Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire ORLANDO: Why the 3hr wait, by swat

Swat arrives, determines that there is an active shooter, & waits 3 hrs
to act.
One official said: "It was too dangerous to go in, right away".

Had to strap on all the gear....

30 hostages.
Glad I wasn't charged with making that decision.

Sack the lot of them and put them on lolly pop duty at the local school...same thing with those that want a military career with guaranteed no danger.

That sheriff dude had to be a little warm wearing all that stuff around here. Can't imagine he would last more than a minute or two in a fight.

This...

I thought that it was protocol to go in as soon as the perp started to kill.

It is SOP to move forward with an Active Shooter situation but every situation can change minute to minute.

I don't know the details of this particular situation but it sounds like the shooting began, stopped, and started again.



Dave

It would seem that police procedures need an update like airlines have learned since 9/11. The people are not in to high jacking or hostage taking. They aim to kill. The old routine of setting up a perimeter and getting the guy on the phone won't accomplish much and in lots of cases, is likely to be a distraction so one guy can negotiate while his buddies kill people.

If Hans Gruber could figure out the SWAT hostage routine thirty years ago, I expect real terrorists have planned for it today.

The terrorist want to make sure that the news people have time to get there.

No idea, but I reiterate: DAMN glad it wasn't on me.
I would presume[as flave stated] every situation is different?

Hard to imagine sitting outside for hours while listening to shots being fired inside. Heck, it's hard to imagine sitting outside for minutes listening to shots being fired...

If I stop shooting, am I an Active Shooter?




Dave

Would swat be able to know of the hundreds of text messages being sent from that location?

Not to read them, but to know hundreds were being sent during those three hours, thus knowing of survivors.

LOL. Fire gear ain't cool, and doesn't breathe at all. In our heat I"m up for a fighting a structure fire for about 15 minutes max... of exertion...

I have no clue with police or SWAT Business but it seemed EXTREMELY odd to me too.

I have no idea of what LEO's define as an active shooter nowadays. Here is what is being reported as the timeline, and considering it's from the MSM I expect serious problems with it but it's the best I see.

http://www.cnn.com/2016/06/12/us/orlando-shooting-timeline/
2:02am: shooting starts
2:22am: shooter calls 911 and pledges support to ISIS
3:58am: Police post message on twitter saying shooting at Pulse, stay away from area
5am'ish: Police fired off dummy explosives to distract shooter, used armored vehicle to smash door and allow some folks to escape, cops shoot suspect in doorway. One policeman shot but saved by kevlar helmet.


Cops started arriving on the scene within minutes, by 5am they had almost 100. Reports suggest they had scores within the first half hour. Apparently there was some communication by the shooter with folks outside, but the cops are not saying whether the shooting continued during the wait or not.

The Chief gave a pretty good narrative of why it went down how it did and it made sense to me. Terr exchanged gunfire with the off duty cop at the door then went inside, two more cops arrived and went in, exchanging gunfire with the Terr who retreated into the bathroom (where he killed more), then the shooting stopped. SWAT called in and a plan was formulated involving breaching a cement wall with explosives. The whole time the Terr was in contact w a negotiator and there was no shooting. Things were getting nowhere, so the Chief made the call to go in. Explosive charge failed to fully breech so the Bearcat "RV" finished the job and the Terr died in a hail of gunfire. There was also a danger of IEDs so that had to get sorted as well.

Imagine how many people bled out in three hours.

That reports tells us nothing.




Travis