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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,998 Likes: 8
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,998 Likes: 8 |
Ringman-Give it a rest already. In other words, stop digging when you are in a hole. This is so simple that it is almost hilarious. I just put the numbers in for 1.5" and 2" scope height. The 2" scope height shows the trajectory is .2" closer to the line of sight. Check your work. .2” is less than a 1/4” it is nothing in the field. I use 1.5” and 2.5” scope height and it is nothing in fact at 1000 yards the drop is identical. You are wrong and always have been wrong and you are the only one that I’ve ever heard make this claim
I got banned on another web site for a debate that happened on this site. That's a first
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 28,951 Likes: 6
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 28,951 Likes: 6 |
Ringman-Give it a rest already. In other words, stop digging when you are in a hole. This is so simple that it is almost hilarious. I just put the numbers in for 1.5" and 2" scope height. The 2" scope height shows the trajectory is .2" closer to the line of sight. Check your work. .2” is less than a 1/4” it is nothing in the field. I use 1.5” and 2.5” scope height and it is nothing in fact at 1000 yards the drop is identical. You are wrong and always have been wrong and you are the only one that I’ve ever heard make this claim Again you are not accepting the fact there is a measurable difference. That is all I have been saying from the beginning. Never did say it would make a difference in the field. Do any of you guys want to humble your self and admit JBM says what I and Barnes discovered?
"Only Christ is the fullness of God's revelation."
Everyday Hunter
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 28,951 Likes: 6
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 28,951 Likes: 6 |
Why is it so important to try to make someone look wrong? Let me help you for the rest of your lives. When my kids were little I told them if you don't respect someone and they say something, it's like the wind in the trees. There's a sound but nothing is being said. Therefore no responce is required. You might take a lesson.
"Only Christ is the fullness of God's revelation."
Everyday Hunter
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,998 Likes: 8
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,998 Likes: 8 |
Ringman-Give it a rest already. In other words, stop digging when you are in a hole. This is so simple that it is almost hilarious. I just put the numbers in for 1.5" and 2" scope height. The 2" scope height shows the trajectory is .2" closer to the line of sight. Check your work. .2” is less than a 1/4” it is nothing in the field. I use 1.5” and 2.5” scope height and it is nothing in fact at 1000 yards the drop is identical. You are wrong and always have been wrong and you are the only one that I’ve ever heard make this claim Again you are not accepting the fact there is a measurable difference. That is all I have been saying from the beginning. Never did say it would make a difference in the field. Do any of you guys want to humble your self and admit JBM says what I and Barnes discovered? BS you said it shot flatter it does not. You are wrong always have been wrong and will not admit it.
I got banned on another web site for a debate that happened on this site. That's a first
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,998 Likes: 8
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,998 Likes: 8 |
Why is it so important to try to make someone look wrong? Let me help you for the rest of your lives. When my kids were little I told them if you don't respect someone and they say something, it's like the wind in the trees. There's a sound but nothing is being said. Therefore no responce is required. You might take a lesson. Facts are facts and BS is BS.
I got banned on another web site for a debate that happened on this site. That's a first
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 42,662 Likes: 12
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 42,662 Likes: 12 |
This is the kind of thread that causes people to climb water towers with sniper rifles and start shooting people.
HINT, people:
Ringworm is a disease caused by infection of the skin by fungus, appearing as scaly, ring-shaped patches. Fergus Fungal Budge was a wizarding product that was used to treat the ringworm disease on the foot.
A good principle to guide me through life: “This is all I have come to expect, standard lackluster performance. Trust nothing, believe no one and realize it will only get worse…”
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 28,951 Likes: 6
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 28,951 Likes: 6 |
Ringman-Give it a rest already. In other words, stop digging when you are in a hole. This is so simple that it is almost hilarious. I just put the numbers in for 1.5" and 2" scope height. The 2" scope height shows the trajectory is .2" closer to the line of sight. Check your work. .2” is less than a 1/4” it is nothing in the field. I use 1.5” and 2.5” scope height and it is nothing in fact at 1000 yards the drop is identical. You are wrong and always have been wrong and you are the only one that I’ve ever heard make this claim Again you are not accepting the fact there is a measurable difference. That is all I have been saying from the beginning. Never did say it would make a difference in the field. Do any of you guys want to humble your self and admit JBM says what I and Barnes discovered? BS you said it shot flatter it does not. You are wrong always have been wrong and will not admit it. Technically it shoots flatter. You are exactly like me. You want to be right, but the numbers are on my side no matter how you try to twist them.
"Only Christ is the fullness of God's revelation."
Everyday Hunter
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Joined: Jan 2010
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 32,130 Likes: 1 |
For background: we went through this exercise with Ringman many years ago on OpticsTalk. It was a very circular sort of thing, but in the end it turned out that his eye pupils do not dilate in low light, so he generally gets no benefit from a larger exit pupil that you get at lower magnifications. There is also some sort of a neural issue with how his brain renders color. The rest of the stories about gunsmiths and all who saw the same thing, I am simply not buying. I have talked to too many people over the years about this and have measured too many optical devices. Sometimes, you hast have to call BS exactly what it is: BS.
You don't "buy" the facts of others' observation because don't accept facts. You claim things you don't know without ever meeting me. You bring up opticstalk. Is that where you used to change my posts? Isn't that the place where you change my profile to tell people I worked for Tasco; when I never have? And isn't that the place where you called me a "village idiot" because I proved you wrong about something so you banded me? Getting “banded”, Village People, and the Ad Homonym.
If you put Taco Bell sauce in your ramen noodles it tastes just like poverty
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Joined: Jan 2010
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 32,130 Likes: 1 |
Technically it shoots flatter. This is insane.
If you put Taco Bell sauce in your ramen noodles it tastes just like poverty
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Joined: Apr 2005
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,998 Likes: 8 |
Thechnically it doesn’t shoot flatter. If you think the numbers are on your side simply because you point the barrel upward more with a high scope mount then you are the village idiot
I got banned on another web site for a debate that happened on this site. That's a first
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,044 Likes: 8
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,044 Likes: 8 |
![[Linked Image]](https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-w5NDs9X/0/92b6b1b1/L/i-w5NDs9X-L.jpg) I do not think Ringman has the capability to understand this, but just in case...
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Joined: Nov 2003
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 28,951 Likes: 6 |
I do not think Ringman has the capability to understand this, but just in case... It seems your numbers don't agree with JBM. Therefore I have no confidence in what you posted. Here are some JBM numbers. Here's what JBM shows for a .30-06 180 grain with a B.C. of .440 and a velocity of 2,700 feet per second zeroed at 200 yards. Sight height of 1.5" 50 yards +0.5" 100 yards +1.4" 300 yards -6.5" Sight height of 2.0" 50 yards +0.1" 100 yards +1.2" 300 yards -6.2" In your science is there a difference in one to the other? There is the way I see the numbers.
Last edited by Ringman; 05/01/18.
"Only Christ is the fullness of God's revelation."
Everyday Hunter
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Joined: Feb 2017
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Campfire Regular
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OP
Campfire Regular
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 2,355 |
So there has been so much on topic discussion I feel like I have probably glossed this over, but pick one (don't suggest another):
Swaro Z5 5-25x52
Leica ER 5 5-25x56
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Joined: Sep 2006
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,044 Likes: 8 |
I do not think Ringman has the capability to understand this, but just in case... It seems your numbers don't agree with JBM. Therefore I have no confidence in what you posted. Here are some JBM numbers. Here's what JBM shows for a .30-06 180 grain with a B.C. of .440 and a velocity of 2,700 feet per second zeroed at 200 yards. Sight height of 1.5" 50 yards +0.5" 100 yards +1.4" 300 yards -6.5" Sight height of 2.0" 50 yards +0.1" 100 yards +1.2" 300 yards -6.2" In your science is there a difference in one to the other? There is the way I see the numbers. The numbers are from JBM and all relevant input data is listed in the picture. ILya
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Joined: Sep 2006
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,044 Likes: 8 |
So there has been so much on topic discussion I feel like I have probably glossed this over, but pick one (don't suggest another):
Swaro Z5 5-25x52
Leica ER 5 5-25x56 These should be very close. However, this one is better than either: http://cameralandny.com/products.html?catalog%5Bsearch%5D%5Btext%5D=56081&catalog%5Bsort%5D%5Bon%5D=relevance&x=0&y=0 ILya
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Joined: Sep 2006
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Posts: 1,044 Likes: 8 |
Last edited by koshkin; 05/01/18.
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Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
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So there has been so much on topic discussion I feel like I have probably glossed this over, but pick one (don't suggest another):
Swaro Z5 5-25x52
Leica ER 5 5-25x56 Swaro, my opinion. However I would ultimately tell you to flip a coin. Heads = Leica, Tales = Swaro. Either way you walk away from this scenario looking better than the demise this thread has resulted in.
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Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
Joined: Nov 2015
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So there has been so much on topic discussion I feel like I have probably glossed this over, but pick one (don't suggest another):
Swaro Z5 5-25x52
Leica ER 5 5-25x56 Swaro, my opinion. However I would ultimately tell you to flip a coin. Heads = Leica, Tales = Swaro. Either way you walk away from this scenario looking better than the demise this thread has resulted in. Get the 3.5x18 in the swaro.. You'll be much happier. If you're going 5x25, get an x5.
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Joined: Nov 2015
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Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 315 |
I do not think Ringman has the capability to understand this, but just in case... It seems your numbers don't agree with JBM. Therefore I have no confidence in what you posted. Here are some JBM numbers. Here's what JBM shows for a .30-06 180 grain with a B.C. of .440 and a velocity of 2,700 feet per second zeroed at 200 yards. Sight height of 1.5" 50 yards +0.5" 100 yards +1.4" 300 yards -6.5" Sight height of 2.0" 50 yards +0.1" 100 yards +1.2" 300 yards -6.2" In your science is there a difference in one to the other? There is the way I see the numbers. It doesn't shoot any flatter, it shoots the same trajectory at a different launch angle. [bleep] oh dear you're special. If I win the lottery, I'm going to buy 24 hour campfire just so I can change your title from Campfire Kahauna to Village idiot. If there was a gofundme to bribe a mod, I'd gladly donate.
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Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 24,670 Likes: 6
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 24,670 Likes: 6 |
Rich, you've got to know when to hold 'em and know when to fold 'em. But I do fancy the idea of turning a 280 into a 280AI with a simple ring swap. 
![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](https://i.imgur.com/X0n16mr.png) WWP53D
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