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Originally Posted by Birdwatcher
Originally Posted by DocRocket
Shelton also notes that bears that have been sprayed before tend to be less susceptible the second time they're sprayed, and that bears that are truly attacking (as opposed to charging to chase you off) are also less susceptible to spray.


As I posted somewhere earlier I used bear spray on aggressive dogs eight times over about a ten year period. To add context to that, that was a period in my life when I would frequently walk my then two blue heelers on long walks through my West Side neighborhood.

Loose dogs were frequent, and it was my observation that the inbound dogs were targeting my dogs more than me. Almost all aggressive-acting dogs on the street could be bluffed off through body posture and shouting. I prob’ly walked those dogs more’n 1,500 times during that decade, had to resort to bear spray IIRC jus eight or nine times.

Most times I missed the dog, the geometry of the spray can causes you to shoot low, it seemed the sudden blast and prob’ly unfamiliar odor startled the dog.

The one time the spray DIDN’T work was on a big female Rottweiler that came up unseen from behind after my dog. My dog ran in two big ovals trying to get away and yet stay by me and on each close pass I caught that rott full in the face at close range, twice.

About that time the apologetic owner came out, called off and leashedher dog. As we stood there talking, the dog did rub its face in the grass, prob’ly because of the sheer volume I hit it with, otherwise it didn’t act particularly distressed.

All of this to point out it might be just the sudden blast that startles the bear, not so much the capsasin itself.




Where are you hanging out that you're continually being attacked by dogs?


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Originally Posted by dogcatcher223
Originally Posted by Birdwatcher
Originally Posted by DocRocket
Shelton also notes that bears that have been sprayed before tend to be less susceptible the second time they're sprayed, and that bears that are truly attacking (as opposed to charging to chase you off) are also less susceptible to spray.


As I posted somewhere earlier I used bear spray on aggressive dogs eight times over about a ten year period. To add context to that, that was a period in my life when I would frequently walk my then two blue heelers on long walks through my West Side neighborhood.

Loose dogs were frequent, and it was my observation that the inbound dogs were targeting my dogs more than me. Almost all aggressive-acting dogs on the street could be bluffed off through body posture and shouting. I prob’ly walked those dogs more’n 1,500 times during that decade, had to resort to bear spray IIRC jus eight or nine times.

Most times I missed the dog, the geometry of the spray can causes you to shoot low, it seemed the sudden blast and prob’ly unfamiliar odor startled the dog.

The one time the spray DIDN’T work was on a big female Rottweiler that came up unseen from behind after my dog. My dog ran in two big ovals trying to get away and yet stay by me and on each close pass I caught that rott full in the face at close range, twice.

About that time the apologetic owner came out, called off and leashedher dog. As we stood there talking, the dog did rub its face in the grass, prob’ly because of the sheer volume I hit it with, otherwise it didn’t act particularly distressed.

All of this to point out it might be just the sudden blast that startles the bear, not so much the capsasin itself.




Where are you hanging out that you're continually being attacked by dogs?


Have you never read his posts before? smile


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Originally Posted by Jackson_Handy
Originally Posted by szihn
The bunny-huggers love pepper for bears. So I dip my bullets in cayenne before I load them into my 44s or 454 Casull.
Best of both worlds. Right?

All joking aside, spray usually works, but I would NOT bet my life on spray alone EVER! I carry guns, usually both a handgun and a long arm. Where I live and hunt Grizzlies are very common. I have personally never been charged, but I wear a seat belt when I drive too, and I have never been in a bad wreck either.

Because you haven't doesn't mean you never will.



Where you live huh? For reals?


So when is the last time a grizz was south of boysen reservoir?

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I don’t know him or where he lives but you could find all the grizzlies you wanted on or near a lot of the wind river and it’s tributaries.

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Originally Posted by George_De_Vries_3rd

[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]


That’s a great pic! Thanks!


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Originally Posted by ironbender


That’s a great pic! Thanks!



That it is.

Always nice to see a string of mules with mantied loads.

Anymore bout all I ever run into is folks packing easy horses haphazardly loaded with bright orange plastic pack boxes and snap on panniers make of neon colored nylon.

Suppose it gets the job done but that gear will never have the same appeal for me.

I've rode out a lot of that Bob Marshall country and can typically recognize by the mountains or ridge lines where a photo was most likely taken.

I can't quite put my finger on where they were in this photo.
I'm guessing east side, Sun River or maybe even South Fork area where I spent a lot less time.

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Originally Posted by dogcatcher223
Where are you hanging out that you're continually being attacked by dogs?


West Side, San Antonio. At that time walking my dogs was my own chief form of exercise, I figure three times a week or more over a ten year period, eight or nine bear spray occasions during that time. Mail carriers might have similar stats.


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Originally Posted by JeffA
Originally Posted by ironbender


That’s a great pic! Thanks!



That it is.

Always nice to see a string of mules with mantied loads.

Anymore bout all I ever run into is folks packing easy horses haphazardly loaded with bright orange plastic pack boxes and snap on panniers make of neon colored nylon.

Suppose it gets the job done but that gear will never have the same appeal for me.


I've rode out a lot of that Bob Marshall country and can typically recognize by the mountains or ridge lines where a photo was most likely taken.

I can't quite put my finger on where they were in this photo.
I'm guessing east side, Sun River or maybe even South Fork area where I spent a lot less time.


I should be able to but can’t tell you except we went in going west from the Bynum Reservoir but we came out a different route, much further south I believe. Both pack-in and -out were on the order of six, seven hours or so. But, yes, east side and Sun River rings a bell for me.

We didn’t see a lot of game other than the blacks though my buddy in the “five star” camp passed on a bull and took a nice mule deer at about 400 yds. However, the weather was perfect and the wilderness scenery was spectacular every day in every direction. It was early October if memory serves.

I often regret not getting back to “the Bob”

But, back to Ursa horribilus; there was a reason they kept a dog in camp. All game was kept hung high and the packed-in horse chow was placed such that it took a highly motivated bear to reach it and the above incident was not the first although the most successful on the part of the bear at that time.

Edit: BTW, this experience was long before the advent of bear spray. Rifles were at the ready in their camp and ours, not that the attitude was other than a “last resort in an extremely serious situation” as it should have been.

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Originally Posted by Ralphie
I don’t know him or where he lives but you could find all the grizzlies you wanted on or near a lot of the wind river and it’s tributaries.



I know Steve personally, and where he lives. I believe he is saying Wyoming or to be more specific, Fremont county. But I'm sure JacksonHandy knows that.

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Stricks;
Good morning to you sir, I hope the week treated you acceptably and all in your world are well.

Thanks ever so much for putting up that video, I hadn't heard of this chap or Corlane's channel even. It was excellent in all ways and very educational.

Interestingly I've always been "that guy" who didn't lash my rifle or meat packing shotgun onto the pack - just because. I suppose it's the half empty glass outlook on stuff happening to me, not sure, but there's a fantastic example of why not to.

I'll have to reconsider a Spot of some sort too. My kids have been wanting me to get one as I'm often solo hunting and there's an example of it being a life saver for sure.

We've got family up in Grande Prairie so I keep up a wee bit with the weather in your world, but I hope it's mostly spring already where you're at.

Thanks again and all the best.

Dwayne


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Originally Posted by Stricks


Here in the Peace region (and other areas) it was just announced the Grizzly population has doubled since 2005, many (meaning all I speak with) believe that happened well before 2021 and that the population could well have quadrupled. Without a season, these encounters can only increase … time will certainly tell.

For those wishing to hear how quickly things can go south I will include a recent (2015) Grizzly attack on two sheep hunters in northern BC ( a little long so start at the 1:02 mark if desired, yes I know their rifles weren't at the ready).






Good to hear from a Peace River country man!

I hunted black bear in your area in spring of ‘17 and the guides told me they were seeing a few more griz than they had in the past. The banning of grizzly hunting is insane. It’s going to cost human lives before those commies in Edmonton fix it.

I didn’t have time to watch the video this morning, I’ll catch it later.


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Originally Posted by George_De_Vries_3rd

Doc Roc, Sticks, and Birdw, all very interesting. Doc, special thanks for taking points and addressing them individually. Always informative.

Sorry, a pic of a pic here as it was ‘92 and pre-cell phone and it took effort to remember to take a pic. We watched grizzlies every day on this trip. It began when the outfitter flew over our tents, banked sharply to the right, and threw steaks out of the window of his Super Cub. But my eye was on a grizzly “standing” upright a hundred yards away, apparently, at least partly interested.

But the guide who placed his tent right next to ours had all the eggs, flour, and bacon and other goodies in it. His comment: “we’ve never had trouble yet.” 😊

[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]



Thanks for the post, George. I see that there is a local shortage of trees for making a food cache in that pic... might explain the attitude of “we haven’t had trouble YET.”


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Well, Jeff, I’ll admit we are big on Ralide panniers, but we are obligated to bump a lot of trees on our trails. They do hold up well.


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Originally Posted by BC30cal
Stricks;
Good morning to you sir, I hope the week treated you acceptably and all in your world are well.

Thanks ever so much for putting up that video, I hadn't heard of this chap or Corlane's channel even. It was excellent in all ways and very educational.



To you as well Dwayne and the week…well it’s a good thing we’re mostly outdoorsmen or this covid thing would have a much larger toll .. would it not?

Yep, Corlanes is well spoken of around here and much further afield I would think as their shop and custom gunsmiths are capable of good things I hear.

You know with the cancellation of the Grizz hunt in AB and now BC the dispersal rate of younger bears has a lag time, but that lag time should end very soon. I have heard first hand from hunters as close as ½ hour from here and as far as Doc’s aforementioned Willmore W.A. that a day chasing Elk can produce zero sightings unless Grizzly count…in that case 10 -15 separate sightings, easily.

Another indicator of increased presence are guides and hunters baiting blacks but having the bait area claimed by a Grizz shortly thereafter , essentially shutting down the area… also not uncommon.


Doc .. It is a long video but well worth the time (IMO), maybe more so in your case as one of the hunters was an EMT (and sees it through his anatomical lens). His video #7 is part 2 found here…

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=coTpfYr6Z6o&t=391s




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Gotta couple things I want to clarify with you Mike.

First and foremost, about that photo I posted of that poor mule layin' on the ground hog tied.

There were only two outta the ten I had that would try to kill ya when it came to getting shod.
Only had to throw them the first couple years after they were broke to pack, after that I could get them all done standing.

[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]

One thing I never was able to do with a mule was to get one to pack a Grizzly. I had no problem getting a Black Bear packed on one but they just couldn't deal with having a Giz on their backs..I'm speaking of dead bears ya know...

[Linked Image]

The other thing is this.
I have a nice set of panniers, there heavy canvas and leather.
Nothing wrong with them other than they can be a bit limiting to pack bulky, odd sized things in at times.

Many of the mantied loads seen in my images contain plywood pack boxes I hammer together myself.

One nice thing about using manties is, I can rollup 4 together with the ropes inside after I drop off supplies and head home empty as seen on the last mule in this string.

[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]

A good set of panniers cost some coin compared to the price of a mantie and a rope and I'm a tightwad so that could weigh in there too.

You wouldn't believe what I've done before just to save the cost of a bullet.

[Linked Image]


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Love the pics Jeff.

Give me a decker and some mantie tarps/ropes all day over a sawbuck and panniers. I hated putting shoes on mules that had to be thrown. For a lot of reasons, but sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do lol.


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When I was living in da ‘banks, I got a call from a fellow down in Slana, to shoe his personal string of hunting/packing horses.

I’m under one of them and three pickups pull into the guy’s yard. It was the “chief” from the native village down the road. They wanted to see horses shod standing. They’d never seen it. 🤔


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Jeff, commendations for taking, or having pic’s taken when one had to be much more intentional about it.

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Stricks;
Good evening to you sir and thanks for the reply, I appreciate it.

I should have been more clear in that I've actually dealt with Corlane's before and want to say I've talked to the gunsmith in the video. He and they are indeed well thought of as far as I'm aware.

What I didn't know was about the video channel - as if I don't spend too much time already watching YouTube videos.... wink

You are, in my view, bang on with your assessment of grizzlies on both sides of the big hills. It's easy to create edicts when one lives in Victoria and doesn't travel the back country ever. It's bad enough one valley over that a buddy has named the local grizzlies now that hang around his cabin. Fun times.

Indeed being outdoors types does make the beer flu mess easier to take somewhat for sure.

Thanks again and all the best to you all.

Dwayne


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JeffA;
Good evening to you sir, I hope the day was decent to you.

Thanks so much for the photos again, they look to me to be straight out of an Ed Nixon story! cool

By saying that I mean it in the highest compliment I can give, as one of his stories talked about the horse bells in the pasture on the hobbled horses and it so affected me that we ended up going on a pack trip into the Wilmore Wilderness north of Jasper National Park.

It wasn't long after that we got our own pair of horses too and had them for 15 years I believe it was.

Anyways sir, thanks so very much for sharing, I couldn't enjoy them more!

All the best.

Dwayne


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