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Originally Posted by RickyD
...religion will shrink and also the numbers of Christians. The world is winding down. It's simply a last days thing...


No, it's a communist manifesto thing.


"There's more to optics than meets the eye."--anon

"...most of us would be better off losing half a pound around the waist than half a pound on our rifle."--dhg

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Originally Posted by RickyD
China will kill them by the tens or hundreds of millions before they let that happen. So will Hillary.



Were the leadership of China so inclined they would have already done so, the Chinese government does not piss about.

Right or wrong the world is changing at a phenomenal rate due to information and travel being available at the fingertips of each person, something only previously in the realm of those in the know and elitists.

The ride is going to be a doozy and guaranteed to be wild and rough, but interesting.


These are my opinions, feel free to disagree.
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Originally Posted by JSTUART
Originally Posted by RickyD
China will kill them by the tens or hundreds of millions before they let that happen. So will Hillary.



Were the leadership of China so inclined they would have already done so, the Chinese government does not piss about.

Right or wrong the world is changing at a phenomenal rate due to information and travel being available at the fingertips of each person, something only previously in the realm of those in the know and elitists.

The ride is going to be a doozy and guaranteed to be wild and rough, but interesting.


we got a new board of directors installed once upon a time. the boss told us all that we should buckle up. the ride is going to be a doozy.

for anyone interested in minutiae, and i know many aren't, i'd recommend the reading of the writings of Dr. Matthew Fox, formerly of the catholic persuasion before jining the episcopalian priesthood. his take on the co-creation theology is about as good as it gets. god & man buckled (partnered, joined) together to fashion a better world kinda stuff. it's not for everyone. one good read is Original Blessing, another is the Coming of the Cosmic Christ. there are others. (and i wish i could spell better).


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Originally Posted by RickyD
Originally Posted by Robert_White
Originally Posted by MojoHand
Originally Posted by Robert_White
http://wesley.nnu.edu/john-wesley/t...auses-of-the-inefficacy-of-christianity/

Excerpt from Wesley's Sermon, 116,
"The Causes of the Inefficacy of Christianity"


The Methodists grow more and more self-indulgent, because they grow rich. Although many of them are still deplorably poor; ("tell it not in Gath; publish it not in the streets of Askelon!") yet many others, in the space of twenty, thirty, or forty years, are twenty, thirty, yea, a hundred times richer than they were when they first entered the society. And it is an observation which admits of few exceptions, that nine in ten of these decreased in grace, in the same proportion as they increased in wealth. Indeed, according to the natural tendency of riches, we cannot expect it to be otherwise.

17. But how astonishing a thing is this! How can we understand it Does it not seem (and yet this cannot be) that Christianity, true scriptural Christianity, has a tendency, in process of time, to undermine and destroy itself For wherever true Christianity spreads, it must cause diligence and frugality, which), in the natural course of things, must beget riches! and riches naturally beget pride, love of the world, and every temper that is destructive of Christianity. Now, if there be no way to prevent this, Christianity is inconsistent with itself, and, of consequence, cannot stand, cannot continue long among any people; since, wherever it generally prevails, it saps its own foundation.

18. But is there no way to prevent this -- to continue Christianity among a people Allowing that diligence and frugality must produce riches, is there no means to hinder riches from destroying the religion of those that possess them I can see only one possible way; find out another who can. Do you gain all you can, and save all you can Then you must, in the nature of things, grow rich. Then if you have any desire to escape the damnation of hell, give all you can; otherwise I can have no more hope of your salvation, than of that of Judas Iscariot.

19. I call God to record upon my soul, that I advise no more than I practise. I do, blessed be God, gain, and save, and give all I can. And so, I trust in God, I shall do, while the breath of God is in my nostrils. But what then I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Jesus my Lord! Still,

I give up every plea beside, -- Lord, I am damn'd! but thou hast died!

Dublin, July 2, 1789.

Edited by George Lyons with corrections by Ryan Danker for the Wesley Center for Applied Theology of Northwest Nazarene University (Nampa, ID).

Copyright 1999 by the Wesley Center for Applied Theology. Text may be freely used for personal or scholarly purposes or mirrored on other web sites, provided this notice is left intact. Any use of this material for commercial purposes of any kind is strictly forbidden without the express permission of the Wesley Center at Northwest Nazarene University, Nampa, ID 83686. Contact webmaster for permission.


I'm afraid that and Mark 10 won't go over too well with many American Christians.....


I think Wesley was right in his observation. Great wealth and ease tend to destroy Christians from the inside. Manifested grace decreases in proportion as wealth increases.

But the persecuted Church in China is exploding in growth:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...st-Christian-nation-within-15-years.html


China on course to become 'world's most Christian nation' within 15 years
The number of Christians in Communist China is growing so steadily that it by 2030 it could have more churchgoers than America
China will kill them by the tens or hundreds of millions before they let that happen. So will Hillary.


No, China will not kill them all.

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chiner has some catching up to do sounds like. there's 1.3 billion people over there, and there's some .3 billion people over here.

sounds like there's room for some evangelizing to be done over there by folks who are in that line of business.

looking back through the ages, religion has always been in tough territory. there's a multitude of gods carcasses laying in the ditch on both sides of the road in the sweep of human history. there's been few, or very few survivors. and we're still whittling down the population of gods that purport to have an interest in the humans down here on the earth.

just a quick example for attention are the mayan, aztec, etc group. the viking gods, the german gods, the old roman gods. some say the egyptian gods are extinct. i don't know if they are or not. but through time, many of the lesser gods have been kicked to the curb. ol YHWH himself doesn't seem to be faring all
that well in the face of newer competition.

i know the religious ecology has managed to whittle the number of Greeks gods down from an initial number greater than a 100, down to about 3 maximum in the current day. reckon that number might go lower?


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Originally Posted by antelope_sniper
Originally Posted by JSTUART
Originally Posted by MojoHand


laugh

BTW....who is he and what is he like? whistle wink


Fuck knows, and any that tell you different is a lying piece of rubbish bent upon control.


Or your money.


Jim Bridger on organized Religion.....

Bridger knew well enough that the price of Utopia is always a man's liberty and that salesmen of Utopia's demand immediate payment, though they can only promise delivery at some future date. So far Bridger had never heard of a Utopia that had been delivered.

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Originally Posted by MojoHand
Originally Posted by RickyD
Originally Posted by MojoHand
New survey reveals interesting (but not surprising) statistics about religion in America.

http://www.prri.org/research/prri-rns-2016-religiously-unaffiliated-americans/
Religion fails everyone. Church's fail most. A relationship with the God of all Creation, made possible by the sacrifice of His Son Jesus, and nurtured by the Holy Spirit fails no one. Even you.



Interesting that despite this being the core fundagelical claim, many are still rejecting and leaving 'religion'. Most of whom (according to the survey) are doing so because they reject the idea of a personal God and/or the teachings of the 'faithful'.



Yeah, and no nookie outside of marriage too.


Ecc 10:2
The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but that of a fool to the left.

A Nation which leaves God behind is soon left behind.

"The Lord never asked anyone to be a tax collector, lowyer, or Redskins fan".

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Originally Posted by MojoHand
Originally Posted by RickyD
Originally Posted by MojoHand
New survey reveals interesting (but not surprising) statistics about religion in America.

http://www.prri.org/research/prri-rns-2016-religiously-unaffiliated-americans/
Religion fails everyone. Church's fail most. A relationship with the God of all Creation, made possible by the sacrifice of His Son Jesus, and nurtured by the Holy Spirit fails no one. Even you.



Interesting that despite this being the core fundagelical claim, many are still rejecting and leaving 'religion'. Most of whom (according to the survey) are doing so because they reject the idea of a personal God and/or the teachings of the 'faithful'.



Yeah, and no nookie outside of marriage too. That and no cornholing is a real kick in the nuts.


Ecc 10:2
The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but that of a fool to the left.

A Nation which leaves God behind is soon left behind.

"The Lord never asked anyone to be a tax collector, lowyer, or Redskins fan".

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Originally Posted by MojoHand
Originally Posted by JSTUART
Originally Posted by MojoHand

Umm,

No you can't.

Definition of religion:

:the belief in a god or in a group of gods


: an organized system of beliefs, ceremonies, and rules used to worship a god or a group of gods

Furthermore, your claim that religion (and you're using the second, more specific, definition) is man made is demonstrably false.


Incorrect...I am not religious, in point of fact I would be most comfortable with seeing all organised religious entities and organisations physically forced upon the sharpened stake.

There is God...and only one God.


laugh

BTW....who is he and what is he like? whistle wink


He's like no one you ever knew.


Ecc 10:2
The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but that of a fool to the left.

A Nation which leaves God behind is soon left behind.

"The Lord never asked anyone to be a tax collector, lowyer, or Redskins fan".

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Originally Posted by jaguartx
Originally Posted by MojoHand
Originally Posted by JSTUART
Originally Posted by MojoHand

Umm,

No you can't.

Definition of religion:

:the belief in a god or in a group of gods


: an organized system of beliefs, ceremonies, and rules used to worship a god or a group of gods

Furthermore, your claim that religion (and you're using the second, more specific, definition) is man made is demonstrably false.


Incorrect...I am not religious, in point of fact I would be most comfortable with seeing all organised religious entities and organisations physically forced upon the sharpened stake.

There is God...and only one God.


laugh

BTW....who is he and what is he like? whistle wink


He's like no one you ever knew.


according to the ancient hebrews it's impossible to know a god, or the god, etc.

now, panentheism (what?) allows that god is in us, and we are in god simultaneously. but, how can that possibly be?


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Uh, Holy Spirit.


Ecc 10:2
The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but that of a fool to the left.

A Nation which leaves God behind is soon left behind.

"The Lord never asked anyone to be a tax collector, lowyer, or Redskins fan".

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I believe that there are going to be a lot of people, who when they die and face their Maker, are going to be very surprised to learn that they're destined to burn in Hell for Eternity. And all they had to do was just give their life to God. It's all so easy, and trust me, you are not going to miss anything you can't live without when you do.

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When you all die and find out your >insert deity name here< isn't real... you won't even have the presence of mind, body or soul to know it.


Originally Posted by deflave
You are my favorite minority.

GFY!




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Originally Posted by JamesJr
I believe that there are going to be a lot of people, who when they die and face their Maker, are going to be very surprised to learn that they're destined to burn in Hell for Eternity. And all they had to do was just give their life to God. It's all so easy, and trust me, you are not going to miss anything you can't live without when you do.


I'll miss a lot Sundays that are better spent at the range or gun show.


You didn't use logic or reason to get into this opinion, I cannot use logic or reason to get you out of it.

You cannot over estimate the unimportance of nearly everything. John Maxwell
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Originally Posted by Gus
Originally Posted by jaguartx
Originally Posted by MojoHand
Originally Posted by JSTUART
Originally Posted by MojoHand

Umm,

No you can't.

Definition of religion:

:the belief in a god or in a group of gods


: an organized system of beliefs, ceremonies, and rules used to worship a god or a group of gods

Furthermore, your claim that religion (and you're using the second, more specific, definition) is man made is demonstrably false.


Incorrect...I am not religious, in point of fact I would be most comfortable with seeing all organised religious entities and organisations physically forced upon the sharpened stake.

There is God...and only one God.


laugh

BTW....who is he and what is he like? whistle wink


He's like no one you ever knew.


according to the ancient hebrews it's impossible to know a god, or the god, etc.

now, panentheism (what?) allows that god is in us, and we are in god simultaneously. but, how can that possibly be?


Guy, that's why with discussion involving god(s) definitions are so important.


You didn't use logic or reason to get into this opinion, I cannot use logic or reason to get you out of it.

You cannot over estimate the unimportance of nearly everything. John Maxwell
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Originally Posted by Gus
chiner has some catching up to do sounds like. there's 1.3 billion people over there, and there's some .3 billion people over here.

sounds like there's room for some evangelizing to be done over there by folks who are in that line of business.

looking back through the ages, religion has always been in tough territory. there's a multitude of gods carcasses laying in the ditch on both sides of the road in the sweep of human history. there's been few, or very few survivors. and we're still whittling down the population of gods that purport to have an interest in the humans down here on the earth.

just a quick example for attention are the mayan, aztec, etc group. the viking gods, the german gods, the old roman gods. some say the egyptian gods are extinct. i don't know if they are or not. but through time, many of the lesser gods have been kicked to the curb. ol YHWH himself doesn't seem to be faring all
that well in the face of newer competition.

i know the religious ecology has managed to whittle the number of Greeks gods down from an initial number greater than a 100, down to about 3 maximum in the current day. reckon that number might go lower?


Gus, most of the members of this forum are atheist towards all gods except their own. I just go one god further.


You didn't use logic or reason to get into this opinion, I cannot use logic or reason to get you out of it.

You cannot over estimate the unimportance of nearly everything. John Maxwell
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Originally Posted by CCCC
Originally Posted by antelope_sniper
Originally Posted by CCCC
Originally Posted by antelope_sniper
Originally Posted by CCCC
Mojo, as the starter of this thread, do you understand any distinction between "religion" as "religious organizations" and "religion" the religious beliefs and commitments of individuals (including those of like faith who bond in beliefs and worship)? If you do, kindly explain such understanding(s).

Looks like you didn't read the study.

Obviously, your vision is lousy - like your logic. The question/request was not about the study, it was with regard to the poster.

If you'd read the study you would know there was questions in it addressing exactly this question, pre-nullifying your question. If you wanted to address this question, you could of done so more effectively address the study, but that was not your intent. Per usual, you are just here to throw stones.

AS, you are hopeless when it comes to honest discussion. I asked the poster a question about his/her understanding of a dichotomy. You leaped in, set up a diversionary premise, and attacked on that basis. Not good form - weak - revealing, once again.

Throwing stones? Moi?? Shut down the diversionary part of your brain, open the rest, and try to get this. The content of that study is one thing, the thinking of the poster is another matter. Can you grasp that?

I don't know your values or beliefs, so I can't comment on those. But, I know your demonstrated BEHAVIOR on here, so that is fair game. If calling out your demonstrated behavior is throwing stones, so be it. If you are going to behave in a way that makes you a target, maybe develop a more effective ducking technique.


Says the guy who introduced the Red Herring.


You didn't use logic or reason to get into this opinion, I cannot use logic or reason to get you out of it.

You cannot over estimate the unimportance of nearly everything. John Maxwell
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Even though the numbers of people who say they are religiously unaffiliated is increasing, there is no real increase in the numbers of people who say they are atheist or agnostic. People aren’t saying they don’t believe in God...they’re saying they don’t believe in religion. People aren't saying they reject Jesus...they're saying they reject church.


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Does your mother know what you think about her faith?


and what does the Lord require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God? (Micah 6:8)

d.v.

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Jesus Christ has not failed us and will not fail us. We have failed Him.

Our schools have done great since we got Him kicked out of school.

Our muzzy and South American refugees have done well since we elected heathens to office.

He didnt fail us. He told us what would happen to our country when we turned from Him and to our own understanding. He showed us what would happen to us by punishing Israel for the world to see.

He had Moses tell Pharaoh what would happen to him and his country for defying Him. He then did to Pharaoh and his country what he said He would.

He will do it here too.


Ecc 10:2
The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but that of a fool to the left.

A Nation which leaves God behind is soon left behind.

"The Lord never asked anyone to be a tax collector, lowyer, or Redskins fan".

I Dindo Nuffin
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