|
|
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,955 Likes: 3
Campfire 'Bwana
|
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,955 Likes: 3 |
How difficult is it to understand a one word sentence? The two word sentence might make better sense with comprehension issues on the fire, but even given taht, it is still small unambiguous words.
I believe monos kill best by a good margin and I no longer use anything else whether I am shooting a ML rifle or regular centerfire at deer. ⁰ You ain't done much killing then... I call BS, monos have killed the best fir me as well
I got banned on another web site for a debate that happened on this site. That's a first
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,525 Likes: 2
Campfire Outfitter
|
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,525 Likes: 2 |
Not a case where bullet diameter per se makes a difference, but a 130 TTSX or TSX out of a 30-06 or 308 at 3150-3300 FPS give or take is not what would classically be described as a deep penetrating bullet. I have killed a lot of deer with them and seen an lot more killed with them. They have never shown me much deference to bone. They seem to go through bone every bit as easily as they do soft tissue. I have no doubt that bone can deflect one of them, and may be capable of and by itself at normal impact velocities of breaking off petals though I Have only seen that happen once at that was out of a 300 WM at 25 feet. That said though, If I have to stop something big that is intent on doing me harm That bullet in a Remington 760 with a full magazine behind it Is what I want in my hands. That speed makes a difference in not having to worry so much about a moving target. The recoil is considerably reduced whit just plain makes any follow up shots faster and more accurate. With the possible exception of elephant I cannot see a modern mono not being able to penetrate the bone necessary to stop anything in it's tracks if it's 80 grains or heavier. I would not expect a 70 grain TSX in .224 diameter out of a .223 being enough different than a 130 in 30-06 that I could see a difference.
Were I looking to just shoot one, I would prefer a different load. If I am going to double lung something that might hurt me I want the ability to take out both shoulders and the heart along with the lungs, I would opt for a little heavier bullet.
The monos are very accurate and very dependable after impact. Dependable enough that only the best of the bonded premiums even come close, and then they will not normally match the penetration of the monos. So in a nutshell, what kills better? Monos or "premium" bondeds, cud and core? Yes.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,525 Likes: 2
Campfire Outfitter
|
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,525 Likes: 2 |
Speaking of mono's. One of the Pastor's at my church is a pretty successful moose slayer and two of his children hunt with him. One of the rifles he has for his son is and old Mod. 99 in .300 Savage. He asked me about bullets and I told him to try a 130 grain Barnes TTSX. They hunt from tree stands and he said his son fired three of those X bullets at the moose at about 250 yards and the moose ran off and they tried for two days to find it before giving up. He was sick about it and said he is done with X bullets. I also was sick about it and wish I had not recommended any bullets to him. He could not say for sure where the moose was hit, but was certain the first shot was in the lungs.
I was just trying to suggest a load that would not beat his small son to death and still kill the moose. Maybe the first bullet did not expand and maybe the son missed the moose on the two follow up shots, ya got me. I am very positive that if the son had put a 130gr TTSX from a full steam 300 Savage in the ribs and hit the lungs/heart, that was a dead moose. I suspect the son did not hit the moose properly, if at all. +1
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 21,191
Campfire Ranger
|
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 21,191 |
How difficult is it to understand a one word sentence? The two word sentence might make better sense with comprehension issues on the fire, but even given taht, it is still small unambiguous words.
I believe monos kill best by a good margin and I no longer use anything else whether I am shooting a ML rifle or regular centerfire at deer. ⁰ You ain't done much killing then... I call BS, monos have killed the best fir me as well I don't bullshiit...
Ping pong balls for the win.
Once you've wrestled everything else in life is easy. Dan Gable
I keep my circle small, I’d rather have 4 quarters than 100 pennies.
Ain’t easy havin pals.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 21,191
Campfire Ranger
|
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 21,191 |
Speaking of mono's. One of the Pastor's at my church is a pretty successful moose slayer and two of his children hunt with him. One of the rifles he has for his son is and old Mod. 99 in .300 Savage. He asked me about bullets and I told him to try a 130 grain Barnes TTSX. They hunt from tree stands and he said his son fired three of those X bullets at the moose at about 250 yards and the moose ran off and they tried for two days to find it before giving up. He was sick about it and said he is done with X bullets. I also was sick about it and wish I had not recommended any bullets to him. He could not say for sure where the moose was hit, but was certain the first shot was in the lungs.
I was just trying to suggest a load that would not beat his small son to death and still kill the moose. Maybe the first bullet did not expand and maybe the son missed the moose on the two follow up shots, ya got me. I am very positive that if the son had put a 130gr TTSX from a full steam 300 Savage in the ribs and hit the lungs/heart, that was a dead moose. I suspect the son did not hit the moose properly, if at all. +1 Or they penciled through like they're known to do at lower velocities....
Ping pong balls for the win.
Once you've wrestled everything else in life is easy. Dan Gable
I keep my circle small, I’d rather have 4 quarters than 100 pennies.
Ain’t easy havin pals.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 5,735
Campfire Tracker
|
|
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 5,735 |
Them's bold words for someone who has trouble with one or two word sentences.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 18,933 Likes: 2
Campfire Ranger
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 18,933 Likes: 2 |
For deer which is what I am killing I will probably stick with mid weight for caliber C&C bullets. Way too many DRT kills for me to think a mono would do me any better.
I mainly get by with those lowly Sierras and have had pretty good luck with Partitions.
Did think about trying the 120 grain TTSX in 7 WSM but still unsure what I am going to try in it.
The last time that bear ate a lawyer he had the runs for 33 days!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 8,305
Campfire Outfitter
|
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 8,305 |
i don`t care how many small deer a year someone kills ,i just know if i am in big bear country i plan on using my 338 Win.Mag. or my 7 Rem. Mag in a bolt action rifle with Nosler Partition bullets that i have hand loaded. > the Nosler Partition bullets are accurate and proven big bear slayers for many years !
LIFE NRA , we vote Red up here, Norseman
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,581
Campfire Regular
|
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,581 |
Nosler Partition.... Explosive expansion with a follow through. What's not to like? I have taken a fair bit of game with the 223 and 22-250 and 60 Partitions. For a careful shot they work very well. However; I now hunt with bigger calibers. More margin for error and that's very important sometimes.
Last edited by North61; 08/05/19.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 21,191
Campfire Ranger
|
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 21,191 |
Them's bold words for someone who has trouble with one or two word sentences. How bout you hang some pics? "That's 1 sentence"
Ping pong balls for the win.
Once you've wrestled everything else in life is easy. Dan Gable
I keep my circle small, I’d rather have 4 quarters than 100 pennies.
Ain’t easy havin pals.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,955 Likes: 3
Campfire 'Bwana
|
|
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,955 Likes: 3 |
So in a nutshell, what kills better? Monos or "premium" bondeds, cud and core?
Monos. Every time. In my hands they will go where I want them, which is not a certainty with cup and core bullets of any type. Mono's have always killed quicker for me too.
I got banned on another web site for a debate that happened on this site. That's a first
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 5,735
Campfire Tracker
|
|
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 5,735 |
Them's bold words for someone who has trouble with one or two word sentences. How bout you hang some pics? "That's 1 sentence" Would you be impressed with a 22 cubic foot chest freezer and a 7.5 cubic footer out in the garage full of venison? Go ask Tzone. He knows how many deer were common to see every night where I live. They are in large part eaten by me and mine. Pretty rare to see more than one or two now. I don't think I have taken but one picture of deer I killed in the last ten years. Before that I did a few while I was checking out different monos and different calibers of them.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 21,191
Campfire Ranger
|
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 21,191 |
Ping pong balls for the win.
Once you've wrestled everything else in life is easy. Dan Gable
I keep my circle small, I’d rather have 4 quarters than 100 pennies.
Ain’t easy havin pals.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,161 Likes: 13
Campfire Kahuna
|
|
Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,161 Likes: 13 |
One of the great things about the Internet is how many posters have The Answer.
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.”
John Steinbeck
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 21,191
Campfire Ranger
|
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 21,191 |
One of the great things about the Internet is how many posters have The Answer. 😂😂 truth! "If" I were a "meat" hunter, killin strictly for groceries, the last thing I'd worry about, is bullets.... If he worried about how the guy my next box of 22 magnum ammo... Headshots only.
Ping pong balls for the win.
Once you've wrestled everything else in life is easy. Dan Gable
I keep my circle small, I’d rather have 4 quarters than 100 pennies.
Ain’t easy havin pals.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,525 Likes: 2
Campfire Outfitter
|
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,525 Likes: 2 |
Speaking of mono's. One of the Pastor's at my church is a pretty successful moose slayer and two of his children hunt with him. One of the rifles he has for his son is and old Mod. 99 in .300 Savage. He asked me about bullets and I told him to try a 130 grain Barnes TTSX. They hunt from tree stands and he said his son fired three of those X bullets at the moose at about 250 yards and the moose ran off and they tried for two days to find it before giving up. He was sick about it and said he is done with X bullets. I also was sick about it and wish I had not recommended any bullets to him. He could not say for sure where the moose was hit, but was certain the first shot was in the lungs.
I was just trying to suggest a load that would not beat his small son to death and still kill the moose. Maybe the first bullet did not expand and maybe the son missed the moose on the two follow up shots, ya got me. I am very positive that if the son had put a 130gr TTSX from a full steam 300 Savage in the ribs and hit the lungs/heart, that was a dead moose. I suspect the son did not hit the moose properly, if at all. +1 Or they penciled through like they're known to do at lower velocities.... Nah, the 130 TTSX started at about 2840 fps would still be doing 2170 at sea level at 250 meters (more like 2200 fps at 250 yards).
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 21,191
Campfire Ranger
|
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 21,191 |
Ping pong balls for the win.
Once you've wrestled everything else in life is easy. Dan Gable
I keep my circle small, I’d rather have 4 quarters than 100 pennies.
Ain’t easy havin pals.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 28,259 Likes: 6
Campfire Ranger
|
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 28,259 Likes: 6 |
So in a nutshell, what kills better? Monos or "premium" bondeds, cud and core?
Monos. Every time. In my hands they will go where I want them, which is not a certainty with cup and core bullets of any type. Mono's have always killed quicker for me too. Kind of funny you and Mr Miles say that. You've obviously missed Mule Deer's posts where he's kept a journal of hundreds upon hundreds of big game kills with various bullets. I'm not attempting to speak for him, but since his experience (which is vastly more animals) mirrors mine in that monos penetrate deeper and take longer to kill than the premium buletts and C&C's. What's your response to that documented info?
It is irrelevant what you think. What matters is the TRUTH.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 12,142
Campfire Outfitter
|
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 12,142 |
One of the great things about the Internet is how many posters have The Answer. John; Good evening to you sir, I hope that the day has been as nice for you and Eileen as it has been here. We're in the middle of a bit of a heat wave and unfortunately have a pretty good sized forest fire burning a wee bit to the south of us now - however sir - other than that it's been a grand long weekend for us here in southern BC! This is a bit of an experimental post for me in that I'm following the careful instructions from a cyber friend to do this....  ![[Linked Image]](https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/gallery/80/full/105089.jpg) Above is what's left of two 220gr Hornay RN bullets fired into a good sized - I want to say about 350-400lb carcass Okanagan bull moose - who was hit in the ribs at under 200yds. Oh they came out of a .308 Norma Mag, but if memory serves the muzzle velocity was a fairly pedestrian 2650fps or so. Obviously the moose died John, but I wasn't happy with the performance. I then shot a first rack whitetail facing me with them and again had the bullet completely come apart. Again the little buck died, but it wasn't a bullet I'd chose to fight a bear with or have to hit say an already wounded elk with if it was exiting and the only shot I had was to shove one through the grass bag... After that, a gun writer chap that I was corresponding with suggested 200gr Partitions and I shot at least one whitetail buck with that bullet. It's been a good long while ago now sir, but memory tells me I slid one into it's right hand hip pocket and it exited the throat after clipping the shoulder blade off. Dropped the little fellow "in his tracks" just like "the hammer of Thor" and all that!!!  When our girls were young and started hunting, one chose a .250AI and the other a 6.5x55. Since they were novice shooters, I quickly opted for mono bullets and instructed the girls to mentally envision breaking at least one shoulder bone when they were aiming on a mulie or whitetail buck. Oh - I know you know John, but I must add they'd been helping to cut up deer since they were about 5, which I guess was half their lives at that point - anyway they knew where the scapula was located. The little .250 Ackley was an eye opener for me personally, as previous to that we'd killed a good double handful of bucks with my father's 6.5x55, but I hadn't seen deer killed with anything smaller and remained unconvinced.... Dad had killed moose with a Savage 99 in .250, no doubt using whatever Dominion or Winchester ammo was available at the local McLeod's Hardware store back then. He thought it was about as good as the .303 British he'd used previous to that, though he said the .250 shot a wee bit flatter. He then traded the .250 in on a Model 100 in .308 and pronounced it "chained lightning" on moose.  Anyway the monos didn't kill quite as quickly as cup and core bullets on pure rib bone breaking lung shots, but my goodness John when the girls hit one or both scapula - they worked fine! Here's an 80gr TTSX beside either a GMX or TTSX 130gr from a .270 and a 168gr out of my .308 Norma. ![[Linked Image]](https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/gallery/80/full/105090.jpg) In all of the above cases, the mono took exactly one application and the buck either died right there or a few faltering steps away. I've been quite happy with that as I'm less and less enthralled with tracking as I've been getting older. Lastly, while we don't have an abundance of grizzly bears locally, there are enough that I do pay attention when I'm up above the house trying to fill the freezer in fall. From what I've seen while cutting up the game over the years, the monos should give me a bit of an edge if I have to hit a recalcitrant bruin facing me while I'm reinforcing my side of an increasingly loud and belligerent exchange. Thanks for reading and for helping in so many areas John, I really do appreciate it. All the best to you and Eileen as we head into the fall. Dwayne
The most important stuff in life isn't "stuff"
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 28,259 Likes: 6
Campfire Ranger
|
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 28,259 Likes: 6 |
Nosler Partition.... Explosive expansion with a follow through. What's not to like? I have taken a fair bit of game with the 223 and 22-250 and 60 Partitions. For a careful shot they work very well. However; I now hunt with bigger calibers. More margin for error and that's very important sometimes. Two pearls we have learned in this thread alone: 1. Monos kill quicker than any other bullets on the planet 2. Bigger calibers make up for bad shooting 3. What's next??????
It is irrelevant what you think. What matters is the TRUTH.
|
|
|
|
Forums81
Topics1,192,628
Posts18,492,939
Members73,977
| |
Most Online11,491
Jul 7th, 2023
|
|
|
|
