Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters Why/How does the Creedmoor out run the 260 & 6.5x55?

I have yet to find a factory load that exceeded the accuracy of a reload. Most use Winchester primers, which fail to fire now and again(at the worst time of course), and then some etch your bolt face when they crack around the edge. Then you add in the s h I t t y quality brass of the cheap box of shells, and cheap becomes expensive. It's kind of like how most members of the fire cannot figure out that Lapua brass is cheaper in the long run, because it lasts 3-5X longer than other brands.

This is stuff you figure out by actually shooting, instead of posting s h i t you have no clue about.

I get it, I have a creed, it's not magic. A decent round, but if comparing it to a like twisted 260, or Swede especially in AI, there are no benefits(I don't consider factory ammo a benefit), only a loss of velocity. Like mentioned above, there are quite a few SA rifles available with 3" mag length.

My Creed, a 700 with #2 Shilen, shoots factory ammo, Winchester and Hornady, inch or less. It shoots about any combo around MOA, select reloads, sub half inch. In my experience, that’s unique.

DF

Best Creed load so far, still looking.

Someone who wasn't a loony would just go with that one...

DF

That's exactly the size of the very first 100-yard group from my latest 6.5 Creedmoor. I loaded some 140 Berger VLD's with 41.5 H4350, a load that's shot well in several rifles, and that was the result.

So, how much factory ammo have you actually shot? I have come across some that was superbly accurate. It wasn't expensive either, it was the cheap $hit, and some of it was from my creedmoor. But this is stuff you figure out by actually shooting, instead of posting $hit you have no clue about

Shoot it again, you migh stop looking. Nice cluster.

Enough to know its a waste of money. What is superbly accurate mean to you? You can argue the factory ammo point all you want, but the fact remains that its rarely, if ever more accurate than handloads.

I’ve tried, hard to beat factory 140 ELD-Ms. Not an easy task.

My old Ruger shot them like this repeatedly.



Factory 130 Bergers are about the same.

There have been more than a few PRS wins and top ten finishes with factory Hornady match ammo in both 6mm and 6.5 Creedmoor. Perhaps one can eke out a couple tenths with some inanity such as sorting cases, and weighing every powder charge, etc...or you can go shoot.

I dont even own a 6 or 6.5 Creedmoor...but one has to be quite dense not to comprehend the attraction for those who dont, or cant, reload.

Yep,

The poster complaining about how sorry factory ammo is, hasn't shot factory Creed ammo.

I can beat it with select handloads, but like you said, beating factory stuff isn't all that easy.

I do want to try the 147 ELD-M, 130, 135 and 140 Bergers. In fact, my Creed was throated for VLD's, I have to bump factory stuff back a tad. VLD's loaded to mag length will just about kiss the lands. That's a bit shorter than factory, but seems to work OK. I wouldn't have set it up like that if I was going to stick with factory ammo.

DF

They sure as hell didnt win anything with cheap factory ammo. My whole beef was with the statement that all you need for the creed is "cheap factory ammo". As you go up in price, the ammo quality gets better, but the cheap stuff sucks. Hornady makes some of the worst cheap factory ammo. Out of about 10 boxes of Hornady creed and 708, I got 3 misfires, and one etched bolt face. Compared to one misfire, and zero bolt face etch in over 20k handloads using cci br4 and cci large mag primers.

I really don't get why anyone who shoots more than a few boxes of shells a year wouldn't reload. All you need is a couple of Wilson hand dies, a rubber mallet, a beam scale, and a few plastic bits to make better ammo than most reloaders out there do. If one looks around, it would cost much more than $100.

Hornady Match is about $25 a box...if thats not cheap, I dont know what is....and its exactly what as been used time and time again. George Gardner....yes, that George Gardner, has placed in the top 3 or 4 in several matches with off the shelf Hornady 6mm Creedmoor ammo.

Bitch and moan all you want, your truth isnt reality.

If you’re having that many issues with any major ammo, you need to check your rifles.

Define “cheap”. I consider $22-$24 a box of match ammo “cheap”. You can win national level matches with 6.5 Creedmoor ammo from Walmart.

I’ve shot right at 4,000 rounds of “factory” match ammo this year. It isn’t worth reloading for it, as factory 6mm and 6.5mm Creedmoor match ammo from Hornady and Federal can, and will win any standard sniper/precision match in the country.

I finally realized why qwk's Campfire "name" was so memorable. One a thread a year or two ago he claimed to have fired .1" (that's 1/10th of an inch) 5-shot groups at 100 yards with an unaltered Kimber and handloads put together with standard RCBS expander-ball dies.

There was an attempt to do this at least in Norway and Sweden and specifically for the Saur 2000 rifle with the 6.5x55 SKAN. It is almost completely dead now and I don't see listed ammunition for it. Previous attempts to standardize Swedish and Norwegian chamber specks were also only partially successful. I think they went with the larger of the two so ammo would be interchangeable.

One thing I like to do is to go to out of the way hardware and general stores and see what types of ammo they carry. I like the stores that have their own butcher shops with dry sausage hanging behind the counter. In this informal survey the 260 is the leader with the 6.5x55 a distant second and only a couple stores had 6.5 Creedmoor ammo. It was right there with the 303 Enfield and 8x57 S Ammo. First person I met who actually shoots the Creedmoor is my plumber. He actually reloads for it even though at his hourly rate he could afford to buy ammo.

I think these "debates" or whatever you want to call them are entertaining but you could easy plug in some other cartridges like the 308. If it had been purpose built say with a 168 VLD almost everything said about the Creedmoor would apply. Almost the same with the 260 but it was designed as a hunting cartridge instead of a target round. Although the original 6.5x308 became popular in the silhouette game.

I really don’t know what to say. The 6.5 Creedmoor is very easy to load for, shoots most things quite well, affordable, even cheap by today’s standard, factory ammo is readily available and shoots amazing out of a <$400 rifle. Those are actual observations, not uninformed guesses. What’s not to like?

https://www.targetsportsusa.com/hornady-match-65-creedmoor-140-grain-eld-81500-p-58815.aspx

https://www.outdoorlimited.com/Hornady-6-5-Creedmoor-Match-H81500-140-gr-ELD-Matc-p/h81500.htm

https://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/mobile/product/1042/redirect

Somebody (maybe Steve Szihn) objected to my claim about affordable, accurate factory rifles. He pointed out that any factory rifle will be as affordable and accurate no matter what cartridge it's chambered for.

That has not been my experience with the Creedmoor. For one thing, there are more "affordable" rifles chambered for the 6.5 Creedmoor than there are chambered for, say, the .260 Remington and 6.5x55. A little Googling came up with a price of $289 for the Savage Axis and $353 for the Ruger American Predator. In my experience both are very accurate rifles, but neither is chambered in the .260 or 6.5x55. They are, however, chambered in 6.5 Creedmoor.

Savage chambers a number of rifles in .260, but they're all more expensive models than the Axis--or Ruger American. If somebody does want an accurate, out-of-the-box .260 they'd be worth looking at, as Savage's short-action, detachable magazines are 3" long.

My present 6.5 Creedmoor is a Ruger American Predator, and I paid $350 for it. It's very first 5-shot group at 100 yards measured .33", and while not every group has been like that, it generally hovers around .5 inch with handloads OR factory ammo. I've paid a lot more for custom-barreled rifles that don't shoot any better, and some that didn't shoot as well.

The group I posted earlier was one (of many) groups by a Ruger American Predator and ammo I got for less that $25/box. Injection molded plastic stock and all. If that’s not cheap accuracy I certainly don’t know what is. Most of my hand loads with 140 ELDs, 140 Bergers, 139 Scenars and 140 Partitions we’re in the .4-.6 range. Light bullets like the 125 Partition or 123 Scenars were more like .7. All without ever playing with seating depth. Only bullet that did not shoot well at any one powder charge was the 120 E-Tip. Maybe playing with seating depth would have helped.

Edit: I’m hoping the Fieldcraft I’m waiting to get back shoots almost as well!

E-Tips usually shoot better when seated deeper. Once shrunk groups from 1.5" to .5" by seating .1" deeper.