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Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 31,429
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 31,429 |
"I can't be canceled, because, I don't give a fuuck!"
--- Kid Rock 2022
Holocaust Deniers, the ultimate perverted dipchits: Bristoe, TheRealHawkeye, stophel, Ghostinthemachine, anyone else?
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,525 Likes: 2
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,525 Likes: 2 |
It’s fairly simple to run down each piece of equipment to determine if it’s the cause of shooting issues. It does eat up time and it’s frustrating as hell having to do it...See Fred’s post on his VX6 Scope failure as a perfect example of running to ground a problem.
Exactly. As Fred found in this case, back when I used to use a lot of Leupold and similar scopes, "swap scopes" was number 1 on my list of most likely solutions. Not anymore.
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Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 20,824
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 20,824 |
You bitches be jealous of my Adirondack trophy buck...... ha
Originally Posted by Judman
PS, if you think Trump is “good” you’re way stupider than I thought! Haha
Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit.
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 19,250 Likes: 4
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 19,250 Likes: 4 |
Oh i see you're editing your posts now. good idea.
Mark Twain quote:
“Never argue with stupid people, they will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience.”
You have that tied up with experience. Good luck in life. I have to edit often because I am a terrible typer ...... and Kingston get's after me for grammatical errors. Thank you for your concern regarding my luck in life..... bit it is unnecessary I seem to manage fine..... I would like to get off my couch and shoot a gun though... someday... hahahahahaha Oh and I CAN hit a target at 630yds and 718 yds etc.... over and over again.... hahahahaha Different skillsets for different hunting conditions. I can throw an appe in the air and bust it 9 out of 10 with my iron sighted .30-30. Sometimes the ability to hit fast moving game at close range is important to my success where I hunt. Can you do that with your rig ? I can hit a 3" diameter bull offhand at 75 yards consistently with any of my deer rifles, iron sights or scope. That skillset is also important to my success and I practice it diligently. Can you best that with your rig ? Different skillsets for different conditions. Blacheart, I am not a long range hunter, I do enjoy long range shooting, gongs mostly, I will snipe a long range varmint though. I have everything from an open sighted 30-30 to long range rifles with dialable scopes. Around my current home the forest is relatively thick and the ranges tend to be short, so a low power scope isn't necessarily a handicap and a fine tuned rifle unnecessary, most of the time... long range opportunities do exist though as I am in the mountains. But I do travel and hunt wide open country and the shots do average 300yds and find all the consistent accuracy I can get important. As far as hitting a 3" bull offhand at 75 yds. yes not always of course. I have a 3" gong that is 50yds from my porch and I hit it more times than not with my Rem 581 22lr open sight, I have found I hit it much more often with my CZ 452 with a Weaver 4X though. I find no handicap at close range with a scope. As I said before, where I hunt there is rarely an opportunity for a shot at a deer more than 100 yards away. Most are much closer and I shoot many inside 30 yards. That's why 95% of my practice is done offhand. I rarely shoot a deer any other way. I have steel spinners set up out in the back yard and step out several times a week with one of my .22's and bang off 50-100 rds of .22LR at the spinners. The 2"diameter spinner is set at 65 yards and I'll average 8 - 9 hits for every 10 shots on it. My record on that spinner is 78 hits in a row without a miss.
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Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 20,824
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 20,824 |
Did somebody mention DeFlave? Catskills trophy buck..... ha ![[Linked Image]](https://i.postimg.cc/SNbrYFDS/IMG-1724.jpg)
Originally Posted by Judman
PS, if you think Trump is “good” you’re way stupider than I thought! Haha
Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit.
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 29,383
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 29,383 |
Did somebody mention DeFlave? Catskills trophy buck..... ha Must be a logged over area in the Catskills 
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Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 20,824
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 20,824 |
Clear cut...... Catskills
Originally Posted by Judman
PS, if you think Trump is “good” you’re way stupider than I thought! Haha
Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit.
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,525 Likes: 2
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,525 Likes: 2 |
There are two issues that need to be clearly identified in these discussions:
- "Good enough" for me and my application may not be for someone else. For the guy that shoots moose at 100 yards or less, a 0.5-1 MOA random POI shift goes unnoticed and is not a problem. For the next guy shooting a 6BR that is capable of shooting in the 0.2's, a 0.5 MOA random reticle shift is unacceptable.
- The probability/likelihood of a scope starting to exhibit new POI shift behaviours varies with different brands and models of scopes. It's probably safe to say that the average NF scope can go many thousands more rounds before random POI shift starts to occur than the average Leupold. So just because something has behaved well for a few hundred, or even a thousand rounds, that doesn't mean it will continue to do so.
While that assessment may meet your criteria when you say that the "scope and barrel are fine", it really doesn't say all that much about the zero retention/POI shift behaviour of the scope, nor the condition of the barrel. Rather than a single shot at 100 and another at 200, shooting groups and measuring velocity can indicate the condition of the barrel, and repeated, consistently-sized and centered 3-shot groups can show how the scope is holding up. No offense intended, just passing on my observations after dealing with many frustrating scope failures, while recognizing that people's scope requirements vary.
The POI hasn't moved. Still groups the same from year to year. The scope/barrel are fine in the sense it still shoots the same as it has and once it starts to stray, then I'll figure out what the issue is. But when it does, i won't bad mouth the scope or barrel or the gun. Things wear out over time, everything mechanical does. I didn't just shoot it twice that day. Nor did i say i only shot it twice that day (probably shot 40 rounds thru that rifle that day and don't assume all were in a row, they were spaced out over a few hours). This rifle I mentioned in this post is a hunting rifle that shoots really good (for me!). This isn't a competition rifle by any means. It will hold sub MOA easily and I'm comfortable shooting it the way i do for hunting purposes. I choose not to take a shot at game over 400yds with this setup. My choice and what I'm comfortable with. If i wan't to target shoot, then I'll use my target rifles and yes, minute errors then come into play. But that's a different scenario. If i want to take longer shots at game animals, then I'll use a different setup. There's nothing wrong with that. If something works for you in your application, there's not much need to change it. That's not to say that there may not be better ways of doing things, more of a "don't fix what ain't broke" approach. I make no assumptions about how much you shoot. I was simply addressing the two shots you mentioned in response to the idea of zero retention.
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 46,104 Likes: 6
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 46,104 Likes: 6 |
Did somebody mention DeFlave? Catskills trophy buck..... ha Must be a logged over area in the Catskills He's using open sights, must be a superior hunter. Nessmuk perhaps??
A wise man is frequently humbled.
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Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 20,824
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 20,824 |
Did somebody mention DeFlave? Catskills trophy buck..... ha Must be a logged over area in the Catskills He's using open sights, must be a superior hunter. Nessmuk perhaps?? Smoke your sense of humor is coming along quite nicely.... 
Originally Posted by Judman
PS, if you think Trump is “good” you’re way stupider than I thought! Haha
Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit.
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 29,383
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 29,383 |
Clear cut...... Catskills I thought NY didn't allow logging on their State Lands you know the "forever wild " clause, Oh wait that is the Mighty Adirondacks where no logging is allowed.
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 19,250 Likes: 4
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 19,250 Likes: 4 |
Clear cut...... Catskills I thought NY didn't allow logging on their State Lands you know the "forever wild " clause, Oh wait that is the Mighty Adirondacks where no logging is allowed. No logging allowed in any of the designated wilderness areas in both the Catskills and Adirondacks. Logging is allowed on State forest lands which are scattered across the state.. Some of the Western hunters like to belittle what is available in NY but the FACT remains that the Adirondack park is the biggest park in the continental US, covers one fifth of the land area of the entire State, is roughly the size of the entire State of Vermont and nearly 3 times the size of Yellowstone. Hunting the big woods of the Adirondacks or Catskills is a far cry from hunting farmland deer.
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Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 20,824
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 20,824 |
Jordan you are being very diplomatic with cjc73.... you are much nicer than me....
My first post to him was a simple question:
(Do you believe you would be as "effective " on a shot beyond your holdover distance as a guy with a scope that dials accurately?)
And he replied :
Yes, but i hold myself to a certain distance while hunting. Don't always have time to dial while hunting.
I didn't ask him about hunting..... he made assumptions... then accused me of that.....
He was being condescending little prick......
Originally Posted by Judman
PS, if you think Trump is “good” you’re way stupider than I thought! Haha
Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit.
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 20,812
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 20,812 |
I choose not to take a shot at game over 400yds with this setup.
I find it interesting that you are willing to guess out to 400, but not at 401?
Last edited by battue; 07/15/19.
laissez les bons temps rouler
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 28,259 Likes: 6
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 28,259 Likes: 6 |
I'm not expert on the Adirondacks, but that pic is not near rough enough country to be from the NE. That crap is vast and virtually straight up and down like W Montana and Arizona, at least that's what I was told.
BTW, I can routinely knock aspirin out of the air with my Leupy scoped Tikka 7mag. Apples and 30-30's ain't squat.
Last edited by JGRaider; 07/15/19.
It is irrelevant what you think. What matters is the TRUTH.
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 32,130 Likes: 1
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 32,130 Likes: 1 |
CJC73,
Give it up. There is a small claque of "wannabe snipers" with delusions of grandeur and elitist aspirations in this site that may be shills for other scope companies. Their steel banging methodology simply does not generalize to ethical hunting. Shooting at live animals at extended ranges is good for their feeble egos but not ethical hunting. I doubt these Kestrel, bipod, sandbag, stick idiots have a clue about real hunting. In their eyes, hitting an animal at extended ranges is more important than potentially wounding/losing one. I doubt very much they care about foot pounds of energy at target when shooting big game......
There is a duality they do not comprehend. Ethical hunting means delivering the necessary foot pounds of energy at vital areas to ensure a "clean kill." Shooting elk at 1,400 yards with one's .338 Lapua is for CRETINS. I doubt they walk in the woods carrying a .375 Cheytac to ensure clean kills at extended ranges.
Leupold scopes work for most hunters at customary hunting ranges. One does not need to crank on a door knob and use a bipod to cleanly take most big game animals. I wonder if these guys work for NF or SWFA?
I care about literacy.
If you put Taco Bell sauce in your ramen noodles it tastes just like poverty
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 32,130 Likes: 1
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 32,130 Likes: 1 |
Puppybanger,
How much are you getting paid to shill? Pathetic....no one "lied" to you......paranoia is hard to manage...there is help available!
irfubar,
Another member of the "squad" shows solidarity with his "compadre." I wonder what this little group of "wannabes" do when they get together?
Jordan Smith,
Another member of the "squad" shows up. Your squadmates make AOC's squad look disloyal. Insecure people need peer acceptance and group membership to function. Work on it. You may eventually be free to make individual judgements.....work on your sarcasm, it is pretty juvenile....
Irfubar,
Hmmm....first of all, is that caliber legal in the state you are hunting for taking big game? I think you need to read the regs. Unless, of course, you have no clue about specific caliber requirements in different states/provinces. Second of all, define deer. Axis deer? Red deer? Northern whitetail? Key west deer? Mule deer in Mexico? Mule deer in Colorado....be specific....Third of all, what conditions. Animal is alerted and running full tilt? Animal is unaware, rested? Conditions are important. Fourth of all, bullet placement. Fifth of all, what bullet type are you using?
I am sorry if this is too complicated your you and your "squad" mates to grasp.....maybe, I need to break it down into manageable chunks? ...Brought to you by LEUPOLD.
If you put Taco Bell sauce in your ramen noodles it tastes just like poverty
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 19,250 Likes: 4
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 19,250 Likes: 4 |
I'm not expert on the Adirondacks, but that pic is not near rough enough country to be from the NE. That crap is vast and virtually straight up and down like W Montana and Arizona, at least that's what I was told. You were NEVER told that idiot. I doubt like hell you can chew gum and walk at the same time, much less shoot anything out of the air with a rifle. I do believe you can spread your ears and fly if that's any consolation.
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Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 23,506
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 23,506 |
I'm not expert on the Adirondacks, but that pic is not near rough enough country to be from the NE. That crap is vast and virtually straight up and down like W Montana and Arizona, at least that's what I was told.
BTW, I can routinely knock aspirin out of the air with my Leupy scoped Tikka 7mag. Apples and 30-30's ain't squat. Johnny, I don’t know about you shooting headache medicine, but you have certainly knocked some big beasts off their feet on a regular basis...Regularly is key...Stumbling into a lottery fur once every several years isn’t the same as consistently hammering big critters. Tikka’s just flat out shoot...I don’t doubt should you endeavor to stunt shoot white pills outta the air. A Tikka wouldn’t handicap a guy. 😎
Curiosity Killed the Cat & The Prairie Dog
“Molon Labe”
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 32,130 Likes: 1
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 32,130 Likes: 1 |
I'm not expert on the Adirondacks, but that pic is not near rough enough country to be from the NE. That crap is vast and virtually straight up and down like W Montana and Arizona, at least that's what I was told.
BTW, I can routinely knock aspirin out of the air with my Leupy scoped Tikka 7mag. Apples and 30-30's ain't squat. That's a trophy Lake Placid Mule Deer......
If you put Taco Bell sauce in your ramen noodles it tastes just like poverty
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