Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire Clean bore vs fouled bore

This may seam like a dumb question to some of you but I never knew the correct answer or "technical" answer to what changes the POI from a clean bore to a fouled bore and why?

Every year for deer season, hunters go the range and check their guns for deer season. They start with a clean bore and won't clean it until after hunting season because the POI changes with a dirty bore.... What makes the POI change? Does the barrel get faster or slower with a trace of copper in it? Or does it get faster with a trace of carbon in it?
Thanks

I have some rifles that shoot the same from a clean bore or dirty and some may be off an inch or so the first or second shot from a clean bore.I "had" one rifle that was really bad,about three inches or so from a clean bore.At first I just thought it was me until I really began paying attention to it.Why does it happen,I really don't know.One thing I have noticed,doing the barrel break in,(Shoot one, clean, for first ten rounds; shoot three, clean, for next thirty rounds; shoot five, clean, while working up load. Allow bbl to cool to the touch before testing a new load to avoid unnecessary throat erosion.),those rifles seem to shoot about the same from a clean or dirty bore.I shoot a few rounds before going hunting and leave the barrel dirty afterwards.If hunting in wet weather,I would recommend cleaning the barrel after the hunt.

I don't know why. But yes, I have had several rifles which needed a couple fouling shots. No big deal, just step out the door and put a couple rounds into the dirt beside the front deck after cleaning. Then she's good for another 300 to 500 rounds, or maybe next year before season, whichever comes first.

Shoot her till she pukes, then clean and start over.

Done that. I am not really trying to dirty the bore as much as getting all the oil residue out. Dry patching gets some but not all. Some of the older lubes with teflon (TFE) took 2-3 shots to stabilize, while others 1 shot would do it. I wouldn’t clean till after the season mainly because with only 5-6 shots down the pipe and another 5-6 during the season the thing shouldn’t need to be cleaned unless it gets wet or I am just plain bored I won’t warm up the shop to clean 1 rifle with 10-15 shots on it.

Bob,

It depends on the barrel, and how you clean it. Most guys when they clean a barrel end with running a oiled patch down the barrel and leave the barrel lightly coated with oil. This is enough to effect the bullet/barrel dynamic and affect POI and velocity. A clean barrel typically shoot slower than a fouled barrel. Interestingly enough, the shift in POI can be very consistent. In several of my rifle the shift is about an inch and always in the same direction.

Premium barrels, the kind that get hand lapped tend to be affected less by cleaning, since there's fewer imperfections for cleaning chemicals and power residue to cling to.

Lastly you man see a diminished POI shift if you don't finish with an oiled patch but with a clean drying solvent such as Quick Scrub, or break cleaner. Still, I always hunt with a fouled bore.

I don't have many rifles that have POI affected by a clean vs fouled bore. But on clean bores I make sure the bore is quite free from oil before I shoot them. That seems to help.

Strange coming from a forum of holier than thou long range, $1500 scope snobs, yet they roll all season with some abortion that probably looks like a copper mine.

I pull a snake between shots, when table shooting. Only fired two shots since opening day, 2 shots, 2 dead bucks. Even though I'm almost always gunning under a 100 yards. I want the same POI from a cold, clean barrel.


Let '50 tell you his protocol, holy fugk. Every time I call that dude, "hay man, s'up" ....oh just punching the bore out on this 8mm, or AK. Hahaha

* not saying the OP is what I described, but before 2 pages, one of the hydras will make a showing.Grins

Nope.

One fouling shot is all you need.

I know the guys on the muzzleloader forums insist on a fouled barrel but I do what a lot of bench shooters do. I load my ML after it’s been outside in the cold garage ( and never bring it into the warm house until after the season).

Afterwards, I spray Lock Ease (graphite) onto a patch and swab the bore back and forth down to the bullet. When it dries, it’s leaves a similar “film” like a fouled barrel. Works for me.

Used to do that with a muzzleloader, but I'm smokeless now.

I don't want sabot residue on my cold shot either.

Different strokes...


Then again, I'm not into hostage resolution or negotiation. 😀

LOL!!!
Slumlord knows I'm a fanatic about placing a precision shot under duress.
He has seen some of the moves I have put on deer.
He has also seen my cleaning routines.
I actually have a 5 patch cleaning rountine for my ML written down and taped in my ML home cleaning box.
ML is really important for same conditions for each shot.
IDGAF about the reloading shot for a wounded animal .
Aint had ta finish one off.
The 1st well placed shot is the one that counts.
Wether relaxed or under duress.

If you cant place a accurate killing 1st shot
Everything else is mute in a hunting situation. JMO....
I have taken 4 shots this year.
4 dead deer.
Got 1 buck tag left.


On the 21st of nov I shot a box of 196gr spce 8mm selloir & bellot just under 2600 fps at the range. Got my rifle dailed in to that load from a previous load, boresnake x 3 to 4 between each shot.
All on 3 power that day
Which does cause the reticle to completely cover a 1 inch dot at 100 yds
Give each an equal footing as much as possible.
Got it home , copper cleaned the barrel.
Went out next morning on the 22nd it was about 34°
5 to 7 mph intermittent wind right to left
Wind is like current in a river and varies at different distance,s to the target
Someone left a shoot and see target on the 100yd line.
1st shot is just at the 9 about 1/2 inch off the bull
Cold clean bore
2nd bore snaked x3 little high little bit more left
Both shots on 3 power that day and same reticle covering a 1 inch dot completely at 100 yds.
Only difference was no wind on the 21st and wind on the 22nd.
Left the range 100% confident i could kill a deer with a precise shot.

Cleaned rifle very lightly exactly the same way

Rifle opened the 23rd.
I know where my shot is going.
I can pick an opening and place the shot.
Relaxed or making a move.





Here is the previous load it was zeroed to last year
PPU 196gr 2250 to 2300 fps
3 power 100 yds

Extreme shift with this ammo
From cold clean bore shot to boresnaked between shots

So it aint just the barrel condition
It is also the ammo

Do your range homework is the best advice I can give.

Who's buying that cheap crap?

Black friday sales
😄

That's correct.


Most hunters should be concerned with "cold barrel" vs "hot barrel".

Range time spent adjusting scopes with a barrel that's hot from sighting in is okay.... But you need to let the barrel get cold again, then shoot the rifle to see where it hits.

It's the first shot that counts. Not the 10th or 12th...

I have bought 3 Sightron SII 3-9x42 scopes from three different members on here over the past 2 yrs.

I have 4 of them total.
Only scope i use .

All personal preference.

Same duplex reticle
Same veiw thru each one.

A scope that tracks per stated value.
Holds zero.
Returns to zero.
Got decent mid grade glass.

Shameless plug for bolt action rifles and sightron scopes.
Old pic early fall 2018
1994 mod 70 ot6, top
Bottom
1938 KAR98 8 mm serial# 1668
Post WW2 customized by Sako in late 40,s
Also did some work on it myself.

Ot6 sitting at home till i bust the mausers cherry for me.

I heard someone about 2 weeks ago on the adjoining farm, obviously new muzzleloader set up or scope.

Either way, I bet he burned through a whole pack of powerbelts. Would shoot every 1-2 minutes. Went on for seemed like 45 mins to an hour.

No way there was time to clean, or even snake or even let cool between shots.

No doubt, a powerbelt guy. Probably pyrodex pellets too.

*now I'm the condescending snob

You apparently....just don't "get it" 😄

Hahaha!!!
Disposable each 3 to 5 yrs
Cva wolf.
Buy a new one with a scope for 149 on clearance......
You aint gotta clean a ML man...

Lol!!!
How many dudes rigs you seen over the years that have bores that look like dry sewer pipes and they wonder why they miss deer .

LOL!!!!

Move up to centerfire season with a home defense mossberg500 with pumpkin balls and same rusty sewer pipe barrel.

Hahaha

At least his crusty muzzleloader had glass on it

I like threads like these.
Humour
And good advice.

After all being a general forumite is not a bad thing.
I do my social butterfly thing to other forums
Check stuff out.
Comment every so often.
Drop a nugget here and their.
But i like being a general forumite.