, USA
Mike -- EXACTLY!
<br>
<br>Wouldn't life be boring if we were all 100% practical?

#104905 - 11/08/02 Re: partition or grand slam for my .270?  
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 14,201
ready_on_the_right Offline
Campfire 'Bwana
ready_on_the_right  Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 14,201
GA, USA
It would be unbearable!!
<br>
<br>I'm going this afternoon to check/reset the zero on the .338 so I can test it on some live medium (hopefully) this Sat.[Linked Image]
<br>
<br>Gotta see what all the Ballistic tip fuss is about!!
<br>
<br>Mike


God, Family, and Country.
NRA Endowment Member


#104906 - 11/08/02 Re: partition or grand slam for my .270?  
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 8,822
ConradCA Offline
Campfire Outfitter
ConradCA  Offline
Campfire Outfitter

Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 8,822
Santa Clara CA, USA
Bullet expansion is a function of the bullet construction, the velocity and resistance. If the bullet does not meet much resistance and it is tough and moving at high enough speed it woll just blast a small hole through.

Last edited by ConradCA; 11/12/02.

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