Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunting Rifles 280AI vs 270 Winchester

Yes, and Berger makes a 195g .284" bullet, B.C. .755.

And Barnes makes .284" TSX bullets in 120g, 140g, 150g, 160g and 175g. All except the 120g have a higher B.C. than any of the .277" TSX bullets.

Just sayin'.

I'll give you a good argument.

Ruger blue/synthetic Hawkeye .280 Rem for $499.
https://www.cdnnsports.com/280-hm77rp-22-syn.html?___SID=U#.W3uf7ZNKjGI

Bought one of these in stainless/synthetic a few years back and love it. Sub-MOA shooter. Ringing my steel gongs at 500 is child's play. The clay pigeons at 600 are more of a challenge.

Neither a .270 Win or a .280AI but arguably the best of both worlds, especially if handloaded to .270 and .280AI pressures. (65,000 SAAMI MAP vs the .280 Rem SAAMI MAP of 60,000psi)

Brass is plentiful and priced about the same as .270 Win.

Does 195 Berger and 175 barnes correctly stabilise in your .280 barrel or any factory barrel?

Berger rec.min 8.3" twist
Barnes rec.minimum 9" twist for 175 tsx and 8" twist for 168 LRX.

So to get all that superior 7mm bullet selection one needs a custom barrel.

From what I understand,180 Woodleigh will properly stabilise in 1:10 270cal




Current Kimber specs indicate 1:9" but in other places its specified as 1:9.5"

After having some factory Sakos in .270win, a full house walnut custom .270win
and factory .270 Wby ...
I was then going to jump to a custom titanium/syn. .280AI as my do all main rig,
but the custom shop received military contracts for the Iraq and Afghanistan wars
and stopped taking civilian orders, then I lost interest in the idea.

A good smith will get .280AI to feed reliably, which was my main concern with the project.
I had specified a custom vertical stack( ie; non-staggered) magazine arrangement which
would have helped things.

what I liked about .280 AI was its cool factor and ample power, and that I no longer would
have the urge to push 7x57 loads to crazy limits...
I didnt want a hyper pressure .280 AI to tickle the heels of the 7mmMag like some folks,
I wanted a round to achieve my target MVs with good relative margin of safety.

According to Barnes their 140gr. .277 TSX @.404 BC, beats the ballistic coefficients of the 120gr.,140gr., and 160gr. .284 TSX and almost matches the 150gr. @ .408.

Yup. Those were the choices. Once in an old time Gunshop I stumbled into a box of 150 Core-Lokts.

Coming back to this one. "Those who understand how Barnes bullets work" also understand that the 280 AI wins the race shooting similar weight bullets due to both the larger bore cross-section and higher powder capacity.

Are we limited to factory barrels here? All the bullets we're talking about are going to be used by people who load their own ammo., you don't think any of "those people" might have a custom barrel or two do you?

No problem with custom barrels, but I've never found a need for anything heavier than 162g in my 7mm RM. If/when I shoot the barrel out and replace it, a 1-8 twist isn't any more trouble than something else.

Trystan said .284" bullets were stuck in a rut when it comes to high BCs. Just pointing out some of the bullets that are out there that contradict his claim.

Personally, I'd rather have a good 6.5-06, standard or AI, than a .270. And do. My 6.506AI is Krieger barreled and 1-8 twisted.

You are correct - I missed that one. But the 150g and 175g .284" still beat it in terms of B.C. with values of .408 and .417 respectively.

Not that it matters to me as I use TTSX and LRX rather than TSX. All three of the .284" LRX beat the one .277" LRX in terms of B.C. Two of the four .284" TTSX beat all three of the .277" TTSX in terms of B.C., and a third essentially matches the best .277" TTSX (.373 vs .377).

All of which is kind of moot to me - so long as i can get good bullets for a particular cartridge I'm good to go, Chose the .284" diameter first with a 7mm RM, which handily beats the .270 Win in terms of long range ballistics. Added a .280 Rem 30+ years later because I already had a large stash of .284" bullets. Would have been perfectly happy with a .270 Win otherwise, as the .280 was intended as a rifle for my daughters to use. That didn't work out - one uses my .257 Roberts and the other got a .308 Win. - so I'm "stuck" with the .280. If thats a bad thing, I'll take more of the same.

A .280 AI never interested me because I still have the 7mm RM.

Man, is it hunting season yet?

40 days away (October) for our annual family antelope hunt in WY. Colorado elk later that month.

Planning on at least 3 trips to the range with different family members before then.

No! That's not what I said..........i said it was stuck in a rut as in there are smaller calibers that are suited better for deer hunting and there are larger calibers suited better for elk hunting. The seven sits right in the middle floating around like a redheaded stepchild that runs to fast for the special Olympics but is to slow for the real Olympics. 😒😁😁😁




Trystan

I doubt that there are bigger calibers better suited to elk hunting than 7mm. Seriously. With the bullets available today, I very much doubt that. In fact, I dare say that statement is just plain wrong.



I also doubt that any human walking could differentiate the wound channels between animals killed with a 270 vs 280AI, and I'd say the same regarding the difference in animal response to being hit between those two. Hell, the deer I've killed with 223 react exactly like the ones I've killed with 2x the caliber or 2.5x the powder. And elk can't be trusted to respond to being hit at all, regardless of what I've hit them with, or seen them hit with.

I do appreciate the quadruple-hair-splitting going on here though. An exemplary pre-season campfire thread!

11 days for Archery. 82 days for Rifle... Don't tell anyone. But, Kentucky White Tails can still be killed with a .270 Win shooting a C&C bullet. ...

If you want to have more bullet selection and shoot heavier and your at 300 yards max.
Why not Use the old faithful parent cartridge 30/06 or step up to 338-06 for some real thumping.
Is there 338-06 ai?

You're right, the .270 is a great cartridge. Flat-shooting without too much recoil, great bullet selection, and so on. The .280 AI is just a little bit better.

You must be hunting the fabled armor plated elk if you truly believe all that crap you just typed.



Me I'd just slip a 140 grain .277 bullet throughout the chinks and call it a day. You obviously don't follow the advice in your signature line very well.

It’s amazing how many armor plated elk must be out there, I’ve met quite a few people who go out every year expecting to find one!


Sadly I haven’t found one yet.

that just blows another hole in the 7mm greater bullet selection argument...in that most people only utilise
a small selection of whats available,... and likely for two main reasons;
- common 7mm barrel twists limit the variety of projectiles one can practically use
- the majority of hunters typically have a narrow band of loyalty and/or typical stick to tried and true
by experience or on sound recommendation.

People with greater practical sense are more interested in terminal performance , not number crunching
highest BCs and energy/vel graph plotted nuances (at the shooting distance limits most people operate within)

Rem700 7-mag 1:9 1/4" twist
Howa 1500 1:9:5"
Vanguard 1:9.5"
Sako 1:9.5"
M70 1:9.5"
X -Bolt 1:9.5"
Savage 1:9.5"
Tikka 1:9.5"
Kimber 1:9.5"

that puts the super duper BC pills and xtra long monometals out of the game for most 7-Mag owners.