Home Forums Reloading Big Game Rifles H4831ssc giving way low velocities

I have this pound of H4831 giving 150-200 FPS slower velocities (in several different rifles) than book loads would suggest. What do I do with it? Exceed max book loads till velocities reach book predictions?? At book max loads for my ‘06, my 165 gr’ bullets are only doing 2650 FPS and my 260, 140’ bullets are doing 2520. Similar data for my 270 wsm. Is this unusual for this powder? I also think I may not have enough case capacity to get to max velocities and still have room to seat the bullets. What say you?

If the books were always right, why would you need a chronograph?

I have found the same thing.
I tried it in a lot of cartridges with pathetic velocities and was about to toss it on the grass when I found a load that worked in my .25/06. Having used it and the original AR2213 since it was created, I am disappointed to the degree I will not tey it again after this lot is loaded.

It seems extraodinary that a well known powder such as this is fine in a single cartrige as it should be and yet a total waste of time in everything it is famous for. Very odd.
John

I have found the same thing.
I tried it in a lot of cartridges with pathetic velocities and was about to toss it on the grass when I found a load that worked in my .25/06. Having used it and the original AR2213 since it was created, I am disappointed to the degree I will not tey it again after this lot is loaded.

It seems extraodinary that a well known powder such as this is fine in a single cartrige as it should be and yet a total waste of time in everything it is famous for. Very odd.
John

I had the same thing happen with H4831 a few years ago. Older powder was about on with what the Nosler book showed, but the new batch was 300 FPS slower and terrible accuracy.

Taking great pains to craft consistent handloads. ALL my rifle loadings chronograph lower than book data even at higher altitudes with slightly lower temps considered. ALL my .44 magnum loadings chronographed, same elevation and temps exceed book values. Go figure.

Can you lengthen your COAL to add a few tenths of grain in the cartridge and have the bolt close properly? Neck sizing, neck turning, concentricity steps?

Are you allowing copper equilibrium as part of your shooting? I use 4831 and 7977 mostly for 7mm and .270 rem. That 260 may benefit from using 4350.

Warmer temps and warmer ammo can increase muzzle velocity, too.

I had a batch of H4831 that was like that, 200-250 fps slow, though accuracy wasnt bad. I now have a can of 4831SC that is pretty close to book speeds. I’d take RL26 over any 4831.

I've noticed that my vintage '60's H-4831 shoots better groups than some of the newer stuff... Some have said that old powder is a bit slower burning than new mfg.

I recently picked up an 8# jug of H-4831 on close out at a LGS. It had been there for a long time and the price was right. I hope it's a good lot.

DF

Interesting thread. I did up some loads with H4831sc/150gn bullets in my rebarreled 7x64 and velocity was low. This was a new bottle too. I used to load H4831sc in my .280 for about 100 - 130 fps more velocity. The 7x64 has a one inch longer barrel then the .280 as well.

Accuracy is superb though.

AR2213sc is H4831sc. Same powder.

Having a ponder about the low velocities, does this indicate that the burning rate is slower?

Yep, I run into the same thing loading for my 270! I've still got 2 lbs left but I found a great use for it. Reduced recoil loads for the wife's 270 😁


Trystan

The .270 is such a great caliber that even if part of the cartridge was filled with sand...all you have to do is holdover a little higher to hit whatever your shooting at!

Has anyone contacted Hodgdon about lot variations with H-4831 and/or H-4831ssc?

DF

First I don't ever recommend exceeding maximum. The powder and bullet companies are experts and do extensive testing. I would always follow their advice. There's a lot of variables when loading. Barrel length, type of bullet etc, etc. H4831 wouldn't be my choice for the 06, IMHO this powder is a little slow burning for the 06. My first choice for 06 with 165's would be either H or IMR 4350. I have found the H4831 to work great in the WSM's. Very accurate powder but not usually the fastest. I'm a Nosler guy and if I follow their exact recipe, primer, casing, powder, barrel length, etc, I am usually very close to their book. Every gun is a little different though. Bullet seating depths also varies pressure and speed. So many variables it is hard to give you a direct answer.

Varget for the 30-06.

The chronograph sure kills well....almost as good as the venerated loads that have worked well in many combinations for decades.

I had the same problem with it in a 30-06. With 180 grain Gamekings I was getting 2630 fps. The couple elk I killed with that load didn't seem to complain about the velocities any though. I've since switched to RL16 and 180 gr Accubonds and am getting 2850 fps with them.

I've run into the same thing with H4831 several times. Same with Ramshot Magnumon occasion. I simply added more powder till velocity picked up - within reason. I wouldn't add 20% more powder......

I have too, but the flip side is, the loads at mediocre velocities were super accurate in a both 7 WSM with 160s and 123's in a .260. The .260 load is still my favorite that I took to AK though.

Yes. My 280AI shot H4831 really well but only at 2850ish with 160's.