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Joined: May 2017
Posts: 233
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OP
Campfire Member
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 233 |
For some reason I've always wanted a 358
I definitely shoot better with a vertical pistol grip and adj comb. I really like my Game Warden stocked 243 and plan on duplicating it in something bigger.
Sensible says get a 308 but I'm tempted with a 358 even though on paper the 308 is a better fit to my style of shooting ie spot and stalk including fields and clear cuts perhaps out to 300yards with limited time to range etc and for big deer and moose shot stationary 95%.
If I did it would be:-
Adjustable Game Warden M700 ss 21" remington mag sporter profile or similar to get weight forward Williams ss bdl plate Trigger tech Burris Signature Zees 4-16 scope with clicks Suppressor
A pointy bullet would be nice but the 200gr AB needs more length I gather which would mean Wyatt? What are real world 200/225gr velocities from a 20/21" barrel? What does a 200gr AB at 358 velocity bring to the party that a 165gr 308 doesn't? Heart says 358, head says 308.
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 17,891 Likes: 6
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 17,891 Likes: 6 |
For shots out to 300 yds. the .308 would me a better choice, the .358 is more of a 100 yd. cartridge. A well constructed 165gr, bullet should do what you're looking to do, for years metallic silhouette shooters used 168gr. bullets in .308 with great success. Some used 190gr. for the rams @ 500 meters.
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Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 691
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 691 |
I want one myself. Despite the somewhat lackluster numbers on paper I've always read and heard that they just flat out kill with authority. Is it practical probably not but practical isn't always fun. I've got a 243 model Seven predator that I'm gonna see if it has enough meat for a rebore to 358. I'll ad a brake so I can shoot it comfortably and have a hard hitting medium game rifle.
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Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 24,671 Likes: 6
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 24,671 Likes: 6 |
the .358 is more of a 100 yd. cartridge. Compare the MPBR with a 165gr in the .308 and a 200gr in the .358. Without running the numbers, I'm guessing the gap is within 20-25 yards.
WWP53D
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Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 3,695
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 3,695 |
My longest elk kill with my 20” .358win, is 257 yards with the Sierra 225......
A big Roosie cow that didn’t travel 20 feet after the hit.
It’s just trajectory and if your twisting turrets, it makes no difference.......
BT53 "Where do they find young men like this?" Reporter Savidge, Iraq Elk, it's what's for dinner....
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Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 691
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Campfire Regular
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Posts: 691 |
SKane that's awesome, lol.
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 3,237 Likes: 2
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jun 2006
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240-250 yd MPBR would be a lot closer WAG.
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Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 44,928 Likes: 18
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 44,928 Likes: 18 |
For big deer and moose to 300 yards I wouldn't be fooling around with any 4-16 power scopes.
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Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 971
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 971 |
If I did it would be:-
Adjustable Game Warden M700 ss 21" remington mag sporter profile or similar to get weight forward Williams ss bdl plate Trigger tech Burris Signature Zees 4-16 scope with clicks Suppressor
The suppressor is the build killer here. Nobody I know of is making a rifle suppressor for a .358 rifle. There are a couple of .50BMG suppressors, but those things are huge and heavy. Next size down is a .338 and those are sized for Lapua. So, unless you are going to Form 1 and build it yourself, finding a suppressor for a .358 is a no-go. It is probably the only reason I don't have on in the stable right now.
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 32,252 Likes: 3
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 32,252 Likes: 3 |
I think that Ruger made some American Rifles in 358. If you could get into one of them for a reasonable price, you could test drive the 358 and determine if you actually like it.
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Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 44,928 Likes: 18
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 44,928 Likes: 18 |
For shots out to 300 yds. the .308 would me a better choice, the .358 is more of a 100 yd. cartridge. A well constructed 165gr, bullet should do what you're looking to do, for years metallic silhouette shooters used 168gr. bullets in .308 with great success. Some used 190gr. for the rams @ 500 meters. Wizdom
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Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 4,262 Likes: 3
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 4,262 Likes: 3 |
Gunswizard, where do you come up with this crap? If you are that bad of a shot just get closer. Good hunters do. DON'T PARROT EVERYTHING YOU READ UNLESS YOU KNOW IT TO BE TRUE! Be Well. Rusty
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 16,512
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 16,512 |
358 is a Fine round. 338 Federal also. If me I'd run 3 bullets: Pistol bullets like 158s for plinking, they do hell on jugs to 200, yes fall out at 300. For hunting game, a 225 Sierra for deer, likely work on most other game. If you want some insurance, a 225 Partition would be my ONE LOAD for anything up thru Moose, large Bear.
Nothing wrong with either of the above mid-bore rounds to 300 on game. I PREFER a higher BC and SD so 225s for me in a 35 on game.
Scope? Nothing over 10x for your use, if me. 21" is a great length, no more needed, a bit less blast than say a 19-20, but splitting hairs, speeds will be similar. Handling is what you want, and shootabilitiy which is affected by balance. I would skip any suppressor or brake, ear plugs and muffs at range, plugs in field are easy so your ears will do just fine, even if you forget the plugs when hunting. More of a boom than crack, and most powder burned in that larger bore size.
That said, Yes, a 308 in a sporter chopped at 21" will get the same jobs done, but the larger the game, I would be a bit more inclined to go larger bore to 35.
35s do put some serious hurt on game, on impact....large exit if needed for a large but short blood trail. Good hunting.
Last edited by 65BR; 08/22/19.
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Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 15,368 Likes: 13
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 15,368 Likes: 13 |
My brother and I have 358 Wins. His is a plain jane Ruger Hawkeye and mine is a BLR. Neither one of them are slouches in hunting ability. Sure, they aren't 300 magnums, but he runs his with 200 Accubonds at 2620 and I use the 225 Partition or Sierra at 2475. We both have the incredibly simple Burris FFII's on the guns, his is a 3x9 and mines a 2x7. With a tiny bit of ballistic calculator math it is really pretty easy to hammer 10" steel at 400 yards and that is with a 150 yard zero on the main reticle. So, saying it is a 100 yard cartridge is crazy, my slug guns were worse in all ways and they didn't have troubles knocking deer over to 150 yards. Not a knock on the 308 either, great cartridge, but if a fella wants a hammer that digs deep enough and makes big leaky holes and desires a 358 why would someone talk him out of it? I mean, it's not like it hard to make or find brass and the darned things are EASY to load for as well.
If you put a scope with dials on it, it'd be even easier but we just wanted these for holding/stalking/walking guns that are different, hit deer hard and aren't horrible to shoot.. But a 100 yard cartridge it is not..
Semper Fi
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 21,228 Likes: 2
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 21,228 Likes: 2 |
Gunswizard, where do you come up with this crap? Prime example of someone that ain’t hunted/killed much,
Ping pong balls for the win. Once you've wrestled everything else in life is easy. Dan Gable I keep my circle small, I’d rather have 4 quarters than 100 pennies.
Ain’t easy havin pals.
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 21,228 Likes: 2
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 21,228 Likes: 2 |
the .358 is more of a 100 yd. cartridge. Compare the MPBR with a 165gr in the .308 and a 200gr in the .358. Without running the numbers, I'm guessing the gap is within 20-25 yards. 🤣🤣
Ping pong balls for the win. Once you've wrestled everything else in life is easy. Dan Gable I keep my circle small, I’d rather have 4 quarters than 100 pennies.
Ain’t easy havin pals.
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Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 4,755
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 4,755 |
If I did it would be:-
Adjustable Game Warden M700 ss 21" remington mag sporter profile or similar to get weight forward Williams ss bdl plate Trigger tech Burris Signature Zees 4-16 scope with clicks Suppressor
The suppressor is the build killer here. Nobody I know of is making a rifle suppressor for a .358 rifle. There are a couple of .50BMG suppressors, but those things are huge and heavy. Next size down is a .338 and those are sized for Lapua. So, unless you are going to Form 1 and build it yourself, finding a suppressor for a .358 is a no-go. It is probably the only reason I don't have on in the stable right now. Nah, the suppressor isn't that much of a problem. One example off the shelf is the Liberty Mystic X. I don't remember offhand but the Griffin Optimus might do it as well, and there are at least a couple others to look at.
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 24,851
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 24,851 |
For shots out to 300 yds. the .308 would me a better choice, the .358 is more of a 100 yd. cartridge. A well constructed 165gr, bullet should do what you're looking to do, for years metallic silhouette shooters used 168gr. bullets in .308 with great success. Some used 190gr. for the rams @ 500 meters. Wizdumb Corrected.
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 24,851
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 24,851 |
My 358 wssm has close to 358 win velocities. Here is a drop chart of my rifle shooting the 225 Accubond at 2425 fps. ......yeah.....100 yds. 🥴
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Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 44,928 Likes: 18
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 44,928 Likes: 18 |
For shots out to 300 yds. the .308 would me a better choice, the .358 is more of a 100 yd. cartridge. A well constructed 165gr, bullet should do what you're looking to do, for years metallic silhouette shooters used 168gr. bullets in .308 with great success. Some used 190gr. for the rams @ 500 meters. Wizdumb Corrected. I'd say amplified. I was trying to be subtle.
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