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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2007
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This nation has sinned enough to deserve it. What were the world's sins to be visited by the plague-which was cured by the invention of antibiotics by big pharma, hmmmm. Or the inquisition....Pol pot? Give old HC a case of the plague and he would be sucking down those antibiotics like gummy bears and praising the wonders of big pharma.... 
Last edited by battue; 01/15/21.
laissez les bons temps rouler
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Campfire Outfitter
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The motive is the key. Do you do good things because you want to look good or do you do them because you want God to be pleased with your life.
To me, both motives are selfish. The only difference is the size of the payoff. Yet, according to what many are saying here, some person who does good deeds for others because it's the right thing to do, and without expectation of reward, but can't get over conceptual hangups over the veracity of multi-thousand year old culturally biased texts open to much interpretation, is consigned to eternal damnation and torture. I can't reconcile that in my head. Real World - what's the difference? Please explain what you mean.
"Don't believe everything you see on the Internet" - Abraham Lincoln
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Campfire Outfitter
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The motive is the key. Do you do good things because you want to look good or do you do them because you want God to be pleased with your life. To me, both motives are selfish. The only difference is the size of the payoff. Yet, according to what many are saying here, some person who does good deeds for others because it's the right thing to do, and without expectation of reward, but can't get over conceptual hangups over the veracity of multi-thousand year old culturally biased texts open to much interpretation, is consigned to eternal damnation and torture. I can't reconcile that in my head. Real World - what's the difference? Please explain what you mean. Assume that 100% of people do the right thing for "selfish" motives. How would we know? What would be different?
Last edited by Tyrone; 01/15/21.
Politics is War by Other Means
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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The motive is the key. Do you do good things because you want to look good or do you do them because you want God to be pleased with your life.
To me, both motives are selfish. The only difference is the size of the payoff. Yet, according to what many are saying here, some person who does good deeds for others because it's the right thing to do, and without expectation of reward, but can't get over conceptual hangups over the veracity of multi-thousand year old culturally biased texts open to much interpretation, is consigned to eternal damnation and torture. I can't reconcile that in my head. The Bible also teaches us to do our good deeds without the other person knowing or anyone else. If you practice that then it wipes away any selfishness. Hard to be secretive about opening a door for someone or something like that but sometimes people just need to see there are still some that like doing acts of kindness. It used to be more of a way of life for people but we seem to be letting that slip away. I enjoy being helpful. If I mow my neighbors yard while he's gone and nobody tells him it's all the same to me. It boils down to this for me. Where did good traits come from in the very beginning? Yes mankind has passed them down but at some point there was the very first man so who taught him? For me the Bible answers that. So if you personally do good most likely you want the same from others. Doing good is a reward in itself. It promotes a better world. I realize some don't want that and that's why we have bad. We promote what's in our hearts.
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a lot of folks are not willing to let god save whom ever he so chooses... My father was Presbyterian, but I don't believe that predestination stuff.. So you don't believe Revelation 13:8 which states all those (in the Book of Life) are ona select list compiled way back at the time of the foundation of the world. I still don't believe in predestination. Do you??
Patriotism (and religion) is the last refuge of a scoundrel.
Jesus: "Take heed that no man deceive you."
Hebrew Roots Judaizer
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Campfire Outfitter
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What anyone believes is irrelevant.
For belief alone does not substantiate
anything other than having an opinon.
One thing that is agreed substantiated fact
by scholars, is that Scripture contains glaring
errors that many Christians avoid addressing
because it rattles their 'beliefs'..
Far easier just to gloss over what you don't like
to see and carry on with the 'infallibilty' myth.
-Bulletproof and Waterproof don't mean Idiotproof.
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Campfire Tracker
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People are sinners always have been. Jesus gave us a way to overcome who we are. Salvation is a free gift. We are very fortunate to have been born here in the US. Our life is easy and good compared to most places. Most of us have more than we deserve.
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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We are Sinners? Why would that be? Because Adam and Eve made a mistake?
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Campfire Kahuna
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OP
Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Sep 2011
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These premises insured by a Sheltie in Training ,--- and Cooey.o
"May the Good Lord take a likin' to you"
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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Maybe God is pissed because the righteous have not taken out Sodom and Gomorrah again. DC is probably pretty close tot the top of the list.
Dog I rescued in January ![[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]](https://i.postimg.cc/yYDjsxrQ/IMG-0124.jpg)
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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My question was: if we are sinners, why are we sinners? If we are sinners, what makes us sinners? For instance, do you choose to be a sinner?
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Sep 2011
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These premises insured by a Sheltie in Training ,--- and Cooey.o
"May the Good Lord take a likin' to you"
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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... For instance, do you choose to be
a sinner? Folks sin for the same basic reason dogs lick their nuts... coz they can. IF man could do what dogs do, they would still do it even if God told them not to. Some might say it's a curse from God that man can't have the pleasure of lickn' his own nuts...😂 Bottom line anyone who is a sinner does not serve God, but serves God's adversary...but some try and superficially hide the fact by being a self righteous Bible thumping prick.
-Bulletproof and Waterproof don't mean Idiotproof.
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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So we are not to blame for our condition? The fault is not ours?
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Joined: Dec 2013
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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What anyone believes is irrelevant.
For belief alone does not substantiate
anything other than having an opinon.
One thing that is agreed substantiated fact
by scholars, is that Scripture contains glaring
errors that many Christians avoid addressing
because it rattles their 'beliefs'..
Far easier just to gloss over what you don't like
to see and carry on with the 'infallibilty' myth.
OK,I agree with you somewhat that the scriptures of the accepted bibles such as KJV et al have contradictions. The bible was compiled by folks sometimes with an agenda. Books were included and excluded by fallible people. Words were spoken in Hebrew or Aramaic then translated into Greek and then into other languages. Languages often don't quite translate exactly. Meaning and nuance can be lost when going from one language to another. That said I do believe Jesus' teachings managed to run the gauntlet and get through fairly intact. I don't accept the pope, the bible, or any religion to be infallible. I am going with the Hebrew scriptures and Jesus words and watch closely for words ascribed to Jesus that don't mesh with his general teachings. Thanks for taking part in the discussion and God bless.
Patriotism (and religion) is the last refuge of a scoundrel.
Jesus: "Take heed that no man deceive you."
Hebrew Roots Judaizer
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True indeed. Not only by birth but also by choice of course. Some of these folks act like God is to blame. He's their only Solution. "For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord." Romans 6:23
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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People are sinners always have been. Jesus gave us a way to overcome who we are. Salvation is a free gift. We are very fortunate to have been born here in the US. Our life is easy and good compared to most places. Most of us have more than we deserve.
Agree
Romans 5:1
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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We are not cursed by God. We are cursed by people who believe something that isn`t so.
Last edited by funnybone; 01/15/21.
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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OK,I agree with you somewhat that the scriptures of the accepted bibles such as KJV et al have contradictions. The bible was compiled by folks sometimes with an agenda. Books were included and excluded by fallible people. Words were spoken in Hebrew or Aramaic then translated into Greek and then into other languages. Languages often don't quite translate exactly. Meaning and nuance can be lost when going from one language to another. . No I don't mean due to translation issues, Just straight out blatant error... Scholars say the Gospels just got things plain wrong, Error that cannot simply be attributed to issues with translation. .. The bible was compiled by folks
sometimes with an agenda. Books were included and excluded by fallible people. . Some christians have said books were included and excluded under divine inspiration..so I take that to mean what God willed.
-Bulletproof and Waterproof don't mean Idiotproof.
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Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 13,285 Likes: 15
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 13,285 Likes: 15 |
OK,I agree with you somewhat that the scriptures of the accepted bibles such as KJV et al have contradictions. The bible was compiled by folks sometimes with an agenda. Books were included and excluded by fallible people. Words were spoken in Hebrew or Aramaic then translated into Greek and then into other languages. Languages often don't quite translate exactly. Meaning and nuance can be lost when going from one language to another. . No I don't mean due to translation issues, Just straight out blatant error... Scholars say the Gospels just got things plain wrong, Error that cannot simply be attributed to issues with translation. .. The bible was compiled by folks sometimes with an agenda. Books were included and excluded by fallible people. . Some christians have said books were included and excluded under divine inspiration..so I takethat to mean what God willed. OK, some ''christians'' say a lot of things. You cut out part of my comment that would indicate I take things with a grain of salt and I try to sift out inconsistencies. I was pretty clear that I believe there were a combination of things that caused contradiction and inconsistency. Not the least of which would be people with an agenda of their own.
Patriotism (and religion) is the last refuge of a scoundrel.
Jesus: "Take heed that no man deceive you."
Hebrew Roots Judaizer
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