I was on the Interstate yesterday when a really nice crew-cab 1-ton dodge welding truck passed me in the fast lane. It caught my eye because it was red, with a custom black bobtail flatbed, big welding machine, and 35" or so offroad tires on polished alloy rims. Fairly new truck and spotless. Driver's front seat probably wasn't spotless after the enormous shimmy that developed in the front end right after he passed me. I've never seen anything like that in my life. Those big front tires began oscillating so badly that they looked to be nearly15 degrees off the vertical axis, flopping in and out of the fenderwells, and all of this at 75mph. Guy pulled over into the grass median and shut it down.
I'd be really sore if my $50k+ truck nearly killed me on the highway. I'm assuming it was death wobble, as the whole front end was doing it, although I suppose something could have broken. Anybody ever had it happen to them? I know of one local guy who had Dodge take his 3500 4x4 back after they couldn't solve it.
I had one in my '08 2500 a while back. The tie rod ends, pitman arm, and the ball joints were worn out at about 135k. Remember a while back when we had a thread about the pickup that was hanging by it's trailer hitch off of a bridge in so. Idaho? My shimmy started on the same bridge although in the other direction. I'd slowed to about 60 as I was towing a light utility trailer but when I hit that bump, it got lively. It quit when I got down to about 50. They hadn't given me any hint of being worn until then.
Back in the 70's and before, this was common. I'd experienced it quite a few times growing up. Modern cars are much better built and now it's almost a rarity in comparison.
βIn a time of deceit telling the truth is a revolutionary act.β β George Orwell
It's not over when you lose. It's over when you quit.
i had a 2012 power wagon that did it so bad that even after upgrading the track bar and tierod ends it still did it. ended up trading it in because i didn't want my wife to drive it
I don't know anything about the death wobble with Ram trucks, but recall handling problems with the 1st gen. I remember driving my boss' truck from Phoenix to Tucson and at one point it had a mind of its own and wanted to change lanes on me. Might have been the road surface, tires, or something else and not the truck though. Scared the crap out of me.
Any truck with a solid front axle can be susceptible to it. Fixes include replacing any worn steering/suspension parts, and most importantly, adding more cater to the alignment. Go to the high end, or even over the factory specs.
My '11 F250 PSD did it @ under 30K Mi. Nothing was worn. I'd put on a set of NItto Trail Grappler tires and had them @ 65PSI per the sticker in the door. At the prodding of the service advisor I trust who'd replaced a bunch of stuff on several super-duty's prior to mine I ran them up to ~72-75PSI and never had another problem. He'd diagnosed the problem as "Sidewall flex" in the tires. The Continental highway tires the truck came with were fine @ 65# as were a set of BFG AT 2 and now Nitto Exo Grapplers w/3-belt sidewalls. The Nitto Terra Grapplers I run in the summer are better handling @ 75-80PSI.
I was skeptical that the extra tire pressure would fix my problem, but it did. I'm just @ 190K Mi. I replaced the shocks/steering stabilizer about 20K Mi ago as well as upper/lower tie-rod ends. It goes down the road @ 80MPH with nary a wiggle. Between today and Sunday I'll put another +/- 700Mi on it mostly running 80ish on the interstate and 70 on the little bit of 2-lane I'll have to run.
I can walk on water.......................but I do stagger a bit on alcohol.
I forgot to fully tighten the lug nuts on both front wheels at a friends house once and drove off. Felt about like the truck in that video as soon as I got going.
Nephew had an 04 Ram 2500 that did it. had replaced tie rod ends, ball joints and I don't remember what all. Never could cure it and sold the truck. I had and issue with my 90 3/4 ton doing it. Turned out it was the tires I had with what was determined as radial run out. BFG A/T's had 30k miles on them . No more problems with it after I put new tires on.
Flimsy truck frames and fkn stamped sheet metal control arms cant help the situation.
Back in the early 90s when the big three were still in the dark ages, Toyota brought about a phenomenal coil over solid axle set up on the 80 series landcruisers. Having personally driven and owned a half dozen of them each with over 200,000 miles, non of them had death wobble even with sloppy ball joints. This coming from a guy that aint no Toyota fan boy.
Solid metal control arms, massive, press fit control arm bushings, proper axle pinion angle, yada yada yada.....
Fun fact: Dodge is the mechanical equivalent of AIDS.......it left the factory with HIV.
First time I experienced it was in an 89 F350 4wd. Bad track bar bushing was the culprit.
Second time was in my 79 Bronco. Same problem and same cure, track bar bushing.
My 2019 and my dadβs 2018 Super Duties were both blessed with the defective steering shock. His was worse than mine but they both got it. New steering dampers and neither has had an episode since.
But yeah itβs a thing with any solid axle 4x4. You can either have the durability and easier to work on with a Ford or Dodge solid axle or you can have the wimpy CV joints and A arms on a GM as far as HD pickups go. Both have their pluses and minuses.
First time I experienced it was in an 89 F350 4wd. Bad track bar bushing was the culprit.
Second time was in my 79 Bronco. Same problem and same cure, track bar bushing.
My 2019 and my dadβs 2018 Super Duties were both blessed with the defective steering shock. His was worse than mine but they both got it. New steering dampers and neither has had an episode since.
But yeah itβs a thing with any solid axle 4x4. You can either have the durability and easier to work on with a Ford or Dodge solid axle or you can have the wimpy CV joints and A arms on a GM as far as HD pickups go. Both have their pluses and minuses.
Or, Buy the Toyota the salesman claims is 3/4 ton. But Toyota won't rate as such!π
Parents who say they have good kids..Usually don't!
DW twice. One was a ZJ in good shape, steering dampener took a chit. New one and all was well. Other was a well worn lifted and beat up ZJ.............ball joint upper drivers side.
My old Company truck f450 diesel Would do that horribly Was at about 35 mph. Never did it any faster Had it looked at several times nothing bad in the front end I figured it was somthing to do with tires Never had a Chevy do it
My old Company truck f450 diesel Would do that horribly Was at about 35 mph. Never did it any faster Had it looked at several times nothing bad in the front end I figured it was somthing to do with tires Never had a Chevy do it
GM's lack of solid front axle since the late 80's means no death wobble. It also means no solid axle either.
I can walk on water.......................but I do stagger a bit on alcohol.
I recently had that happen on a 88 F350, the first time it was track bar bushings, replaced them and it was good. Then the next time it did it I replaced a couple tie rod ends and a drag link, it didn't fix the problem. I then realized it may be the tires, I took them in and one of them was separating, new front tires and problem solved.
I had the same issue on a 85 chevy k30...new tires fixed it.
When did the term 'death wobble' show up? It used to be called a shimmy. Years ago I bought an old '52 Ford pickup from my uncle that did it bad. He told me it did some funny things with the steering sometimes. He wasn't kidding.
βIn a time of deceit telling the truth is a revolutionary act.β β George Orwell
It's not over when you lose. It's over when you quit.
Reading this thread reminded me of a motorcycle video I saw back in the 70s when I used to ride. A bunch of us were lured in my the local community college to view riding safety films but the real draw was to watch a special film on "King Kenny" aka Kenny Roberts. The riders in the dunlap tires film entitled Wobble and Weave impressed the hell out of me. Go directly to footage 2:20 to see it the first of many examples. A death wobble in a four wheel vehicle takes on a new level of terror with only two wheels! The weave footage is pretty wild too.
Happened to me with my son, on the interstate, in my less than 30k miles 2019 F250. Got really lucky we weren't in an accident, scared me pretty bad with him in there.
Didn't want to deal with the headache at the dealership, and refused to take my wife or kid on the interstate in it again. Traded 2 days later for a half ton Chevy.
I had an old '66 chevy 1/2 t long bed that the steering sector and front end was wore out. Get above 35ish, hit a bump, and it would wobble bad. Almost take the steering wheel out of you hand. Hit the brake, slow down to under 35, and it would stop. Drove it back and forth to work until I save money for a down payment on a new truck.
Old Turd- Deplorable- Unrepentant Murderer- Domestic Violent Extremist
I bought a new 1998.5 dodge diesel. In the first year it almost threw me off the side of a highway with that ferocious wobble/shimmy. Colorado Springs dealer was useless. I figured out the steering stabilizer was bad, replaced it with a heavy duty after market, fixed it. 24 years later no problem.
On the other hand, it has always had the βDWI wanderingβ making it a little difficult to stay in the lane on the highway. From what Iβve read itβs due to flexing of inadequate metal support of the steering box. $150 kits are available to stiffen the gear box support , I just havenβt taken the time to get the kit and install it. This wandering disappears if the truck is loaded and/or is towing a trailer.
I hit a pretty mild RR track across the highway in my K5 and it got my right front into some phase where it hopped violently. Slowed down, went away, never happened again.
Had a worn ball joint on a Jeep ZJ that got somr shake at 45 mph. Changed it and fixed.
Was not what Id call DW.
I did get that on a ZJ when steering dampener went. Bout shake your ass out of the vehicle.
New one fixed it.
Buds kid did a lift on an XJ, 33s and all new suspension. DW scared the hell out of em both.
Told em retighten everything. Said they did. DW remained. Said tighten everything, claimed they did.
After a few more of me telling him that new stuff shouldnt do that and his kid aint a mechanic, they went back and tightened everything again and the DW was gone.
I ran 4.5 " of lift on two old XJs w 31s. New lower c arms and and it was one finger at 80 on highway, w no sway bars.
Tighten that chit up. Dont use cheap parts ( I liked Rubicon Express back in the day ).
Had a CJ 7 that would do it, when I first bought it, out of MD(no inspection). Took it for our inspection, the mechanic who normally would give me a sticker and let me fix stuff later, told me the tie rod and drag link ends were shot. "I wouldn't drive it much, fix them and I'll give you a sticker".
When I went to unscrew the end from the drag link, it fell apart. Glad that didn't happen during a wobble!
New ends helped, but it would still do it around 85mph. Even at 22, I soon realized a 15 year old CJ-7 with mud tires didn't need to go 85!
Parents who say they have good kids..Usually don't!
When did 'shimmy' get changed to 'death wobble'? By any name, though, when it happens you'll wish it didn't. Years ago I had a '55 Chevy pickup that had a bad shimmy problem. It had lots of other problems, too. I sold it 'as is'. The cause is always the same thing - worn steering parts. Between the steering box, tie rods, ball joints, etc., there are a lot of joints to wear out and it's all high stress. Lately it seems that Dodge and Ford are getting all the bad press but the others have their share of it, too.
βIn a time of deceit telling the truth is a revolutionary act.β β George Orwell
It's not over when you lose. It's over when you quit.
I've put polyurethane track rod bushings on high mile rigs... '89 F350, an Excursion, and a '99 F350. Combined with new rod ends and drag links and ball joints and kingpins as applicable and reman steering box, they drive like new for a long time. New front springs on the excursion and the '99 helped also as they'd have new bushings.
Any rig that has an axle located with rubber bushings is subject to issues like these. I've not looked into the newer rigs with solid axles and coil spings, but am guessing the issues get more complicated as the bushings have to both pivot and twist, and polyurethane won't squish to allow a twist.
I had one in my '08 2500 a while back. The tie rod ends, pitman arm, and the ball joints were worn out at about 135k. Remember a while back when we had a thread about the pickup that was hanging by it's trailer hitch off of a bridge in so. Idaho? My shimmy started on the same bridge although in the other direction. I'd slowed to about 60 as I was towing a light utility trailer but when I hit that bump, it got lively. It quit when I got down to about 50. They hadn't given me any hint of being worn until then.
Back in the 70's and before, this was common. I'd experienced it quite a few times growing up. Modern cars are much better built and now it's almost a rarity in comparison.
Same truck as mine but mine made it to 139k last summer. No prior notice and when leaving camp and got up to about 55 all hell broke loose, I was about sideways before I could get it somewhat under control. Eased it to a friends garage and he ended up replacing everything it in the frontend, no problem since. He told me it had a lot to do with me having a plow which is almost 1000 pounds and is on the truck from Dec-March.
When my '05 TJ would do it it was no mere "shimmy". The son of a bitch would bounce from front tire to front tire so violently that it would have flung my ass out the door and onto the pavement if I hadn't been belted in. That's no lie and no exaggeration. It's a positive feedback in the factory inverted-Y steering geometry which usually only occurs when one of the rod ends or control arm ends is not sufficiently tight. I don't mean "not up to factory specs." What was required with that jeep was far far far beyond factory specs but it did resolve the issue. Sometimes a front steering stabilizer will fix it but most often not. Funny thing was my '98 which had much larger tires never did any death wobble and didn't even have a front steering stabilizer.
Tom
Anyone who thinks there's two sides to everything hasn't met a MοΏ½bius strip.
ah yes dodge trucks. biggest POS vehicle i ever owned was an 05 1500. about the only thing it didn't have was the death wobble. its favorite trick was to just shut off when letting off the gas like going into a turn. makes you appreciate power steering and brakes. it was completely rotted out by 2011. rear end shot, interior coming apart, gas tank leaking, ball joints gone. when i traded that worthless POS in it had less than 90k miles on it. built ram tough.
Bought my Wrangler new in 2008. It has developed the DW twice over the years. The steering damper was the issue both times. The first time was on I-65 in Birmingham rush hour traffic. It was a life altering experience. Second time was driving home after hunting. I thought that one was caused by mud buildup on the front tires, but found out differently.
Thinking that using the Cummins saved Dodge/Ram trucks. And they tried to screw that up by barely having a platform worthy of the extra weight & torque.
Without the Cummins, I'm not sure Dodge trucks would have survived.
Many owners drive those things around unaware that their front end components are badly & prematurely worn due to the gradual decent & their getting used to it daily. Someone else might drive the truck & ask; what the hell is wrong with this thing? Seen it happen more than once.
I have driven roughly 632k miles combined on 3 live axle Dodge/Ram trucks, one a 1500, the other 2 2500 Cummins powered. I have yet to experience any kind of "death wobble". Current truck is a 2014 with 190k. The only suspension maintenance I've done to it is the installation of King Racing shocks at 105k and a set of front wheel hubs at 180k. Ball joints, tie rods, steering stabiliser, track rod are all original. My 2003 2500 needed ball joints at 248k miles.
Pretty sure a lot of the death wobble complaints are amplified by oversize, incorrect offset wheels, poor wheel balance and incorrect alignment.
Last edited by badger; 04/01/22.
To anger a conservative, lie to him. To annoy a liberal, tell him the truth.
