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#10684954 - 11/09/15 Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell-- [Re: hubel458]  
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hubel458 Offline
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Here we kill two birds with one stone so to speak,

Best case sizer is the MEC Collet Super Sizer and it can double
as a case holder when we roll crimp. Much better hold than
the ones made to hold cases for crimping, that cost a lot.
Save cost of a holder, plus have best sizer around

[Linked Image]

Here is couple different setups our guys checking for our 585HE
in a long, Lawton Cheytac action. First laminated thumbhole stock.
Second in a Hogue Compstock. The action can mount a scope rail
like shown on the table in 1st picture or a receiver sight in 2nd picture.
The scope rail is a piccatiny type.

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

The stocks used were wide ones for REM long actions, just add recoil
block ahead of recoil inleting for the longer action, drill new screw hole
Open the stock forward to original bolt hole for longer cases and mag.

About Enfields for our case, one of my favorites, Some don't like the
sporterizing, welding bottom metal straight. Many think straightening
is a huge job needing special jigs. Easier just use one being added on for a jig
with a bolt, to weld on the straight extension, Do top weld, then cut old
extension that is under off with a thin cutting wheel, then weld bottom.
When we bolt the short piece on the one we are straightening, we grind
the short slant off so the added piece lays on there flat.
The one you cut off can be used as the top extension for the next one!!!
Just keep on building...Ed

[Linked Image]


Ed Hubel
CMG 300 BP

#10765653 - 12/09/15 Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell-- [Re: hubel458]  
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hubel458 Offline
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Here is a fancy stocked 24ga FH built on a NEF, built by
a guy in Canada. Its straight back, high comb
stock, handles recoil great.Neat looking work... Ed

[Linked Image]

About our 2.17" 585 BB case for lever guns, pistols, AR Uppers,
Work in 71s, later 1886s, Henry steel frames made for 45-70.
One guy is putting one in single shot action set up with
Contender style pistol grip for testing in long rifle barrel,
to simulate pistol recoil..Be very brisk recoil in a case
that holds 110 gr powder under a light Minie bullet
Maybe work in a Rossi Judge with heavy barrel.
Or rolling block rifles and pistols...Gonna try one in 1887.
Got first one in one of our guys Greener GP for testing.

In some ways big bore shotguns and rifles are sexy.
By looking at the shape of the fire and smoke cloud....
Thanks for picture, to the great NitroExpress Forums site.


[Linked Image]

Here is picture of another neat sporterizing deal for Enfields.
On those without rear bridge pocket welded up, we just mill down
and shape it so debth of the pocket matches bottom section of
weaver rail and screw or epoxy it in. Shape to drive in hole tight.
Can use as a rear scope ring mount or mount for peep sight
like a compact UTG sight...Ed

[Linked Image]

Last edited by hubel458; 12/09/15.

Ed Hubel
#10895242 - 01/24/16 Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell-- [Re: hubel458]  
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A poster reading our threads said '' I'm slowly becoming a recoilapheliac''..
That is neat term , and very glad that folks are catching the big bore fever.

Here is a simple, yet neat peep sight we can use on the rear sporterized
bridges of Enfields, works on other rear bridges also.Including shotguns.
I like peep sights the best for most shooting. They also come with flat
bottoms also for bridges and receivers that are flat on top.

[Linked Image]

Here is another pic of our guys 24ga FH in the NEF

[Linked Image]


On straight sided cases like our 585 HE the die set has a mouth expander
die to make it easy to insert bullets. The die flares the mouth, but I always
felt that doing what is really a relative relatively sharp flare, and then the slight
roll crimping the same area of the case into a groove on the
bullet or slug, shortens case life.

So I just use expander plug out of the die, by hand, using just the bottom of
of the expander plug and just push it in a little, wobble it around a small
amount, bullet goes in ok, case mouths last longer, good for dozens of loads,
with moderate hunting and target loads.Only takes a few seconds and less
work that has to be done in the press ... Ed

[Linked Image]



Ed Hubel
#10950880 - 02/11/16 Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell-- [Re: hubel458]  
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hubel458 Offline
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Here is picture of a hard plastic molded shotgun case, holding
a slug, without crimping, a company is experimenting with.
This one with light slug supposed to do over 2000 fps.

[Linked Image]


Here is video by Corlanes Sporting, Dawson Creek, BC, CAN.
Known as, Rocky Mtn Rifles, video on Youtube of them testing our
585 HE in a barreled action, they are building for a guy. They are
shooting it into their big bullet trap with test load..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1vzQjRGfT1A




Here is picture of Rossi SS with 585 barrel mono-blocked into it,
chambered for our 585 BB 2.17" case, to do testing in a light rifle
with just pistol grip to simulate the case in pistols. Others going to
put case in leverguns, autoloaders. We got plenty of cases Ed

[Linked Image]


Ed Hubel
#11003264 - 02/29/16 Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell-- [Re: hubel458]  
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hubel458 Offline
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I feel that Bruce Bertram has done a huge amount for big bore shooting.

We have heard that fellow big bore nut, Nathan Vale in AUS, is

working with Bertram in making order of the full length 12ga From Hell cases.

Drawn cases as strong as BMG brass with unbreakable rims.

Any wanting some, and maybe get in on the run, contact Bertram

at the email -- b.bertram1bigpond.com ...... Ed


Ed Hubel
Alpha

#11050219 - 03/16/16 Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell-- [Re: hubel458]  
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Here is picture of a great old time 8bore double.
I like those old outside hammer, big bore guns.

[Linked Image]

The style of most break actions singles aren't the greatest, that we
we used for 12ga FH, 10ga FH, other caliber barrels we mono-blocked
in them like .585" bore for 585HE and 24ga FH.. One that is close
that we have, is the Magtech.

Well the guys have found one that is super strong lockup and looks
real nice. And has the good quality look. It comes 12ga light shot barrel,
soon be monoblocked to rifled 24ga FH, the little brother of the 585HE.

We told company if they did them with NEF style, rifled, heavy slug barrel,
for shotgun caliber only hunters, they couldn't make them fast enough.

[Linked Image]


Here is picture of 585HE, In an Enfield that Bret and Darrel in Minn
set up with great camo finish, with nice brake job. It is in a Hogue, recoil
reducing, rubber coated, Compstock.Great job they did.. Ed

[Linked Image]




Ed Hubel
#11122796 - 04/16/16 Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell-- [Re: hubel458]  
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Here is folder shotgun, the guys set up as 24ga FH.
Shoots nice, looks nice, it a more expensive break action,
compared to many others.

[Linked Image]


Here is another view of what we feel is a nearly perfect
break action. Guy is making a strong 24ga FH with it.

[Linked Image]


Here is picture of a 585HE MRC PH a guy set up..

[Linked Image]


Here is picture of our shorter 585 BB for leverguns, etc, with
variety of bullets..Can get energy like regular elephant guns..Ed

[Linked Image]


Ed Hubel
#11123465 - 04/16/16 Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell-- [Re: hubel458]  
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[Linked Image]

Hi Ed,
Is Montana Rifle Company building these now? Or did some one buy an action and have a gun built around it?

#11166024 - 05/05/16 Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell-- [Re: hubel458]  
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Wherever I End Up
This rifle is actually mine. It is a barreled Montana action that I got from Hubel458. I ordered the stock from Montana pre-cut for the PH action. I had to open the barrel channel quite a bit but the wood stock looks good I think.


The things that will destroy America are prosperity-at-any-price, peace-at-any-price, safety-first instead of duty-first, the love of soft living, and the get-rich-quick theory of life.
Theodore Roosevelt
#11166472 - 05/05/16 Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell-- [Re: hubel458]  
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Thanks, that does all seem to work

Bravo

#11177435 - 05/10/16 Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell-- [Re: hubel458]  
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Here is a Midland break action a guy is doing in 24ga FH.

[Linked Image]

Here is old catalog picture of different stuff used in old days
for shotgun loads. Some would be hairy in brass cases

[Linked Image]

Here is picture of a MN a guy is doing 585HE in..
It is singleshot. Redid bolt handle mounted it on the bolt
further bac, so the port could be lengthened for our long case.
Needs polishing and blueing, scope rail added.

[Linked Image]

Here is another picture of the PH 585HE with great looking stock.
Nice looking wood. Ed

[Linked Image]

Last edited by hubel458; 05/11/16.

Ed Hubel
#11254887 - 06/17/16 Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell-- [Re: hubel458]  
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There are guys on Castboolits forum experimenting with
locking on plastic bases securely on 12ga slugs.
Making their own front heavy ones for smoothbores.

Here is picture of our 585BB case next to long 585HE.

[Linked Image]


Here is another view of the great camo job on the
585HE Enfield, a top view. Ed

[Linked Image]


Ed Hubel
#11292926 - 07/06/16 Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell-- [Re: hubel458]  
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About the local fellow here making 375 wildcat with our 585 case-


Hello Mr. Hubel,


We just got back on Saturday from competing at the King of 2 Miles Match in New Mexico.


We won! I came in first shooting my rifle (the one I brought over and showed you),

chambered in .375 Lethal Magnum, the round I designed based off of your case.


I’m attaching a bunch of pictures, feel free to post any of them that you want.

I do have one picture of the screen of the camera system looking at the 2500-yard target.

The hit farthest to the left and the hit farthest to the right were my 1st and 2nd shots.



I’m getting more interest in this cartridge now that the results

from this match are spreading across the web.

Happy 4th!

Take care,


Mitchell Fitzpatrick

Lethal Precision Arms

1(989)578-2576



--------------------------------------


Will have pics soon, his case is close to 375 Warlord case

with a shorter neck, and longer to shoulder.

Got guys getting 585HE cases, they all think we have

''the'' case to wildcat... Ed


Ed Hubel
#11325190 - 07/22/16 Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell-- [Re: hubel458]  
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hubel458 Offline
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.
Here is a helix driver seal we made by cutting base from helix driver

wadcup, good for fullbore roundballs that are too big to go in cup.

Best one to cut off is shortest `12ga one BPI has.


[Linked Image]



Here is picture of a 585HE made on a Stiller bolt action for guy in Canada.

It was made for the poster Spooksar on Africa Hunting and Accuratereloading,

by Corlanes/Rocky Mountain rifles, in Dawson Creek BC Canada, with a

Stiller action, Timney trigger. the stock is a blue/grey laminate. He imported

the barrel, cases, dies, etc.. from us, through Prophet River in Lloydminster AB.


[Linked Image]



That action similar to Lawton we had and neighbor got, that won the King Of The

2 Mile shoot at Whittington, with the 375 Lethal cartridge the neighbor made,

from our 585 brass. Made it full length case,.. It is big one on the right.

He made an 18 lb gun with McMillan target stock, a huge scope, tripod..

Nice thing is we don't need BMG action.Ed


[Linked Image]







Ed Hubel
#11357889 - 08/07/16 Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell-- [Re: hubel458]  
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hubel458 Offline
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Fellow big bore nut, Nathan Vale in AUS, has worked with

Bertram and got the run of full length 12ga From Hell cases done.

Drawn 12ga long cases as strong as BMG brass with unbreakable rims.

Any wanting to get some, contact Bertram at the email -----

b.bertram1bigpond.com ......





Some more on wildcat 375 Lethal.......

.375 Lethal Precision Arms LLC rifle shooting prototype solid 400gr Berger bullets.

Mitchell built this rifle himself using a McMillan A5 Super Mag stock, Rock Creek barrel,

Nightforce ATACR MOA scope, Phoenix Precision Bipod, and a Lethal Precision Arms

muzzle brake. Lawton Action. Lethal Precision his own gunsmith shop, will make

these target rifles for anyone into target shooting and long range hunting..


Remarkably, Mitchell nailed first- and second- shot hits at the 2477-yard target,

a full 1.4 miles away. It is windy out there, makes shooting hard with a time limit.

The prototype 400 grain Berger Bullets solid was superb, (G7 BC of 0.56 at 3000 fps).



[Linked Image]


Here is 585 HE in an Enfield, in a Choate Heavy Varmint Stock. These are super strong.

The butts of these can easily be weighted. Couple guys doing them....... Ed


[Linked Image]








Ed Hubel
#11474354 - 10/01/16 Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell-- [Re: hubel458]  
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Here is a picture of the 12ga FH brass case that Nathan

Vale had Bertrams make. Next to short plastic case.

[Linked Image]


Here is a picture of our 585BB headstamp. Perfect lettering

for our case as it came from production line,.

[Linked Image]


I like Hogue stocks, but they aren't made for singleshots.

We use singleshots for our 12ga FH and 585HE.

Here is picture of a NEF we set up for 24ga FH and we adapted

a Hogue 1300 Winchester Hogue to it. Looks a lot better, and

handles recoil easier than factory, Butt hollow, easy to add weight,


[Linked Image]


Here is picture of 585 case in the Lawton bolt, and the wildcat

375s and others made from our cases, work in bolt also. Ed


[Linked Image]


Ed Hubel
#11714538 - 01/05/17 Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell-- [Re: hubel458]  
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Our friend Brian from the far north went to Africa with his 24ga FH he did in
a NEF break action and got 3 nice buffs with it. Good job.


Our 585HE, 700HE and the great 12ga FH are now in the new COTW book
published in Oct, now out for sale,

[Linked Image]


We now have our target 375 HE cartridge, made by necking down our 585 HE.
The others couldn't make enough 375s, so we started our own. Got a bunch
guys doing it, most into the 2 mile shooting venues, We're making cases,
testing, reamer prints at reamer guys, we are getting guys going. The 2 mile
shoot last year really got the interest booming for 375 necked from our case,

Here's how, size and seat 375 HE, one simple die, a 1" die, no huge dies needed
A die we can make with resize reamer from reamer guy, a regular die body,then
pass on to the next guy, one reamer can make whole bunch of dies for folks.

I do primer work separate, not in the press. SO First with lock ring set, I size cases.

When coming back out of dies with case, we notice the case still well centered,
held straight, when it is down as far as the length of the 375 HE neck... IE
the sides and shoulder corner still supported tight.

So we put washer or another lock ring on, same thickness as neck length,
below original lock ring, screw down tight tight in press,

Dies had a 5/8 x 24 thread in top, had powder fill bushing and other stuff same thread,
reamed out from bottom to set bullet height, with ram, case,and bullet up,

After priming, loading in the powder charge, we carefully start(boat tail makes it easy)
bullet in case by hand, slide up in die, into holder, raise ram to to top, bullet seated
perfect. Die can have different thread in top as long as big enough to hold seating
bushing of some kind , that can be made from many items.

These target bullets held in by strong neck tension, no crimping needed, and notice
bullet point will get no marks or dents, fast, easy, no 380-500 buck special dies.
Bushing centering bullet on ogive is very accurate.

OVER 900 375HE cases piled behind presses getting done. About 600 on another
bench nearly ready. Small batches in shelves.And we will do more.

All 375 info, prints, specs, pictures, load data, etc, is public domain, worldwide,
for any target, hunting, etc, use..Ed


[Linked Image]


Ed Hubel
#11725536 - 01/09/17 Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell-- [Re: hubel458]  
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This thread is just damned cool.


Originally Posted by Mannlicher
America needs to understand that our troops are not 'disposable'. Each represents a family; Fathers, Mothers, Sons, Daughters, Cousins, Uncles, Aunts... Our Citizens are our most valuable treasure; we waste far too many.
#11729148 - 01/11/17 Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell-- [Re: hubel458]  
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650gr at 2900fps!!! Holy $hit!

#11730459 - 01/11/17 Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell-- [Re: BCSteve]  
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Originally Posted by BCSteve
650gr at 2900fps!!! Holy $hit!


Ya, that pretty well sums it up. Dang...


#11770459 - 01/25/17 Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell-- [Re: GuyM]  
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222Rem Offline
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If ever the Campfire had a truly epic thread, this one's it.

It's a whole 'nother world I know nothing about, but it's fun reading. Thank you.


Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery.
--Winston Churchill
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