Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Express Rifles and Big Bores Only Anyone shoot/hunt their 458 WM in the US?

Deleted by OP Not worth the BS

Interesting post, bison even! Let me take a contrary view just to provoke some discussion.

I would be more interested in reading (about effective NA hunting loads with various caliber 458 using jacketed bullets. When I read :"negligible waste of meat" I am thinking of bullets that just pass through with minimal killing effect. I would rather destroy some meat and drop game in their tracks. Imagine a 4,000 ft-lbs energy dump per shot! I do shoot a fair amount of cast, mostly in black powder ctg rfiles and generally not hunting,. I dont image there is much advantage in the added 200f-300 fps shooting cast. That is speculation on my part, I toss this back to the OP.

If I ever get the funds, I plan to build a 458WM to do just as you are doing. I have 2 45-70s, a Marlin and a Ruger No.1, but I would like a bolt action. I would also look at bullets made for the 458 SOCOM if you want something other than cast.....

I used to shoot cast bullets for jack rabbits, hogs and deer. I loaded it at upper end 45-70 level and it worked just like a 45-70. The Sierras would usually open on a deer and there are several newer bullets that would be worth a try. The Woodleighs designed for 45-70 or old express cartridges would be a natural fit. Same with bullets designed for the 454 Casull. Lot's of possibilities.

Just took my Model 70 to the range last week and my newest load is really performing.

Barnes 300gn TSX Cave Point designed for the .45/70 over 78 grains of H 322 and Fed 215's for 2534fps.
4 check groups measured .959", .590", .474" and .526" at 100 yards.

Barnes 350gn TSX over 76gn of H 322 gives 2434fps and .765"
Using 78gn of H 4198 I get 2582fps with single digit SD and around .75 MOA.

Woodleigh 400gn Weldcore over 74gn of H322 gets 2336fps and 74gn of H 4198 gets 2454fps all shooting sub MOA in my Model 70.

Barnes 300gn X bullet was a long time favorite over 75gn of AR 2207 which is H 4198 for 2640fps. Used this one as lot in Oz when culling ferals.

405gn Remington is also a good one with my best shooting done with 73gn of Rel 7 for 2286fps or 67gn of IMR 4198 for 2233fps without pushing the bullets too hard.

John

Deleted by OP

Jeff,
"Using full power loads in a .458 designed for heavy skinned animals gives a pencil hole and a lingering kill.?

That is simply not true. This is misinformation to spread here.

How many animals have you shot with a .458 caliber bullet?
I have shot hundreds with maybe a dozen .45/70's, a half dozen .458's and a .460 Weatherby.
John

Deleted by OP

Missed it by 3 minutes Well, then 458 aside for a minute.

I picked up a Ruger American in 450 Bushmaster this year. It is a light weight and packs a serious punch with 45 caliber pistol bullets. Those are a little smaller diameter than 458 rifle. These guns are out there to satisfy a demand in certain ( special hunting rules) states. The offensive muzzle break screws right off. Light, fun, with an economical bullet selection and it should put some serious hurt on bambi.

Despite the delete, yes I do, have hunted deer and pigs with 500 gr Woodleigh Weldcores, the results go without saying, I believe shooting your bigger bores at smaller animals is great practice, and build confidence as well, I may use my old Browning Safari 458 Win Mag on Nilgai bull this winter, 500 gr Partitions at 2150 fps via H-335 powder will be the message senders this time, anxious to see how they perform on the tough antelope.

Gunner,
There are some great powders available today and the best variety of bullets the .458 ever had, so for me it is the best time in the .458's history to take it out of the safe and use it on everything from pet eradication through to medium and larger game in the interests of both proficiency and also just plain fun.

Also, there is a company called Pro-Loading in Stevensville Montana that is selling Barnes TSX .458 bullets in both 350gn and 450gn for just $22 per 100.
That is not a typo.
John

Nice, I've heard of the new/newer more temp stable powders, my old load with H-335 was built in 95 degree Oklahoma heat, should be GTG for any African hunting, the 450 gr TSX would indeed be a do all end all bullet for the old 458 WM, I love the round AND my old Browning Safari Grade rifle, it's light, accurate, and carries about like a bird gun.

going to google pro loading. LOL

I've shot game with 50 bmg. Not impressive at all. Doe ran like hell for 200 yards with a hole through both lungs.

I've only shot javelina so far with the 458 win mag. No big deal. A bit more damage than I like though with factory federal 350s. Going to have to slow them down I believe. I can' stand wasted meat. Having to trail one a bit after the shot is part of the overall deal for me anyway, IE I enjoy the puzzle and thats that.

Have 405 grain hard cast now, at 19 of Unique. Have shot nothing with that yet.

Will be using heavier hard cast or 450 tsx on brown bear when I get that chance.

That brings back the memories. I remember handling one of those Browning Mausers, new on the rack, back in day. It seemed a little too light and my wallet was light to match. I wish I had got that and still had it today.

I wish you would have grabbed that rifle too, I ran the serial number on mine once, IIRC it dated 1961 or 62, a solid, well built, accurate ALL game bruiser, I bought it many moons ago when I began to read about African hunting...............................12 miles tracking buffalo. ;]

I didn't notice any BS, or I'm I just late to the party?

I always wanted--but never did--to hunt elk or moose with a .458 and the 350 grain TSX. That bullet has three grooves and the .458 has a long freebore. You can crimp it in the second groove and get what amounts to a higher case capacity. If you have a CZ, you can crimp it a groove farther. A guy who used to post here under the handle 458only thought this up. You get the same case capacity as a Lott. I have loaded this bullet to 2700 fps easily. A 30-06 on steroids? According to the computer programs, you get 3000 foot pounds at 300 yards.

The guy I fished with in Alaska had one leaned up in the corner by his recliner. He had it and used it for Brown Bears. He used it as a trooper when he had to go after maneaters. He said it was comforting when he had to go after an aggressive bear. Because when he shot them they dropped dead.

This is the way I am setting my .458 up for allround use. Am currently wringing out more loads and seating depths to find the sweet spot with that 350gn TSX bullet. There is nothing in the US that really needs the 450gn TSX offering but a few on the shelf covers any perceived need.
John

Thats almost funny enough to get a LOL

My .458 gets a work out every fall and winter, Mostly on Nilgai, but I have killed a few Elk,Whitetails, Pigs, and a few dozen Blacktail Jack Rabbits, It's very effective. killed this pig at 153 yrds with IMR 3031 and 350 gr. hornady soft nose. Rio7

Unfortunately, I've never had the opportunity to need anything more stout than cast in my 45's.

Need???

"An utterly foreign word that is mistakenly an inappropriately used in lieu of want".

John

I used a 350gn speer bullet at roughly 2400 fps on a doe. roughly 150 yards. It worked well other than I misplaced my first shot. 2nd shot put r' down quick. The meat damage was comparable to a 30-06. No reason you should not use your 458 on any game you desire.

Having been guiding for Alaskas biggest bears for 39 years, and killed bears with numerous calibers from a 30-06 up to a 505 Gibbs, ( and one 9mm, but that is a different story)
It is no secret that when I have to follow up a wounded bear my rifle of choice is my 458 Win. The more I used other big calibers like the 9.3's, 375's, 416's , 450/400 and 505 , the more I came to appreciate the 458.

Because even though St Ross claims there are no big bears left in Alaska and that I photoshopped all the bears my clients have taken. There are just as big of bears today as there ever were.


https://www.adn.com/alaska-news/wil...rotund-katmai-bear-during-fat-bear-week/

OK Phil, who the F is St. Ross (Seyfried?)

Sorry, should have been more precise, I meant St Ross the Pure and Infallible

Phil, do you like any big 500 grain roundnose or 450 grain TSX in your 458?

I used to prefer the 400 gr TSX but they dropped it. The 400 Swift and Kodiak work great but from long experience I still gravitate toward 500 Rn bullets and the old Hornady interbonds and Swifts work just fine for me.

My double liked the 450 TSX. No more?

10-4, Thanks Phil, my old FN Browning 458 loves the 500 gr Partitions, caught some blemishes on sale at SPS and bought 300 of them, haven't used them on anything, but cant imagine why they 'wouldn't' work, groups really well at 2150 fps.

I think the 450 TSX is still available Jorge.

For twenty years I begged Nosler to make a .458 bullet and by the time they finally came out with one I was pretty happy with the various RN bullets I was using and in the 458 don't see any need for a spitzer bullet.
But I do plan on giving them a try, maybe this coming year on Cape buffalo

Funny how that works sometime, what got my interest up about the 458 cal 500 gr partitions was the semi-spritzer shape, my rudimentary thought process hoped they would delay expansion a bit longer on really tough game like the cape buffalo you mentioned, had I got a leopard permit, I would have been in Moz chasing buffalo in the long grass exactly right now.

Please keep us posted on your buffalo hunt.

That 400gn Barnes X bullet was terrific, very accurate and deep 5 feet plus penetration if you can find an animal that large.
Still have a few loaded for my .458 but the 350gn TSX would cover the same usage for most game and the 450TSX for dangerous game.

I don't use a lot of 500 grain bullets preferring to jump to the 550gn Woodleigh if I want pure thump on impact, though some of the 500's are equally, very accurate in their own right. Sometimes I have to remind myself the .458 is a purpose build cartridge, because I have carried mine even after deer.
John

Amen...

You preaching to the choir...

DF

The 458 is great fun when loaded to around 45/70 velocities with either cast or jacketed bullets. The 350 grain bullets really get a Jack Rabbits attention they work well on Javelina, Hogs and Deer. It would be fun to try the pointy lever action bullets in a modern express load. Call it a 45 Nitro and go hunting.

So what is it about big bears that keeps you going back?

Fondly remember the first time I shot a .458 Win, a bit over 30 years ago. Fellow I knew had returned from Africa, and though he'd planned to sell his 458 Model 70... He just loved the rifle too much by then. Too many good memories.

So, he downloaded it with the 400 gr Speer bullet and the 350 gr Hornady Round Nose. Happily hunted black bear and whitetail. He loved that doggone rifle.

I enjoyed it too - and those first few shots with 500 gr factory ammo woke me up a bit.

So no, I haven't hunted with a 458 Win, but have good memories of a fellow who did.

Guy

My Old Ugly clone with a nicer paint job!

Wish I'd never sold mine....

-Jake

Was digging threw some ammo cans last night and found 5 1/2 boxes of .458 500 gr. solids,the silver ones, don't remember where I got them, was thinking I could load them up and use them for pigs, in my 45-70 #1 or my 450 Howell, load them to 1100 to 1200 fps . so they don't recoil real hard, should be fun. Rio7

How affective on big bears is the 300 TSX your daughter uses? At the velocity I'd think that it would be impressive but have no experience with it on big bears

I agree , great question . I see no B.S in the original post .

I acquired my M70 Super Grade ( 22 inch barrel ) after it being offered to me from a friend . All I had to do was buy $500 of factory ammunition and the rifle came with it . However , It did need to be re-blued so I had that done after glass bead blasting it to a nice matte finish . The original finish was that high luster blue on all of the metal except the matte frame . I guess that was the style back then and looked ridiculous . It all matches now and is the apple of my eye .

I have used it to hunt whitetail using 66.0 grains of IMR 3031 and the Sierra 300 soft point @ 2200 fps with absolute excellent results . That bullet between 2000 – 2200 fps duplicates my Savage smokeless muzzleloader and sort of duplicates the heft of the arm also …

I have been wanting to try the Hornady 325 grain 458 FTX ( rated for 1600 – 2400 fps ) and the Hornady 250 grain 458 Mono-Flex bullet ( rated for 1100 – 2200 fps ) on targets and whitetail .

You can use a 458 WM for other things besides extremely large and dangerous game . Just match the bullet and velocity for the intended purpose . I have several thousand bullets for my 14 inch TC Contender in 45/70 , and so it just made sense to buy this rifle .

It is a tack driver as much as a 45 WM can be .

BR,
Yes you have a very flexible .458 rifle.

My .458 rifle is an 1886 45-90 with 96% of the powder capacity of yours.
Most of my hunting has been with 300 grain bullets at velocities between 1800 and 2200 fps and this has been suitable for all deer, hogs, and several exotics.

For Africa, we hand loaded 300 grain Nosler PP bullets to 2200 fps and they were very effective for plains game and leopard.
For larger DG, (ele and Cape buff) we used 450 grain Kodiak FMJ and it proved to be excellent on Cape Buffalo and back in Texas, on Bison .
The Kodiak would have been OK for body shots on ele, but for frontal brain shots, 450 grain NF solids and Punch bullets were perfect- shot through head and into body.
You can load your rifle up or down and hunt most any medium to big to dangerous game with it.
Enjoy and Good Hunting!

Thank you sir ….

I’m from the northeast ( Maine and CT ) and had a few friends ask : “ why on god’s green earth do you have that thing ? “ . I’ve always replied with : the 458 WM can be a 45-120 , 45-100 , 45-90 , 45-70 or a repeating smokeless muzzleloader .

When did Nosler discontinue the 458 / 300 grain Protected Point ?

The only 300 grainer I see in the catalog is the Combined Technologies ( Silvertip RN ) fodder with the black Luba-Lox coating on it ?

Not sure of the date, but no worries as I have a good supply of loaded 45-90 PP ammo from our African bullet testing trip.
Another winner is the Alaska Bullet Works Kodiak. I also have some of those 2150 fps 450 grain FMJ for my 45-90 . :):):)


All this reminds me - it is my 45-90 turn for hog killing soon. My 1886 elves to elephants rifle; not seen and elves yet but it has taken ele , Cape Buff,Bison, etc.

Took my .458 Model 70 back to the range a few days ago. 300gn Barnes FNHP designed for the .45/70 cut into each other at 50 yards dead center..
Time to move it out to 100 and nudge it up a little..

30 years ago I hoarded and used the Barnes 300 grain spitzer 458 “ Originals “ in my 14” Contender and later on , used them in my Savage smokeless muzzle loader . Super accurate .

Too bad they discontinued them .

Why a 458?
Because I wanted to find out what owning, shooting, handloading, and hunting with one was like.
A trip to Africa is not required to own one.
It’s fun as heck to play with a 458!
I’ve only taken a couple of small deer with mine so far but I now KNOW that having a 458 is a hoot. I’m on my second one now, a Ruger No.1. There are a LOT of projectiles a guy can shoot through a .458 bore.

.458 Winchester rifles tend to be very accurate. They are a life insurance policy against anything that breathes.
I will be carrying one after the vicious whitetail that may threaten my person this year.

John, I use the Barnes 250 gr. "cave point" TTSX, in my BPCR 45-70 for primitive season. I'm running a Barnes Marlin level load at 2,550 fps with Vv n-120. It may even be faster than that out of the 30" Badger barrel, haven't clocked it.

That bullet will blow lung tissue and a bucket of blood out the far chest on a hog or WT. And, it's pretty accurate. I have a CDS set up for that load and can keep them centered on a pie plate out to 300 yds., around 5" or so. Not so primitive, IMO..

DF

DF,
I have tried that bullet too and it is everything you say, but I leaned toward the 300gn because it seems to be more common on the dealer shelves. Because it is is a mono, it also approximates the 400 grainers of conventional CupnCore for size.

If shooting kangaroos and pigs with a 458 is a sin, I will be in hell for a long time:) I always loved them with 400 grain Speer and either 70 grains of 4064 or 70 grains of an Australian powder we use to have with a burn rate like 3031. Te 4064 did right on 2000 f/s and the 3031 like powder was right at 2100 f/s. Both loads very accurate.