Home Forums Lever Action Central Lever Actions - General Marlin vs. Henry in 45-70

Buffalo Bore says their hot 45-70 ammo is clear for either... is this legit? Which has the stronger action? (I know next to nothing about the new Henry productions.)

here in lies the problem . buffalo bore hot is for the people that want a 458 win mag and cant afford one. those loads just aren't need for 99% of the game one uses the 45/70 on. i have seen everything from whitetail deer to Bison to big Browns taken with heavy hard cast going in the 1200 to 1600 fps range. have shot 9 elk wit 405's at 1100 fps. Never needed a second shot. off topic because i know nothing about Henry's strength.
flame on.

DS - no flames. Happy to hear real experience. I'm mostly curious because general feeling seems to be that Henry actions are weaker, but I've never seen an actual strength test comparison. I don't plan on hunting cape buffalo or Kodiak browns... but it's fun to know it's *possible.* As you say, even at non +p speeds, a big, hard cast round in any of the big bores is going to do immense damage.

That said, Garrett lists Henry as compatible with their +p rounds, but has sort of an odd explanation for it elsewhere on the site (they sent Henry test rounds and Henry said it worked, but Garrett didn't actually conduct the test). I'm also sort of feeling out either a 444 or 45-70, but I'm not sure how I feel about buying a new Marlin in either until we know what post-bankruptcy CS support looks like.

When I first started with .45-70's, I wanted to squeeze all the juice out of that lemon, loaded'em hot and heavy..

I agree with deerstalker, big ole bullets lumbering along at reasonaable speeds whack the crap outta stuff.

You (at least I) don't need to shoot .45-70's at max speeds. Just cause one can, doesn't mean one should or even needs to.

I've enjoyed the several I have a lot more once that realization set in.

Like him, I have no clue about the Henry, don't want one, haven't warmed up to them.

I have two Marlins, a Miroku Winchester 1886, a Browning (Miroku) 1885 BPCR, a Rolling Block I built as a teen, using a Numrich barrel kit on an old Egyptian 43 action, The 1885 and 1886 are probably stronger than the Marlins which are stronger than the Rem Roller.

If I had to guess, I'd say the Henry was probably somewhere similar to the Marlin. Someone who actually knows may want to chime in.

But, this is the Fire. You don't really have to know anything to answer a question...

Happens all the time

DF

DF - I love the look of the Winny 86... but not the price tag.

I have a Jap 1886 45-70 and a Marlin in 45-70. (AnD an1885 in 45-90)
I too loaded them hot in the beginning. But since I’m not taking them on a Cape Buffalo shoot, I’ve decided that they’ll never need to shoot 500 grains at 2,000 FPS. (Ha)

My favorite is 405 grain cast ww’s.

That Marlin is very light and it’s much more fun now. Further it’s a moot point on which might be stronger at least for me.

My eyes are pushing me towards scopes only. I don't shoot this one, now a safe queen, may as well move it.

It's a Miroku as noted. I think it's the Extra Light Gr 1 It has a recoil pad added but the stock wasn't cut, the longer LOP feel right to me. I had it checkered in a Winchester pattern. It has a fiber optic front sight, receiver rear, Uncle Mike sling swivel studs....

Wood is pretty nice, better than average. The 1886 is one of the strongest of its class, a JMB design. Miroku makes them very well with the best modern steel. I think it should be as strong if not stronger than the original.

Now, if someone wants to shoot a 45-70 load that makes their eyes water, this one will handle it. The shooter will holler "Uncle" before the rifle does..

Hardly used, near mint. I may consider trading or selling it

DF

NICE!
And I second your comment on the strength of the rifle.
There is one similar to yours in my gun safe and shooting it has convinced my son to buy one of his own.

I listed it on Classifieds. Working on a trade at present.

https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbt.../re-winchester-miroku-45-70#Post15120062

DF

I've owned and loaded for both. I don't think there is likely any material difference in design strength. I have never analyzed the metallurgy...so there could be a difference there...but I rather doubt it.

I have loaded two different Henry 45-70 rifles to the upper end of the "Marlin" loads and no issues.

As has been stated, either rifle is fully adequate for use on anything the other is.

If I thought I needed Buffalo Bore level power, I might just use another rifle for the task? A good 400gr bullet at 1,600 - 1,700 will do a lot of killing.

"A good 400gr bullet at 1,600 - 1,700 will do a lot of killing."

Indeed it will.

+1

DF

My Marlin GG likes the Beartooth Bullets Piledriver Jr. loaded to 1679 fps with H322.

With that load, I feel ready for anything in the woods, especially in Virginia. That load is a bone-cruncher.

Defeintely ready for anything in your VA woods, extend that to include about anything on the N American continent....

DF

I'd take anything on that walks over here with that load and rifle.

What can be counter-intuitive is that it is not destructive of meat like a fast-stepping round with a quick-expanding bullet, hell, it's easier on meat than my .30-30. But it sure digs deep.

Just the "wallop" effect of that big ole bullet whacking something is better understood by witnessing it than trying to explain it, or having it explained.

DF

Does it "whack" stuff harder than a 12 gauge magnum slug ? I killed a lot of deer with various 12 gauge slugs and was never overly impressed. Particularly when weighed from a recoil vs effectiveness point of view. Same for heavy conicals out of my .50 cal muzzleloader. I got quicker kills on average from many smaller, faster bullets. Perhaps on bigger game the big punkin chuckers would be more impressive but for deer you can keep them.

One thing for sure, you never wonder if it's enough. (grin)

Penetration is much better than the slugs due to hardness and diameter of the bullet, plus the nose shape. An LBT bullet, unless deformed, usually penetrates in a straight line.

Since I tend to lung shoot, I've not noticed a big difference between different bore diameters and with deer I've gotten more bang/flops with fast steppers but I did have one pile right up with a .30-30, so that's not a hard and fast rule. But generally, yes, I've noticed more reaction with fast bullets.

I've never had one of those hardcast BBs fail to shoot through at any angle through any animal I've shot with it, but I haven't shot any huge bears with it, just black bear and a couple of pigs. I would feel adequately armed for big bear, though.