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Hello Everyone,

Another 'fire member here and I are obviously not agreeing on how this sale should end.

Subject:
Emailed Private Message from 24hourcampfire
From:
rickbin24hourcampfire.com
To:
<<email>>
Date:
Tuesday, April 17, 2018, 12:18:45 AM CDT
24hourcampfire
Hello ,

Contents of your private thread follow:

qwk: Kimber Montana
Could you email me a few pics of each rifle? cobra5oh60hotmail.com Thanks

goldendomer04: Kimber Montana
I will be sure to do that this evening when I get home.
Thanks for the interest.

goldendomer04: Kimber Montana
Pictures are posted:
https:/ / www.24hourcampfire.com/ ubbthreads/ ubbthreads.php/ galleries/ 12755558/ montanas
Thanks!

qwk: Kimber Montana
Which one did you sell? I'm interested in the one with the shiny stock(serial 13190).

goldendomer04: Kimber Montana
Today must be your lucky day.
That one is still available at the moment.

qwk: Kimber Montana
How's the metal condition on that one? Any scratches or nicks?

goldendomer04: Kimber Montana
It has been hunted and is not perfect.
That being said, it is still in good condition. Nothing a bead blast wouldn’t clean up.

I have emailed you two pictures of the only real imperfections I feel are worth noting.

qwk: Kimber Montana
Sorry to be a PIA, but could you send a pic of the barrel junction on the side with the barrel stamping(Kimber manufacturing etc.) thanks

goldendomer04: Kimber Montana
I would be happy to take any pictures you want, but I am not sure of what you are wanting.
Do you just want a picture of the barrel stamping where it says Kimber...260.....etc......?

qwk: Kimber Montana
That and where the barrel meets the receiver.

goldendomer04: Kimber Montana
Ok.
I’ll be able to get you those pictures later this evening.

qwk: Kimber Montana
Sounds good, thanks

goldendomer04: Kimber Montana
Pictures have been sent.

qwk: Kimber Montana
If you can do $1000 shipped without the talleys, I'll take it.

goldendomer04: Kimber Montana
These are my last two Kimbers.
Would you do $1025 shipped with the Talley’s?

goldendomer04: Kimber Montana
Whichever way you prefer, the rifle is yours.
$1000 shipped without the Talleys
Or
$1025 shipped with the Talleys
Would you prefer to pay with a usps money order or through PayPal Friends and Family?
Omar

qwk: Kimber Montana
I'll send you a usps mo next week. Please let me know where to. Thanks

goldendomer04: Kimber Montana
Please send the USPS money order to:
Omar Arizpe
<<Address>>
Please have your FFL holder email a copy of their FFL.
Thanks again,
Omar
<<email>>

qwk: Kimber Montana
Will do.

qwk: Kimber Montana
Payment sent. I'll email you the ffl info later

goldendomer04: Kimber Montana
Thank you!

goldendomer04: Kimber Montana
I received the usps money order.
Once I receive the FFL info, I’ll get you the tracking info.
Thanks again,
Omar

qwk: Kimber Montana
I'll email it to you tomorrow.

qwk: Kimber Montana
Ffl info sent. Thanks

goldendomer04: Kimber Montana
Got it.
I’ll send you tracking info tomorrow.
Thanks again,
Omar

qwk: Kimber Montana
Sounds good

qwk: Kimber Montana
Do you have a tracking #?
goldendomer04: Kimber Montana
Yes sir.
Your rifle is on its way via USPS Priority Mail: 9468903699300003289934
Please let me know when it arrives.
Thanks again,
Omar

qwk: Kimber Montana
Thanks a bunch!

qwk: Kimber Montana
The gun got here, but there was no info on who it's from. Could you email a copy of your drivers license to lolo.sportsgmail.com ASAP, so I could pick it up? Thanks

goldendomer04: Kimber Montana
Done.
Sorry for the inconvenience,
Omar

qwk: Kimber Montana
No problem. I was like a kid on Christmas, but the gun shop said, no. Lol

qwk: Kimber Montana
[bleep], I'm at the gun shop now, and they say they have never received an email yet. He just emailed you from their email address.

qwk: Kimber Montana
About how many rounds did you put through this gun?

goldendomer04: Kimber Montana
12.
And the previous owner told me he shot it very little.

qwk: Kimber Montana
Well the thing is, the crown looks like it has been cut with a pocketknife, and it hasn't been shot since. What's the story on that?

goldendomer04: Kimber Montana
I do not know.
I did not mess with the rifle, and did not notice it while I had it.
If you are not happy with the rifle, send it back and I will refund your money minus shipping.

qwk: Kimber Montana
I can guarantee that the rifle hasn't been shot since the crown was cut. I put it under magnification. I bought it because it was an accurate rifle that I didn't know was messed with. This is the original owner.
https://pistol-forum.com/showthread... 260-Remington-with-scope-mount-and-sling
So if you shot it 12 times, then the story doesn't add up...
I don't want to be out any $$$, since this wasn't mentioned.

goldendomer04: Kimber Montana
I bought this from another member here on the fire.
I'm not sure what you are looking at, but I am looking at a box with 12 spent 260 rounds.
I have offered to return your money minus shipping. If you don't like that, then enjoy the rifle.

qwk: Kimber Montana
You bought this rifle from Mull, who bought it from the guy I sent the link to.
Like I said, if you shot it at all, then the crown was your doing. Why lie? There are shavings still in the end of the barrel for petes-sakes.
Do the right thing, and refund the shipping also. I'll eat the transfer fee I paid.

goldendomer04: Kimber Montana
Do the right thing?
I have never messed with any rifle of mine, much less with a pocket knife. If this was really an issue, why would you transfer the rifle to your name? Now I am going to need to go through and FFL to receive the rifle.
I am not going to eat shipping and FFL fees because you have buyer's remorse.

qwk: Kimber Montana
The ffl wanted nothing to do with this. Once it gets shipped there, it transfers. I had no choice.
This is not buyers remorse. I have bought many guns here with zero issues. This is my first problem.

goldendomer04: Kimber Montana
Sounds like you need a new FFL holder.
I am offering to take back the rifle. If you don't want to pay shipping, then keep the rifle.

qwk: Kimber Montana
Send the Money order.

goldendomer04: Kimber Montana
I'll send the money order after I get the rifle back.

qwk: Kimber Montana
It's obvious you lied, so don't trust you to send the money after you get the rifle back. I'm surprised you just didn't keep the money order I sent.

goldendomer04: Kimber Montana
wow....

Well, then enjoy the rifle.

qwk: Kimber Montana
One last chance to make it right, or you are done selling here, and I'll come teach you some ethics. Your choice.

goldendomer04: Kimber Montana
I am trying to make this right.
I am already willing to eat the FFL fees.
I didn't mess with the crown of the barrel.
I'm not sure why me "making things right" means me:
1) Eating shipping fees.
2) Eating a FFL fee that shouldn't have happened.
3) Sending you a money order before receiving a return.
I'd be happy to place our messages in the classifieds and see what others say.
I'm trying to be fair.
You are name calling, have now threatened me and I am still willing to accept the return minus shipping charges...

qwk: Kimber Montana
I can take a picture of the crown, shavings and all, and post it all on a classified warning thread. Look, I'm not an idiot.

I really don't understand why one would shoot a rifle, then F with the crown. It's bizarre.

I can guarantee you once I post pics, and the entire conversation including zero paperwork being sent to the ffl with the gun, you won't sell another thing here.

I could care less about the $1k, it's the principle of the thing.

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The buyer will be taking pictures to verify the shaving that are in the barrel, but I have never messed with any crowns of any of the rifles I have owned.

I am looking for some honest feedback.

Am I being unreasonable by agreeing to accept the return, absorb the FFL fees, but holding the buyer responsible for the initial shipping fees?

I have not heard of a money order being sent before a rifle is returned.

I'm trying to understand why someone buys a proven shooting gun, shoots it 12 times, then cuts the crown rougher than hell right before selling it. He had the gun approximately 2 months.

Golden is a stand up guy. Have dealt with him on more than one occasion. If your unhappy with the rifle then mail it back to his FFL and get a refund. Pretty simple.

Just a suggestion, but it seems that a reasonable solution would be for the parties to agree on compensation from the seller to have the crown re-cut. I'm guessing that wouldn't be much more than the return shipping and another set of FFL fees. That way, the seller gets the sale and the buyer gets a gun he wants, with a new crown. I mean it doesn't add up that the buyer would screw with the crown just so he could return the rifle. Was it damaged in shipping? Who knows...regardless, it makes more sense to have it repaired, IMHO, at the expense of the seller. That just seems fair. And furthermore, if the seller get it back, it needs to be repaired regardless. So he is going to pay for it one way or the other.

Golden has been a stand up guy in my dealings with him. Let’s see some pics of this crown.

Seems like a fishy story. Buyers remorse maybe?

Send it back. He offered a refund. Many people have said he is a stand up seller, so send it back, Pay for the shipping and call it good. It didn't work out. No reason to get bent out of shape. He's out the initial shipping, you are out the return shipping.

Don't know but qwk sounds like a real tough guy in his last correspondence... sounds like qwk doing safariman hustle on the op.. for the record I bought a model 70 classic from op and it was a great transaction. Far qwk buyers remorse doing a shakedown before you know it he will tell the op to send him $200-$250 bucks back and call it good. He gets a hard to find chambering in a rifle he's been looking for since 2017 on the cheap.

Sounds like buyers remorse to me as well. Had a similar situation on here. Sold a double shotgun. Told the seller to let me know if the FFl required it to be shipped from an FFL. Said it did not. I shipped it. Buyer messaged me all upset that the FFL could not transfer the gun unless he had a copy of my dealers FFL per ATF regs. Well my dealer never logged the gun or shipped it. I get ahold of the receiving FFL explained to him what the regs were and even told the buyer to inform if it had to go through my FFL. Receiving dealer apologized and said all he needed has my name and info. Buyer has it and it is on the box.

Minutes after the conversation with the receiving dealer. Buyer tells me he picked up the gun. And adds he will let me know if it as advertised. Knew right then things were going south. I sold the gun as is. I always do this but I am not a hardass there is room for discussion. Of several dozen guns sold over the years all buyers have been happy and most comment that the gun is way better than advertised. I know I am honest and fair.

Next day I get message to send a copy of my dealers FFL asap as he is returning the gun. He fired it and did not pattern as advertised. Well I never told him it patterned x and x. I told him the barrels were measured at such and such choke. No way in hell would I take back something that was fired. He got all nasty with me. Whatever never heard from him again. I know damn well he did not want the gun upon receiving it for whatever reason. Had I sent the FFL when his receiving FFL claimed he needed it before he could do the transfer,I am sure that gun would of showed up at my dealers door unannounced or I would been informed after it was in transit.

Had he been honest and said hey I looked at the gun have not dome the transfer yet, I don't want it can we work something out. I would have. Once it leaves the dealer it's yours.

As for this situation your being too accommodating. Gun is now in a condition you don't recall it being in so you have a problem that will cost you money to fix. If anything refund his money provided he pays the shipping both ways and your transfer fee to get the gun back. Otherwise it is his.

I wonder if the buyers dealer is also a gunsmith or wanna be gunsmith. Maybe the dealer dropped the gun and mangled the crown and tried to fix things so as to not get blamed for the damage knowing that damn near anyone would know if their gun had a damaged crown. I find it hard to believe a gun can travel how many miles and be handled how many times and shavings were still in the barrel. Either buyers remorse or not so reputable FFL.

It's a Kimber...
Isn't a recrown assumed? And a trigger job?
And bedding...lapping...bolt face work....
Just saying.

What Spud06 says makes sense........

Simple...Pay the shipping and send it back. If $25 for shipping is all that I ever lost on some gun deals I would be way ahead already.

The seller has been more than fair.


After the buyers threat,, I would no longer extend the return offer.

In worse scenario situation!!? The buyer wanted a way out an cut the barrel himself just to try an place blame on the seller doing so? Trust me there’s some idiots out there who would do that.

I have also delt with Golden, never any troubles!

I also have had a smooth deal with Goldendomer....

This. You offered the refund more times than I would have. That offered would have been pulled the second someone doubted my integrity. You wont lose credibility here if you told the guy to enjoy his new rifle.

Safariman? Lol

For the record, I did buy a 260 MT from a honest member here back in Jan, 18. No problems.

This one not so much.

So unmentioned DIY metalwork is ok on the fire classifieds? Sad

Pic to come in a minute.

This is an assumption on your part.
He offered a refund,
You declined.
The end.