Home Forums Birds & Dogs Hunting Dogs Professional dog trainer - Worth it?

Because it's a non productive. I don't want a dog pointing birds that aren't there. In a trial, you might get two NP's and then your out. When hunting, I don't want to walk to a dog that's on point only to find there's no bird there. Dogs need to know how to check the scent. What the guy should have done was relocate the dog and allow it to work the scent to figure out it was pointing old scent..... If the dog had hit the brakes at the first sign of scent, and then worked the scent to realize it was old, then moved on, that would have been good bird work.

That's where sending your dog to a Pro, that can put your dog into hundreds to thousands of wild birds, really pays off. The only thing that can train that kind of thing is lots of bird contacts. If your buddy pulled his dog off, the dog didn't learn anything, and he missed the opportunity of a good training scenario.

I can see your point.

This Dog has placed in some of the better trials and handled by him. Hasn't won yet, but good chance he may.

I'm guessing he's a younger dog?

Can't imagine a dog like helping put a lot of wild pheasants in the bag but I could be wrong.

Like what?

Not sure on the age.


Wild Pheasants are not the easiest for any Pointing Dog when they get to running. In addition, his training wasn't directed towards him being a Wild Pheasant Dog. However, I've hunted Ruffed Grouse and Woodcock over him and he is better than most. In fact a lot better.

I'll take a hard flusher anyday when wild Pheasants are on tap.

Depends on the cover. In milo and corn that haven't been knocked down, I'll take a good cocker or springer any day. In cover without rows for the birds to sprint down, you will put more birds in the bag with a pointer that ranges more. Here's a video of a 15 month old Brittany near the end of its first summer at camp in SD. This is a hell of a pheasant dog. You could have limited over her on this bird work alone.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=6eNwQaT7xnU

All of it depends on the Dog and how good they are. A good Springer that has learned to take air scent would have put the same Birds in the air the Brit did in the video. And did it with a lot more spirit.

Addition: and I would have a lot more fun watching him do it. Limit one no limit.

I'll disagree, and I've been fortunate enough to hunt over some of the best springers in the country. I love them both, but each has their place.... The dog in the video was only 15 months old remember, and just learning how to handle pheasants. With flushing dogs you want "spirit", with pointing dogs you want calm composure with style! I've seen springers push running birds too much and put them in the air out of gun range more than I care to say.

We disagree again. Not a Pointer person myself, but given a choice I prefer to hunt over those that slam into their points. Although the best Ruffed Grouse Dog I ever hunted over was a cautious setter that gently covered her ground. She often smelled Birds at 40 yards if the wind was right. Then it was a step at a time into them until she knew one more would be one too many.

Slamming into points won't put many pheasants in the bag for a pointer, the pheasants will just walk out from underneath the point. That's another reason sending a dog to a pro can be so beneficial. The dog in the above video had learned how to track and pin running pheasants, and to take its time. You can hear in the video the trainer say "this is three year old stuff". That dog has now had 100's of pheasants killed over it.

Here's another video. You can see that as soon as the guy got anywhere close to the dog the bird flushed wild, but within gun range. The dog had been standing with the bird pinned for 5 over minutes.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=tZt-kI8nWBI

Here's another video of another Brittany showing that pointing dogs can handle wild pheasants even in thin cover. You can see the first bird sprint out the back of the field, but the others held for the point until the handlers got close enough to shoot. The only way a dog can learn to work birds like this is to put the dog on huge amounts of wild birds.... Btw, both the dogs in the videos are dogs that have placed at Nationals, or finished in the top 5 overall in the country, and have both won tons of trials, including Placing in the ABC pheasant championship multiple times.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=A5qOxy-1IKQ

Those Pheasants were not running, they were just walking around and a good Springer would have put them in the air also. We like a different type of Dog and that is ok. Limit or not, I would find little joy in hunting over that particular Brit.

Out were there are a lot of Pheasants, killing 100 over a young Dog is not all that much of a challenge if you hunt him/her a lot.

Go watch the video again and watch the first bird sprint out the back. Those are wild birds in SD, acting like wild birds do when getting pinned by good pointing dogs. We don't like a different types of dog, I've just hunted over enough different types of dogs to understand the strengths and weaknesses of both. Put a springer up against a good pointing dog in NE on quail, and the springer doesn't stand a chance. Put them in the corn on pheasants and the pointers will be running around in circles. Put them in the prairies on sharptail and it's not even a competition. Springers are great in certain circumstances, but when you need to cover ground like in the prairies on grouse or in the piney woods for quail, a springer doesn't hold a candle to a big ranging pointing dog. Use them on a drive for pheasants, and it doesn't get any better than a springer, well except maybe a cocker. Those little dogs are awesome to watch. I've spent enough time hunting birds and watching dogs run to understand the strengths and weaknesses of the different style of dogs. I'll spend several weeks in SD this summer chasing dogs around at summer camp, and then I'll do the same thing in December while hunting pheasants and trying to get sharp tails pointed. I'll also be on the back of a horse at several championships in the fall before heading off to hunt quail in NE and GA this coming winter. I'll be fortunate enough to do all that and hunt over Brits, springers, setters, Cockers, and labs. I enjoy all of the hunting breeds and will gladly hunt over any of them.

Sounds like some good times. Have fun.

I was given a female GSP naemed Dixie who was one of the finest natural bird dogs I have ever hunted over. I didn't know crap about hunting with pointing dogs because I had only trained and hunted with my first Lab. I took her hunting that fall when she was 8 months old. She pointed and retrieved like a pro with no training I was aware of. That year and the next two we hunted pheasants like we hated them. By the time she was 3 she would pin pheasants and hold them similar to what is shown in the videos. Sadly, before her 4th fall of hunting she was run over and killed while in the care of my father when we were between homes because of a move. Dixie taught me about pointing dogs.

Perry