Home Forums Miscellaneous Topics Second Amendment Liberal Dem Wins Re-election in Indiana - Libertarian the Cause.

Logansdad,
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<br>You are correct about the betrayal. And I respect your right to belong to whatever party you want and vote any way you want.
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<br>But I also have the right to feel the way I do about third, fourth, fifth, etc. parties. Votes placed for these extra parties take away from votes for the major parties.
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<br>If conservatives vote for the Libertarian party that's mean those conservative votes are lost to the cause of gun rights.
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<br>I do feel, moreover, that there are times when the candidates from the majors are so far out of the realm of what we can accept we must cast votes for other parties. However, we must get active in one of the two majors to get better candidates for the fall elections and then vote for them.
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<br>Where do we as gun owners go from here? My thoughts are that a fringe party may make statements but can't really fix anything.
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<br>My efforts go to coopting the Republican party (because there is absolutely no chance to coopt the Dems) and getting the best candidates we can where we have a chance to win.
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<br>I espouse many of the views held by Libertarians but see them as like the hundreds of fringe parties in Europe always outside of any real power.
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<br>Basically I see the Republican party as the only hope for the future. Not because they've been so good to us in the past but because we need one of the two major parties to keep our gun rights.
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<br>Norm

Deputy Norm, I don't feel as any person's vote is a wasted vote. I applaud any person who does their given right to choose as they wish. How things add up at the end is the way it is plain and simple.
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<br>I remember a few years back when the same kind of election results were turned in by the Democrates over the Republicans, most people didn't have a clue as to why it happened, but it did................so history has a way of repeating itself. To many try and put a finger on the what if's and should a bin's. The Republicans have the ball in their court, lets see if they can score now. I will take a wait and see attitude concerning this matter.

now SD has a senator that got an F grade on the gun issue. THANKS to a 3rd party. How pray tell do you think we got Clinton for 8 years. This isn't rocket science. Simple......3rd party...ross perot or whatever his name was. Thanks

Norm, I have voted Libertarian in quite a number of national elections. I didn't feel my vote was wasted. It went to show the Republican establishment that they could not depend on my vote unless they upheld my liberties, under the Constitution. When George H.W. Bush ran for his second term, I voted Libertarian because Georgie boy showed himself to be an enemy of my gun rights, and of the Constitution of the United States. Then I vote Libertarian instead of voting for the wishy washy compromiser Bob Dole. I will not give anyone my precious vote who is an enemy of my Liberty, nor to anyone who is not a defender of them.
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<br>The reality unfortunately is that no Republican, who will actually uphold the Constitution, will ever be given a chance to run for the office of the President . We saw what happened when someone tried. Pat Buchanan had really gotten his pro-American message out, and people initially reacted overwhelmingly to support him. He won some of the early primaries over Bob Dole, but then the establishment came out in force, and the establishment owns both the Republican National Committe and the popular News Media in this country. You cannot fight them effectively. The message was put out that Buchanon was somehow a nut or a racist or, God forbid, opposed to Isreali interests, and that was the end of his chances. He was painted as someone beyond the pale, and he had no way of sufficiently countering that when the impression was created that the only acceptable view of him was as some kind of nut, and anyone who supported him must also be a nut. This same thing would happen to anyone running for nomination to the president on the Republican ticket who credibly advocated, for example, altering our immigration policy to some semblance of sanity, or the elimination of the IRS, or anything that is actually pro-American and pro-liberty.

Chigger,
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<br>Did you read my response to Logansdad regarding my respect of your right to vote for who you want.
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<br>It does, however, seem very plain to me that if
<br>candidate "X" has exactly no chance of getting elected, candidate "Y" is more amenable to my position,
<br>and candidate "Z" wins by one vote that I might just have wasted my vote.
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<br>I don't expect the Republicans to do anything spectacular for guns rights. But the Republican Party
<br>is the only chance we have to get pro-gun politicians elected. We need to work has hard as we can to get progunners on the ballots in the Republican Party.
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<br>Thanks for your comments. I understand how your feel and appreciate your position.
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<br>Norm
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Norm, I agree with you when it comes to Congressmen and, to a lesser degree, Senators, but not for Presidents. The establishment owns that office. You will never get anyone in that office who will enforce the Second Amendment or any aspect of the true US Constitution. Even if it means that the establishment will have to hire a gunman (not difficult for them), that's what they will do to prevent it.

Gee, here comes a black helicopter....look out!

OK Hawk,
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<br>I agree 100% percent with much of what you say. My issue is not the Libertarians or their party. My issue is how can we realistically get pro-gunners elected.
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<br>It is not a certain thing that the Libertarians are ever going to be significant players in national political life.
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<br>The Democrats will love them though. Like I love Ralph Nader for taking votes from Gore in the last election.
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<br>Can we agree that Gore would have been worse for gun rights that Bush?
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<br>In Indiana the Dems won control of the house by 37 votes. Dems in Indiana are always after our gun rights.
<br>Sure would have been nice if 38 Libertarians had voted Republican.
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<br>Norm

Hawk,
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<br>Then all is lost.
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<br>Norm

All is not lost, because the Congress is the legislative body, not the executive. It is much more difficult to manipulate congressional elections than it is to do so with Presidential election. There are too many Congressional elections going on at once for that. So, all is not lost.

TRH,
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<br>We are indeed in difficult times. Even so we must do the best we can to retain our constitutional rights. Maintaining a hopeful attitude is part of the battle.
<br>Along with strategy and tactics and the will to win.
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<br>Norm

I would never vote for a democrap...I don't trust the Republican'ts...I'm stuck with no other choice...

I think if the Libertarians could ever get their act together, and I believe they slowly are, they will front some viable candidates..
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<br>In GA we had a close Senate election between Max Cleland (D) liberal and Congressman Saxby Chambliss(R) conservative and a Libertarian I don't even remember the name, because I knew they couldn't win!
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<br>I will vote for Libertarians in "some" races as a statement of dis-satisfaction, but never if it will ensure a Democratic victory. I'll stick with the known entity!
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<br>Too Many Libertarian candidates aren't good at expressing their ideas and agendas either. They can't just repaet over and over they believe in less Govt. and personal freedom over and over..
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<br>Mike

Republican'ts !...