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Campfire 'Bwana
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OP
Campfire 'Bwana
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with varminting season getting here, I get the usual Blue Dot 223 requests start rolling in again..
so from previous years...here ya all go again for those that desire it... have fun
Per requests:
This is for academic reference only and no claims are made...
Disclaimer: use at your own risks... remember to work up if you do use any of these loads... and they only proved to be safe in the rifles I own... not making any inferences otherwise..
Blue Dot Range Report: 223 Caliber ( Full )
Bullet Weights Tested: 1. 35 grain Hornady V Max 2. 40 grain Hornady Vmax 3. 45 grain Sierra SP 4. 50 grain Sierra SMP 5. 52 grain Sierra Boat Tail Match 6. 55 grain Winchester FMJ
Rifle Used: Ruger 77 Mk 2, VT 26 inch Barrel, Stainless Steel First yr Model
Case: Lake City Surplus, previously fired
Primer: Remington 6 ½
Powder: Blue Dot
Charge Weight Tested: 4 grains to 14 grains.
Weather: Sunny, NO clouds, 80 degrees, NO wind,
Altitude: 2000 ft
Humidity: Very Low
Field Results:
35 grain Hornady V Max:
4 grs: 1284 fps 5 grs: 1488 fps 6 grs: 1862 fps 7 grs: 2163 fps 8 grs: 2392 fps
9 grs: 2636 fps 10 grs: 2722 fps 11 grs: 3076 fps 12 grs: 3205 fps 13 grs: NO Reading 14 grs: 3518 fps
Hornady 40 grain Vmax:
4 grs: 1161 fps 5 grs: 1538 fps 6 grs: 1798 fps 7 grs: 2148 fps
8 grs: 2243 fps 9 grs: 2539 fps 10 grs: 2771 fps 11 grs: 2956 fps
12 grs: 3013 fps 13 grs: 3218 fps 14 grs: 3375 fps
Sierra 45 grain SP
4 grs: 1239 fps 5 grs: 1447 fps 6 grs: 1688 fps 7 grs: 1880 fps
8 grs: 2118 fps 9 grs: 2363 fps 10 grs: 2553 fps 11 grs: 2811 fps
12 grs: 2875 fps 13 grs: 3008 fps 14 grs: 3164 fps
Sierra 50 grains SMP
4 grs: 1064 fps 5 grs: 1345 fps 6 grs: 1624 fps 7 grs: 1788 fps
8 grs: 2033 fps 9 grs: 2257 fps 10 grs: 2466 fps 11 grs: 2655 fps 12 grs: 2779 fps
13 grs: 2882 fps 14 grs: 3038 fps
Sierra 52 grain Boattail Hollow Point Match
4 grs: 1061 fps 5grs: 1460 fps 6 grs: 1632 fps 7 grs: 1916 fps
8 grs: 2142 fps 9 grs: 2225 fps 10 gr: NO Reading 11 grs: 2673 fps
12 grs: 2782 fps 13 grs: 2879 fps 14 grs: 3012 fps
Winchester 55 grain FMJ
4 grs: 896 fps 5 grs: 1264 fps 6 grs: 1568 fps 7 grs: 1825 fps 8 grs: 1994 fps
9 grs: 2201 fps 10 grs: 2328 fps 11 grs: 2453 fps
12 grs: 2677 fps 13 grs: 2821 fps 14 grs: 2915 fps
Notes:
1. IN the evaluation of the 223, I came further to the conclusion of the versatility of the 223 in the use of training new shooters, and for a very versatile varmint caliber. 2. Essentially the 223 can be loaded to the specs of a 22 Long rifle, a 218 Bee, a 221 Fireball, a 222 Remington, a 22 Hornet, and a 22 Win Mag., while allowing the shooter to be able to pick the type of bullet that he prefers. 3. Bullets were limited to use of 35 grains to 55 grains. Heavier bullets will not serve any purpose unless a 223 is to be used for deer hunting. I do not believe that their would be a significant difference in the use of a 55 grain bullet vs a 60 grain bullet. 4. The recoil on the lighter loads using 4 to 6 grains of powder had minimal recoil if any at all. These would be ideal for young shooters being trained. 5. Noise level on the lighter loads ( 4 to 6 grains) were on par with a rim fire. An increase in noise level was very noticeable above 7 grains, but still very acceptable. ( No sounding like a rim fire any more)
Noted Observations:
1. It was noted but not considered part of the testing, with a tree used as a back stop for some of the testing, that all bullets ( 45 to 55 grains)penetrated thru the tree at a distance of 20 yds. 2. The diameter of the tree was measured at 5 inches. 3. The 40 grain Vmax loads failed to penetrate the tree at loads above 10 grs, above 2771 fps. However at 10 grains and less, the bullets penetrated thru the tree and did a large amount of damage ( like turning the wood into tooth picks) on the exit side of the tree. The penetration stopped at the 5 grain load.
Some of the Author’s Conclusions:
1. I learned some significant items beyond the versatility of the 223 with the bullets tested, but focusing on its use in the field, got some ideas. 2. A light rifle such as a Winchester Featherweight or Rugers Compact model with a 16.5 inch barrel or the Ultra Light with a 20 inch barrel would make a good combo with the use of Blue Dot. 3. Since the powder is burned cleanly in the first 10 to 12 inches of barrel, the shorter barrels are not handicappiing velocity in the lighter shorter rifles. 4. The penetration of the 40 grain Vmax into the tree did make me ponder the use of those plastic tip varmint rounds as potential loads for small deer for youth shooters. Just like my observations in the larger calibers, the plastic tipped bullet seem to do a lot more damage, at velocities under 2700 fps. The Vmax surprised me. This is a decision any shooter will have to test on his own and make their own decisions. I am just passing on that I saw potential merit in the application. 5. Although one has to weigh out the potential of Plastic Tipped Varmint bullets on bigger game like deer and antelope, some of these loads in real life use, utilizing Barnes’s X bullets in 22 caliber I can recommend. They make a 45 grain, 50 grain and 53 grain bullet. The way I saw much better penetration and more damage in wood, at the lower range velocities, 2200 to 2700 fps, this would make a good deer load in many parts of the USA, and recoil is minimal.
I did not test any bigger bullets as I feel that those tested would be represent the best potential with the powder. 60, 63, 64, 65 grain bullets and then the larger match bullets did not give what I considered useful velocity when I have shot them before with Blue Dot, in respect to their field design uses.
Updated Feb 2008
cheers seafire
Posted 08 February 2008 12:10 PM 08 February 2008 23:10 Hide Post quote: Originally posted by 221Fireball: Seafire2.
How much Blue Dot are you using with the 30 Berger in the 223?
Here is the following info on that range report: this should help you out.. remember to charge a case and then seat the bullet before going onto the next cartridge, that will eliminate the chance of an accidental double charge.. blue dot is bulky tho.. near max charges will not be a problem...
223 Range Report
Powder: Blue Dot
Bullet: Berger 30 grain HP, Varmint
Rifle Used: Ruger 77 VT
Barrel Length: 26 inches
Primer Used: Winchester Small Rifle
Bullet O.A.L. : 15.55 mms
Cartridge O.A.L. : 57.93 mms
10 grs: 2844 fps
11 grs: 3082 fps
12 grs: 3210 fps
13 grs: 3407 fps
14 grs: 3712 fps
15 grs: 3797 fps
15.5 grs: 3814 fps
16 grs: 3873 fps
16.5 grs: 3957 fps.
Accuracy Potential: Load of 15 grains of Blue Dot, 30 gr Berger, WSR primer: 5 shot group size@ 100 yds: 0.4260 –0.224 bullet diameter = 0.202 group size Scope: 6.5 x 20 Simmons.. setting at 10 Power.
Personally my max load is 15 grains.. the extra 150 fps between that and 16.5 grains is not much gained..
Again, these are for academic reference only, anyone using these do so at their own risk, as I can not be responsible for other people’s loading techniques.. these proved to be accurate in my firearms…
seafire feb 2008
"Minus the killings, Washington has one of the lowest crime rates in the Country" Marion Barry, Mayor of Wash DC
“Owning guns is not a right. If it were a right, it would be in the Constitution.” ~Alexandria Ocasio Cortez
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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W O W !.....
thx again ..........
T R U M P W O N !
U L T R A M A G A !
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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I'm gonna print it this time. Thanks Seafire
Molɔ̀ːn Labé Grandpa:the road to hell is paved with good intentions. Dad:son you have 2 choices for supper eat or don't eat.
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
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Almost ready for some 17- 22/250 loads John....
_______________________________________________________ An 8 dollar driveway boy living in a T-111 shack
LOL
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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Are you going to post any 243 win blue dot loads?
Molɔ̀ːn Labé Grandpa:the road to hell is paved with good intentions. Dad:son you have 2 choices for supper eat or don't eat.
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Campfire 'Bwana
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OP
Campfire 'Bwana
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Czech... I just have to locate them... I know they are around here somewhere.. when my hard drive had to get reformated.. I've been looking for stuff for the last 3 or 4 years....
"Minus the killings, Washington has one of the lowest crime rates in the Country" Marion Barry, Mayor of Wash DC
“Owning guns is not a right. If it were a right, it would be in the Constitution.” ~Alexandria Ocasio Cortez
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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It would be appreciated if you can find it.
Molɔ̀ːn Labé Grandpa:the road to hell is paved with good intentions. Dad:son you have 2 choices for supper eat or don't eat.
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Campfire 'Bwana
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OP
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2004
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A little Google Search....
This ought to take care of what you're looking for...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This is for academic purposes only, as I can only verify this data is safe in my rifles.. so if you use it, it is at your own risk...
this is dedicated to member "Ruger # 1".. as it was per his request...
Blue Dot Range Report; 243 Winchester
Rifle Used: Winchester Varmint
Barrel Length: 26 inches
Case Used: Remington New
Primer: Fed 210
Max: Capacity: 41.0 grains
Capacity Tested: 8 ( 20%) to 24 grains ( 60%)
1. Bullet : 55 grain Nosler Ballistic Tip OAL: 67.50 mm
8 grs: 1785 fps 13 grs: 2381 fps 18 grs: 2979 fps 9 grs: 1927 fps 14 grs: 2525 fps 19 grs: 3078 fps 10 grs: 2096 fps 15 grs: 2633 fps 20 grs: 3182 fps 11 grs: 2128 fps 16 grs: 2750 fps 21 grs: 3285 fps 12 grs: 2241 fps 17 grs: 2898 fps 22 grs: 3342 fps
23 grs: 3471 fps 24 grs: 3555 fps
Max Is recommended at 22 grains for reliable brass life.
2. Bullet: 60 grain Sierra Hollow Point OAL; 67.50 mm
8grs: 1675 fps 14grs: 2404 fps 20grs: 3047 fps 9grs: 1779 fps 15grs: 2526 fps 21grs: 3159 fps 10grs: 1869 fps 16grs: 2591 fps 22grs: 3227 fps 11 grs: 2018 fps 17grs: 2718 fps 12grs: 2167 fps 18grs: 2809 fps 23grs: 3286 fps 13 grs: 2305 fps 19grs: 2961 fps
Max is recommended at 22 grains for reliable brass life.
3. Bullet: 75 grain Hornady Hollow Point; OAL: 69.50 mm
8 grs: 1279 fps 13 grs: 2082 fps 18grs: 2604 fps 9grs: 1639 fps 14 grs: 2211 fps 19grs: 2704 fps 10grs: 1755 fps 15grs: 2280 fps 20grs: 2761 fps 11grs: 1882 fps 16grs: 2424 fps 21grs: 2798 fps 12grs: 1989 fps 17grs: 2499 fps 22grs: 2958 fps
75 grain Hornady Continued
23 grs: 3016 fps
Max is recommended at 22 grains for reliable brass life.
3. Bullet: 80 grain Winchester SP: OAL: 69.50 mm
8grs: 1340 fps 14grs: 2159 fps 20grs: 2725 fps 9grs: 1578 fps 15grs: 2265 fps 21grs: 2811 fps 10grs: 1696 fps 16grs: 2298 fps 22grs: 2826 fps 11grs: 1894 fps 17grs: 2462 fps 23grs: 2928 fps 12grs: 1928 fps 18grs: 2552 fps 13grs: 2069 fps 19grs: 2665 fps
Max is recommended at 21 grains for reliable brass life
4. Bullet: 87 grain Hornady SP: OAL: 69.60 mm
8grs: 1057 fps 14grs: 2026 fps 20grs: 2580 fps 9grs: 1434 fps 15grs: 2108 fps 21grs: 2652 fps 10grs: 1558 fps 16grs: 2226 fps 22grs: 2741 fps 11grs: 1683 fps 17grs: 2323 fps 23grs: 2782 fps 12grs: 1806 fps 18grs: 2415 fps 13grs: 1898 fps 19grs: 2487 fps
Max is recommended at 22 grains for reliable brass life.
5. Bullet: 95 grain Nosler Ballistic Tip: OAL: 70.50mm
10grs: 1520 fps 15grs: 2080 fps 20grs: 2514 fps 11grs: 1648 fps 16grs: 2159 fps 21grs: 2601 fps 12grs: 1757 fps 17grs: 2250 fps 22grs: 2693 fps 13grs: 1868 fps 18grs: 2295 fps 23grs: 2740 fps 14grs: 1974 fps 19grs: 2420 fps
Max is recommend at 22 grains for reliable brass life.
6. Bullet: 100 grain Hornady SP; OAL: 69.25 mm
11grs: 1575 fps 16grs: 2113 fps 21grs: 2512 fps 12grs: 1724 fps 17grs: 2207 fps 22grs: 2581 fps 13grs: 1828 fps 18grs: 2299 fps 14grs: 1927 fps 19grs: 2365 fps 15grs: 2019 fps 20grs: 2438 fps
Max is recommended at 21 grains for reliable brass life.
7. Bullet: 105 grain Speer SP; OAL: 70.50 mm
10grs: 1270 fps 16grs: 2050 fps 22grs: 2561 fps 11grs: 1521 fps 17grs: 2142 fps 12grs: 1668 fps 18grs: 2239 fps 13grs: 1757 fps 19grs; 2311 fps 14grs: 1837 fps 20grs: 2412 fps 15grs: 1928 fps 21grs: 2483 fps
Max is recommended at 22 grains for reliable brass life.
Conclusions:
1. I consider the 243 much more versatile for a first rifle using these loads than starting a younger shooter out on a 223 or 22/250. It will duplicate the other two rounds, plus has the ability to handle a heavier bullet while still giving mild recoil characteristics. 2. The 243 offers a wide variety of bullets from 55 grain to 105 grain for hunting, and even 107 and 115 grain bullets for long range target shooting and competition. 3. Some bullets that are lighter than other bullets reach max pressure signs at lower powder charges, than a few heavier bullets. This is caused by the load bearing surface of the bullet.
Observations:
1. Contrary to what is usually seen, or expected: In using trees about 8 inches in diameter as backstops, I noticed that in the 2200 to 2800 fps range, most of the varmint bullets were actually penetrating thru the trees completely. Since they are suppose to be fragile for varmint applications, I did not expect to see this. However It was observed in the 55 grain Ballistic Tip, the 60 grain Sierra Hollow Point and the 75 grain Hornady Hollow Point. 2. Therefore it is my PERSONAL conclusion that these bullets might be considered as potential bullets on deer sized game in parts of the country where deer only get to be Antelope sized animals. 3. If this is done, the results are strictly the responsibility of the handloader and shooter. IN the 2200 to 2800 fps range, the rear core is staying intact and not exploding like is advertised a varmint bullet should do. Over this speed the bullet is performing in the explosive manner as designed. 4. I got input from other shooters on an internet forum asking about their experience with this bullet, there were some successes, some failures, and many recommendations for a larger bullet. However, if someone desires to use these varmint style bullets, I advise testing them yourself and analyse your results before deciding to use them.
As always, work your loads up from a point long before listed maximum.
I hope that this information is useful in teaching new and young shooters how to shoot properly and safely. Recoil will be substantially less than typical factory loads. This should assist in accurate shot placement by the shooter.
Cheers and Good shooting Seafire, May 2004
This data is also applicable for the 6mm Rem.. or close enough for "government work"....and yes, I have tested it in a 6mm Rem also...
"Minus the killings, Washington has one of the lowest crime rates in the Country" Marion Barry, Mayor of Wash DC
“Owning guns is not a right. If it were a right, it would be in the Constitution.” ~Alexandria Ocasio Cortez
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Campfire Ranger
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Originally Posted by Judman PS, if you think Trump is “good” you’re way stupider than I thought! Haha
Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit.
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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There are 2 rules to success:
1. Never tell everything that you know.
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Campfire Regular
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Seafire, I thank you for tainting me, and Alliant thanks you too!!! Now my first thought with a new barrel or new cartridge is how will it shoot with BlueDot.... found almost every cartridge I have tried it in did not disappoint UNTIL I tried 130 grain polymer coated cast bullets in a 308 Win 50% charge in a indoor range did not shoot real well but made some SMOKE filled the whole room I'm not disappointed but the other guys were
if you want change you have to put in your 2 cents, you can't just sit on the sidelines and whine
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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13 gr Bluedot and a 50 Vmax is skookum.
Screw you! I'm voting for Trump again!
Ecc 10:2 The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but that of a fool to the 24HCF.
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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Obey lawful commands. Video interactions. Hold bad cops accountable. Problem solved.
~Molɔ̀ːn Labé Skýla~
Member #547 Join date 3/09/2001
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Campfire Regular
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Darn, just looked for it and was going to send it just to save a bunch of searching.
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Campfire Tracker
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I usually test my bullets up and down the velocity scale to be certain I understand what they will do at both maximum velocity and where the bottom is for reliable expansion. Getting into minimum velocities requires either changing powders or shooting at much longer range which makes my chrony nervous. These loads which I have used for some years now are a safe way to hit those bottom end numbers and get a real test of the bullet at a known velocity.
The lightest bullets are a lot of fun in .223 and.243. Those really fragile bullets are useful for small varmints where you want no ricochets and in middle size varmints they almost never exit when they are moving past a given speed for the bullet. That's also handy if you want the hide.
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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13 gr Bluedot and a 50 Vmax is skookum.
just loaded a 100 rd pack.......used 12 grs with a 55 SBK.......
T R U M P W O N !
U L T R A M A G A !
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Campfire 'Bwana
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OP
Campfire 'Bwana
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Just got finished loading up 50 rounds of 40 grain Varmaggedons and 50 rounds of 50 grain Hornady SPs..
Charge was 14 grains of Blue Dot...going over to the range today and sight in a Howa Mini Action in 223. Figure that will be a handy walking rifle....
Was doing so when I needed a break on doing my son's Taxes for him tonight...
Then my wife's is for this coming evening...so will probably need to reload those I shoot today...
ya know I have come to the conclusion, tax collecting is just like Mafia guys doing a shake down of businesses and people, with "Protection" money....
ya know, if you pay them a lot of money.. then they will leave your family and you alone for a while until they want to shake you down for more money...
its illegal for the Mafia to pull that crap.. but perfectly alright for the Feds and the State Government to do it to the public...
We have a lot of dope smoking lazy welfare abusers and drug addict transients the democRATS want to support so they can expect their votes when they need them...
I hope tax people get reincarnated to sage rats and prairie dogs...
"Minus the killings, Washington has one of the lowest crime rates in the Country" Marion Barry, Mayor of Wash DC
“Owning guns is not a right. If it were a right, it would be in the Constitution.” ~Alexandria Ocasio Cortez
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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Thx Seafire
I used your data as a basis for my Blue Dot 8.2 grain and 50 grain Midway Dogtown SP (Nosler?) load in my 223 and get just under 2200 fps and about 1/2" at 50 yards.
Ed
A person who asks a question is a fool for 5 minutes the person who never asks is a fool forever.
The worst slaves are those that put the chains on themselves.
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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Seafire- You mentioned in the past when BD was hard to find that you were looking at some other powders to replicate the BD loads. Did you ever get around to testing them like you have BD?
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Campfire 'Bwana
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OP
Campfire 'Bwana
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yeah, but then Blue Dot isn't hard to find now...
but a cast bullet manual is a good source...
I've played with Unique, 4198 moreso for low velocity loads...re Ingwe's Bunny loads came from me.. 3031, 2400, my sadly discontinued favorite SR 4759.... 4227...RL 7....
IMR's Blue was a disappointment, at least in Small Rifle use...due to lack of consistency and accuracy... suffered pressure spikes...
"Minus the killings, Washington has one of the lowest crime rates in the Country" Marion Barry, Mayor of Wash DC
“Owning guns is not a right. If it were a right, it would be in the Constitution.” ~Alexandria Ocasio Cortez
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