Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunting Rifles Need Rifle Buying Ideas Low recoil...Flat shooting

Well he’s pretty well versed with most standard calibers and he’s been killing deer and cows with a 25-06 for the last 15 years. He wants something special for this hunt in a want more than need scenario but he’s not the type to mess with Turrets and reticles, he’s 73 years old and old school. I just talked to him and he’s looking at a Rem 700 Long range in 300 WM a buddy has to go with. We were just talking earlier about options and the two that popped in my mind were the 257 Bee and the 264 WM, thought I’d throw it out here and with all the newer 6 and 6.5’s available maybe there was something I wasn’t aware of, kind of like the 26 Nosler. Anyway we’ll see what he decides. This tag was one that someone drew and then turned it in (don’t ask me why) and he was next on the list so F&G called him to see if he was interested. He’s lived in the town below the San Juan’s (Elk Ridge) in Utah for 30+ years and flip flopped the whole time applying for deer and elk up there, Utah doesn’t allow residents to put in for both species in the trophy units. It’s literally his backyard and he has never drawn an elk tag. Think it’s a like 20+ pref points to draw this tag so he’s really pumped. Considering he didn’t draw deer or cow elk this year and wasn’t even planning on hunting. Truly a bucket list opportunity for him, he thought he’d die or be physically unable to make it happen before he’d ever draw so it’s pretty special. I leave for my elk hunt next week and then the boy and I are hunting deer and elk next month and I’ve got to make this trip to Utah too to help him be successful or at least share the experience. Gonna be busy in the next few months!

Well good for him, and awesome you get to be a part. Sounds like you have a great fall lined up!

A .300 WM? Why start the thread with those requirements then if that's what he's looking at? This stuff is not complicated. Use his .25-06 then which fits his requirements perfectly.

His cartridge is so far down the list of stuff that will make him successful....

Good luck this fall ..

Greg I’m with you, I was just trying to help him make his decision, I have several rifles he could use with absolute success as does he but he did a 180 on me from what he was talking about earlier today. 🤷🏼‍♂️

Congrats to him!

As for the 300 Win Mag it’s certainly a great elk (or most anything) round.

Copy that....

Just get him shooting in the field. Cartridge secondary ...

I’d be just fine with the 25-06 myself with any of the great Bullets out there nowadays. No big trick to get 3100-3200 from them with 110-120 bullets and our great powders. If he wanted more the load 30338 mentioned sounds pretty wicked as well. The 270 or a 280 with the lighter 130/140 stuff is a pretty good combo.

My brother uses a 140 grain Tipped TBBC at 2900, 250 zero, 16” down at 400. Nothing to pound elk with that combo easily without much drama, and shoot, that’s uses plain old H4831...

A 270 would be a great choice with the tipped bear claw bullet.

Or a 270 Win with 130 grain TSX bullets.

A 24" 7mmRemMag, shooting a reasonably sleek 150gr bullet at 3,150fps (something like an NAB or ABLR) will be around 12-13" low at 400yds with a 250yd zero, depending on altitude. 100yd POI is about 2" high. Max rise is 2.5" at 150yds. Won't kick too terribly bad and solid factory rifles are available for reasonable prices.

270 with a 130 BT of some sort would be my recommendation... no point getting too esoteric for a FIL that doesn't sound like much of a rifle looney.

KISS... overthinking not required. Factory ammo available worldwide.

Pick any typical "deer/elk" cartridge and scope it with a duplex reticle that subtends ~4.5-6MOA to the duplex intersection @ highest power. Sighted in dead-on @ 200yds with anything from a 6.5 CreedMoor up through the 300Win and you'll have an aiming point @ the duplex intersection that's reasonably close to dead-on @ 400yds. He get's a "400yd rifle" with nothing more than he's already used to using.

Leupold 3.5-10x40 w/standard duplex subtends 5.4MOA and works really well for the above scenario. There's probably lots of others that do as well, but that's the only sub tension I know off the top of my head.

Personally the decision comes down to variations in powder column size and flexibility.

280AI = the optimum for an 06 powder column in terms of speed

6.5 ( 260 / 6.5 creedmoor) are the optimum for the 308 column for ballistics

From there the decision is easier.

Look at -

Kick
Kill power
And if it is sited in at 250 yards- what distance still puts you into the vital area in terms of drop.

Personally I chose the 280 AI.

He’s considering a 300 mag? Not exactly “low recoil.”

Most of the recommendations sound good...… but whatever he chooses install a Limbsaver or other really quality pad that does in fact reduce felt recoil. This alone will give him more accuracy and confidence with his choice. My old 1 st generation M700 ss with Tupperware stock in 300 Win Mag could beat the crap out of anyone, till I replaced the factory pad with a Limbsaver. MB

I have a 270 Win and a 257 WM, they are both set up in similar stocks, I can not tell the difference in recoil between the two. For me, the 270 would be the easy choice simply due to more bullet weight options.

Being an old fart Luddite myself, I can understand the reluctance to learn a new skill (dialing) just before a hunt, but don't get the no-reticle part. Couldn't be simpler: range, hold, shoot. Even a standard duplex might work for this.

The other option is to sight-in for longer range, but that could make the possibility of missing high on closer shots, which are more likely in some places.

Maybe you can get another old guy to talk this over with him.

Bullet weight is a HUGE part of kick... at least with the new guys I deal with....

30 cal —- 220’s in a 30-06 jar your teeth, 180’s are stout. (Ballistically 203-208 grains are best in the 30 cal)

280 / 270’s - 168’s in a 280 are noticeable, 140-150’s are easier on you (ballistically ~168 -170’s are best)

6.5mm. - now we’re in the 140/150 weight range.


Most people who are recoil sensitive do well with 140’s to 180’s... hence the recommendation for 280 and 6.5...
Blast equation (sensitive wise)... stay away from WSM’s, but a 6.5 PRC might be OK...

My recommendation here - find someone who has that rifle chambering and let the guy shoot it at the range to see how they feel.
What a person can handle is a person by person thing.

In reading this FROM the beginning, I was thinking 25-06....so.

He want something 'special'. I understand that.

The 300 WM is NOT low recoil w/o a brake or similar. >> From Experience, I have, use, & like the 300 WM but it's recoil is FAR more than
25-06 or 270 W.

IF he chooses the 300, he'll need to shoot it enuff to become comfortable with its recoil. I hope he can. Some people can not.

GOOD LUCK

Jerry

let him get the 300 win mag and add a brake before the hunt so he can do a little practicing. easy peasy. i dislike brakes, but they do lessen recoil.