Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire Obsession With Bible Prophecy: The Devil Loves It

Occasionally I mention something from Dr. Kindell because he is about the only educated person whom I know who is generally penitent. When I have showed him something from God's Word different from what he learned in college or school he has repented.



When I became a believer I spent five hours per day for months reading God's Word. What do you think happened? The folks at church started calling me arrogant because I knew where to find a verse when someone asked a question. What was really fun is when a caring person would come to me about something they saw in my life they thought was in the Bible. I could show them where they were correct and thank them and repent.

Then I discovered the New Testament on tape and listened to it so much so that I wore out three tape players and three sets of New Testament tapes. It takes only twenty-four hours to listen to the New Testament. During that time I read the Old Testament a few times and made cross references to the New Testament. When I worked in the garden I listened to the Bible. If you do that for twenty-five years you don't need anyone to tell you what it says. When I used to work and since I retired when I drive in the car I usually listen to the Bible. According to 1 John 2:27 the Holy Spirit tells us we will not have any need for someone to teach us.

Over the years I interspersed that with science books and lectures.

I am like most everyone else in the world. Almost universally we humans believe we are right and those who don't agree with us are wrong. I am not the first to discover this. In God's Word we are told, "Everyone's ways are right in his own eyes."

Over the years I have tried many churches and talked with many pastors. In fact I used to invite pastors and priest to come to my house on Saturday and preach or teach or do whatever they thought was good. It was not an adversarial gathering. They had the floor for the whole day. My wife would fix lunch for a break and we would all sit down and listen some more.

The vast majority didn't accept God's Word as the final authority. Even last Monday I spent a fun hour with a priest. Some of his thoughts are not supported by the Scripture. He agreed with that and appealed to tradition. He loaded me a book with lots of info. There is some fun stuff in it which is supported by Scripture.

I hope this answers your questions.

Where's England Dan and John Ford Coleys 'love is the answer' when we need it? bwaahahahaha!

The truth is Gene, most of us know a different God. He takes us as He finds us, so we all start out at different places with Him. I have no doubt about your faith, not that it would matter, since we all come by that differently, too. I also know we agree on a lot. Several days in a hunting camp showed that. That we don't agree in this only means we don't agree on this. If I never see you again in this world, I know I'll see you in the next. I'm pretty sure we both agree with that.

Interesting ideas brought up here that have a lot to do with the topic of the OP.

Not in the order posted, but one thing to note is the huge difference between the Roman Catholic Church (note I say the church as an institution not individual members thereof for I am not herein maligning individuals but communicating my understanding of their doctrines) and Protestants is that the former see the church as giving Scripture authority while the latter see the Scriptures as giving the Church authority (although what that authority looks like varies greatly between denominations). It stands to reason, therefore, that the authoritative cannon of the two would vary rather significantly. I am not 100% sure of this, but it seems to me that I've also been told that the Roman Catholic Church's Bible contains books that were not seen as authoritative before the schism between them & the Orthodox Church in the early part of the second millennium AD.

As to revocation of Christianity I find the thief on the cross to be a good reference in these situations; that is, what do we suppose he believed? It doesn't say, but Christ affirmed the man's place in the Kingdom of God, and I doubt the guy understood infallibility or inerrancy or whatever.

On the flip side of that Ricky begs an excellent question. Christ is quoted as asking the Pharisees what miracle would be greater... healing a man (I can't remember the deformity or ailment of the specific person in the story) or forgiving the man's sins. The Pharisees said healing, so Christ healed the man and proceeded to forgive the man's sins under the implication that if He was sufficiently powerful to do the former then He was also powerful enough to do the latter. In similar fashion I would ask... what is harder to accomplish? The salvation of sinful, fallen men or the preservation of the story of that salvation for many generations?

When I ask myself that question I personally come to the conclusion that the salvation I have no doubt exists was a much bigger task than preservation of the story. If God is powerful enough to save for Himself a people, then He certainly can be counted on to bring those people a word sufficient to communicate that salvation, at least in my mind.

Anyway, I don't think I've run across a single person in this thread that I wouldn't love to share hunting camp with. I personally find that most of the controversy we run up against here is due to the lack of personal contact over the internet. Disagreeing with and maligning some type under a somewhat anonymous screen name is a lot easier for me to do than a flesh and blood person with whom I've shared a meal and a hunting camp. Maybe its just me but I suspect it isn't.

Grace and peace y'all!

As seems to be par for the course I'm pretty thoroughly confused by your suggestion that my response didn't answer the question.

Those are excellent points, but I also consider that Christ was a unique figure and it's doubtful that His message would not have survived without an authoritative text. And... just how "authoritative" is that text? Is it not the reason behind all the different denominations of Protestants? And is not considered inadequate without Priestly interpretation by the Roman Catholics? Don't the Mormans believe that it needed an addendum, thus we have The Book of Morman.

I don't recall any instructions accorded to Jesus during His earthly mission regarding writing down accounts of it. I do believe I read something about "preaching the gospel". Sounds as if He may have figured word of mouth was the best way to spread the "Good News". Lending credibility to that idea is the fact that He had witnessed what human nature had done with the O T scriptures and He never indicated that He expected human nature to change.

Then He promised to send a Teacher, the Spirit of Truth who would instruct US in all things. Taken in context, it's clear that He meant each individual.

To sum up, I believe the bible to be useful in attaining a Spiritual way of life.

To me, it is akin to prostitution to view it the same way the Muslims view the Koran and it sure seems like that happens with some folks.

SEE......... their "god" was invented by Mohamed and died with him, so the book is all they have. Jesus is alive and well and able to communicate with His adherents directly.... even those who are illiterate.

If He doesn't "talk" to you [editorial "you", of course] maybe you've never learned to listen, and all the bible reading and memorizing in the world can't teach you.

If you were born in a predominately Muslim country you would most likely be a Muslim yourself (or dead).

curdog, please do not take this as an attack, just a thought or two. It is very dangerous to assume we can understand everything Jesus, or God Almighty thinks or was thinking...

Isaiah 55:8 New International Version (NIV)

“For my thoughts are not your thoughts,
neither are your ways my ways,”
declares the Lord.


Yes, individuals are responsible for spreading the Word nowadays, with help from the Holy Spirit that lives in the hearts of every christian. The written word also helps.

Finally, since you don't believe in the inherrant accuracy of the entire Bible, how do you determine which scriptures are accurate and which one's supposedly are not? That seems dangerous.

You posted Jesus' response to the Pharisee's life style. That dos not address antler's post. I don't know how to say it another way. Antlers posted what the Pharisee were thinking. Without Scripture telling us what they were thinking we can not know what they were thinking. Scripture does not give us that info.

curdog4570,



Their god was created by the Most High during the creation week. We call him the Devil or Satan.

JGRaider posted some Scripture. I am curious if you accept
Hebrews 4:12-13 where we find,

"For the Word of God is living and active and sharper than any two-edged sword, and piercing as far as the division of soul and spirit, of both joints and marrow, and able to judge the thoughts and intentions of the heart. And there is no creature hidden from His sight, but all things are open and laid bare to the eyes of Him with Whom we have to do."

If you do, what is "the Word of God" to you?

I suppose there is a significant difference between a love for God which translates to a love for His word vs a love for His word because it validates ones need to be right. The Pharisees certainly seemed to be live they were showing reverence for God's word but failed to keep its spirit.

Of course Christ showed His love for God's word by citing it constantly. He didn't make up words about Himself extemporaneously He quoted what His Father (who He loved) had said concerning Him.

Another way to think of it is the reverence I might have for love letters sent from my wife. It isn't that I love the letters; its that they are a sign to me of my wife's love for me. Now if my kids were to spill kool aid on them and I abuse them for it I'd be sinning but that wouldn't be the letters fault it'd be mine for placing them before people.

Which if I am hearing you correctly is your beef with Scripture; you don't care for the ways that sinful people have used it as a whipping post for others. Am I correct in that understanding?

I tend to think that, just as in so many things in life, this is all about balance. Did Christ send the Spirit? Yes. I know because the Bible says so and because the Spirit says so, not sinply one or the other. Seems to me if Christ referenced God's written revelation of Himself then I ought to also. He didn't do it like Muslims do tho; He loved God's image bearers first and chastised the Pharisees for holding (supposed) love for keeping Gods law above love for people.

I read and study God's love letters to me because I love Him and want to know Him better and am confident the Spirit works with that study to bring me closer to our Lord.

Anyway good covers action here. Thanks JGR curdog Ricky George & others for keeping it going.

Ok I see I wasn't taking it as literally as that. However, there are points at which the thoughts of the Pharisees are given to us at least concerning their desire to kill the Christ.

Thanks for the response, but what was your point then? I assume you weren't defending Pharisees?

Are behaviors fair indicators of what a person is thinking? If you see a consistent pattern of behavior in a person do you think you can make at least an educated guess as to how they're thinking?

I'm still completely lost as to what in the world your point is or how it relates to the over arching themes of this thread?

Pretty sure he doesn't think that..



Whether the Bible is inherently accurate or not is irrelevant, it will not get you to God. You can only get to God thru Jesus Christ. The Bible is just a guide for the journey, I think that's what CDog is saying.

The Muslims have no living God. Their Koran is the only way to Allah. Step outside of the Koran and it's game over because their God is dead.

I would respectfully disagree on the irrelevancy idea. You cannot pick and choose the scriptures you feel are correct, and reject those you feel are not. They all are God breathed and correct, even if it conflicts with your lifestyle, or if they convict you, which is what they are supposed to do IMO.

In the end it matters not what any of us think or accept. God's word lays it all out for us as a game plan for our lives, and one day we will be judged as we stand before our maker.....


Matthew 12:36King James Version (KJV)

36 But I say unto you, That every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the day of judgment.

You'll never hear me bitch about an "attack" and anytime I post something that is my opinion, not my experience, I'll attempt to answer any questions raised by my post.

If it is important to a man's faith that the bible be without error - and it certainly seems to be for some on here - then it is their business. It should be my business that I don't require an error-free bible for my relationship with the Risen Jesus.

I only have to know and understand what He wants ME to do. It's none of my business what He thinks about anything else.

John said Jesus was the Word and that fits some other references so I just go with that definition. If you think that's wrong.......... deal with it.

You heard me right. I've done a tad of bible reading and I like some scriptures for the simple reason that they express some of my beliefs better than I can. I like this one:

"Thy word have I hid in my heart, O Lord, against the day of iniquity."

i just don't know when the so=called Xtians who walk among us are going to shift their focus to this earth and his capacity to sustain us.

right now, everyone seems to be tied to a personal AfterLife. honestly, it sounds a little selfish to me. but maybe i'm wrong?

given 7 generations ahead, have we properly set up the playing field for the late=date xtians who'll be occupying the earth and shopping at walmart, kroger, etc. etc.

i think we're missing the point entirely. but of course i could be wrong.

efw,



Jesus says the Pharisees honored God with their lips but their heart was far from Him. They loved the praise of men more than the love of God.