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Whether Christ's or not<yet>, all a person really has is this moment in time..The rest is hope and plans and dreams, sometimes procrastinated..
NOW is the acceptable time, TODAY is the day of salvation..

So whether one has accepted Christ and confessed Him as Lord and Savior in days past or one has yet to take that step of faith,

this moment in time is what one has, and his or her state and relationship with Christ at this moment, should he get run over by a runaway garbage truck and die, is crucial..

Choose wisely every moment and every word and deed ...let them reflect and glorify the Creator and His Son..

This Life and Gospel IN Christ is quite simple...but a person must take that first step of faith..and then just keep walking in that faith a moment at a time..Jim

To be frank, the whole Christ thing is my only hang-up. Never could buy in.

The old Book was a bit tough to live by, lets write a new one and accept Christ and all is good. I realize that is a short and simple explination, but you get the idea.

That would be accurate if it was all just a story on a page. The law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ - - that we might be saved by grace. Accepting Christ, as some put it, is more than an acknowledgement in the brain that He was who He said He was. It is a deep seated knowledge and faith in the heart that He IS who He said He IS. Throw in a little measure of true repentance, and it'll change your life like nothing you ever imagined. Ask anyone who has ever experienced it . . . . . . . ask ME!

Hi, Steelhead. I'm not sure what you mean when you say the whole "Christ thing" is your only hangup. Do you mean that it is hard for you to believe that salvation is given only to those who accept Him?

I agree that the Bible is hard to live by. I accepted Christ a number of years ago, and I still sin. But each day is a new beginning and a new opportunity to do it the right way. And in spite of how many times I fall, I know that my Father still loves me.

The Bible is the history of God's relationship with His people. There is no need to write a new one (we cannot go into the past and change history.) And because God doesn't change, there is no need for a new one. The old one is still valid.

God IS good, and God IS love. Accept Christ and all that is good? Why do we need a New Book to do that?

Penny

Can't fathom needing to go through Christ to reach God. Is Christ God?

He is. God is a bit more complex than we can truly fathom. Jesus is the part of God who is our Creator, Savior, and Intercessor that allows us access to the other aspects of God.

Why the problem with Jesus? He doesn't ask for much but gives it all. I can't see what's not to like with that kind of deal.

So if I Christ is God, then if I believe and follow God, don't I by default believe in Christ? So is it that God is just one in the form of two?

Christ, the cross, etc kinda smacks the first 2 Commandments...

Yes, God manifest in the flesh.

That is why I said that the actual number who will be saved is sadly less than the one-third figure that was mentioned. The idea of totally depending on someone else (God, in this case) because you are not worthy or even able to accomplish a thing yourself is hard to accept for most people. They want to think that they are able to do something to better themselves, and as far as salvation goes, they cannot.

You comment about the Old Testament being too hard is both right and not. No, we could not keep the law, but that wasn't the point of the book. The law was never intended to save anyone, just teach us how vile and without hope we are. We all know we aren't perfect. We know we can't keep any law perfectly even all week, let alone keep the entire law of God for all our life.

So then, the question of Christ comes up.

The first time in the Bible that Christ appears, and the first time we start seeing the gospel story is in the first book. Genesis is the story of beginnings, especially the beginning of God's love for us. It is soon apparent that the entire Bible is the story of God working to redeem fallen men and women. Far before the New Testament we see history is actually His story. In each turn of the page we see the blood of the Lamb of God, shed for us.

I pray that your eyes may some day see this and your heart understand that we were the ones who broke God's laws, that He was the one who rightfully passed judgment and decreed how the curse of sin we caused could be lifted, and that He paid the price of that salvation. The joy of His love is the gift within reach, but only on His terms.

So the only way to the Father is through the Son, but the Son is the Father, or the Father is the Son (kind of a chicken egg thing).

So if I believe in God, why does it matter as to what His appearence is?

"Thou shalt have no other gods before me" so we must worship the one God. But now Christ is God, then God is Christ? So if someone doesn't believe that Christ is the son of God (which I don't), that would be correct? Christ is God..

Why does he have so many AKA's?

I believe in God, why is that not good enough? After all God is Christ and vice versa.

So when Christ says "Father, forgive them, for they know not what they do" then he is actually speaking to himself?

Steelhead,
God asked Abraham to sacrifice his only son, Isaac, which Abraham was willing to do. But God was only testing Abrahams faith and saved Isaac and provided a lamb for Abraham to complete the sacrifice. Isaac's birth was a miraculous one and began God's covenant with Israel. All this was a foreshadowing of a better sacrifice and a better covenant to come.

That was fulfilled with the miraculous birth of Jesus. He was the ultimate lamb that God provided who was perfect in all His ways because He was fully God as well as fully man. It was only a sacrifice of such perfection that could free mankind from the sin curse that condemns us all unless by faith we acknowledge the sacrifice Christ made for each of us. Jesus was as much God's son as Isaac was Abrahams but both were provided by God's Grace and Mercy to allow us fellowhip with Him.

So Christ is not God? He is God's son?

Why do people say "Christ our Lord" if Christ isn't God?

I'm soooooooo confused.

If Christ is God, than saying Christ is my savior is the same as saying God is my savior.

Why would God ask man to sin?

Actually, God is one in the form of three: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. The Hebrew word that is sometimes used is "echad," which means "one" like a bunch of grapes is one... one made up of several.

I'll respond more to your messages later... but I've got to leave right now. I'll be back later, though.

Penny

People confuse many things about God. Usually the presumptions we have, the assumptions we make about God and our relationship with Him, are at the heart of this confusion.

We are told that Christ is God, then that He is the son of God. These concepts generate an image in our mind that causes confusion because we make assumptions about them. Nicodemus in John chapter 3 was torn by the idea of being born again. How, he questioned, could a man enter into his mother's womb and be born again when he is old? These assumptions and misconceptions cause confusion. It is understandable, but doesn't have to remain that way.

Before He came to earth Christ was a spirit. Jesus Himself tells us this with the woman at the well. But a spirit doesn't have blood, and it is the blood that makes payment for our sin, that makes atonement for our soul. So to do this the Father directed the Holy Spirit to cause a virgin to be with child so that Christ could enter and have a body with blood ("A body He prepared me"). Therefore, that holy child who was born is called the son of God. The Father did not have relations with Mary, and have Jesus nine months later. The Father ordained, the Holy Spirit caused, and the Word agreed to be payment by being incarnate in the body prepared. That is the reason Jesus is called all man and all God. He is not some half breed demigod.

Before the incarnation Jesus was called (and still is) the Word. He was that aspect of the triunity of God Who spoke the universe into being. At the incarnation He came to be called the Son, but He is the same being as the creator God. The Father is that aspect of God Who planned all things. The Spirit is that aspect of God Who makes the will of God effective in creation.

We can confuse ourselves by trying to understand everything about the Godhead, but we simply are not able to understand everything about an infinite God. For this reason (our limited ability to comprehend the infinite) is why God uses over 400 names for Himself in the Bible. These names describe some aspect of the infinite and help us to understand some sliver of the Holy One.

Take comfort in the fact that God completely understands you, and loves you. He will seek you as long as you don't tell Him to stop.

A pint 'a Crown will do that to a guy. Read it again after a couple cups of coffee in the morning.

Actually, that was Nicodemus.
Dick

Man is 3 dimensional. We're limited by space and time. We can't visualize how someone can be 1 and 3 at the same time. We must take the Bible for what it says and believe that God is beyond our physical restraints.

Yes, Jesus is God. Yes, Jesus is separate from God in a sense. When Jesus was on earth, he became like men physically for a few years. He became lower than the angels with a mortal body. After his resurrection, he reclaimed his immortal body and again was part of God.

We are saved by faith and that faith requires a belief that Jesus is indeed God. Jesus is God's physical body. We see him many times throughout the Old Testament where he is often called the Angel of the Lord. No man can see God and live but we can see Him in Jesus and live. Abraham saw him before the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah. Jacob wrestled with him. Moses saw him in the burning bush. Each time, the man worshiped him and acknowledged him as God.

Dick

Steelhead , you are doing an excellent job of playing " devil's advocate ".I sincerely hope you are "playing".If you are not :

Everyone on this forum is in the same position as the early " christian fathers " in that the human mind cannot comprehend a self existant being who existed from all time and has no " first cause " , but IS the first cause . They got around the difficulty by defining God in the negative ;" This is not Thou ; neither art Thou this ."

The bible was written for people who have come to believe in Christ - or at least in the possibility of Christ - via another medium . That medium is the third part of the Trinity , The Holy Spirit . He can work directly in the subject's own own mind and " soul " , or through another human . In the analogy , that would be Mary ; on this thread , it would be Penny .

If I take the position that there is no Truth to be found outside the bible [ and I don't ] I have to jump through a lot of hoops and parse words to get everything to fit to satisfy my intellect . If one believes , as I do and suspect that you do , that God reveals Himself in His creation [ and the bible is just one part of His creation ] then the bible is very good at explaining what I see .

An honest Christian has a difficult "selling job ". I have to tell you that a man was born , was cucified unto death , and became alive again and still lives and has made it possible , in some fashion we can't really comprehend , for all of mankind to gain our rightful relation to God .If you can believe a man died and was resurected , nothing else in the bible is un-believable .

Now here is the deal maker ; you only have to be WILLING to believe that the person known as Jesus is God made manifest . An adult faith requires that we have previously allowed ourself to believe that the opposite may also be true ; that He is the greatest farce ever visited on human beings .You've got that part done already .

Next time you are communing with God as you understand Him , tell Him you sort of would like to be able to consider the Christian deal as a valid one . You ain't bought into anything at that point , you are just asking the God that made you to open your mind to the possibility .If Jesus is alive and is God , He will make Himself known to you . Maybe quickly , maybe a slow revealing .

If He is a farce , nothing will happen and you ain't lost a thing .

Regardless of what you read on this forum - or anywhere else for that matter - it REALLY is that simple !

Supposed to be bad thunderstorms today so I'm postponing the fishing deal . He can calm the waters , but I can't ask ! [It would be selfish since we need the rain]