This is more and more on the armorer. I don’t see that big a problem with shooting the guns off set like it is alleged they did IF you had an armorer who was on his/her game and made sure that every live round was fired and/or kept completely separate from dummy rounds. I mean it’s a single action revolver. Accounting for hulls isn’t difficult. If you go out with fifty shells in a box, you return with fifty empties in the same box or 49 hulls and one live one in the same box. Not hard to do.
Being only 24, it doesn’t sound like she took that job with the seriousness it deserved and demanded. There were other people at fault as well, but the first frick up started with hiring her.
"These .38 special "dummy" rounds are completely inert and have no powder whatsoever. Made from 100% real ammunition components."
The only rounds I ever fired that were completely inert wound up stuck in my barrel!
Then they weren't completely inert...
Must be "fake" primers going into those inert rounds then....but easy enough to pull out the components of the primer I guess. Perhaps they carry a good insurance policy in case the do not pull out those components and something bad happens.
The "Master Armorer" should have been following basic safety and due diligence protocols. No live ammo should have been allowed anywhere on the site at all. If the cast wanted to shoot the guns, then they should have done so off site.
Much like a (professional) .Mil/Le/.Gov trainer goes through steps to minimize risk prior to a training such as force on force, building searches, etc, there should have been very clear steps in place to assure that each and every person handling a weapon had no live ammo on their person. These steps are checked and double checked. This is done in layers.
It is quite obvious that the "Master Armorer" had zero experience and zero training in such things.
THE CHAIR IS AGAINST THE WALL.
The Tikka T3 in .308 Winchester is the Glock 19 of the rifle world.
I don’t believe that’s what they use. They might for certain scenes or in gun belts but I would think there would be a totally different, distinguishable round for firearms.
This is more and more on the armorer. I don’t see that big a problem with shooting the guns off set like it is alleged they did IF you had an armorer who was on his/her game and made sure that every live round was fired and/or kept completely separate from dummy rounds. I mean it’s a single action revolver. Accounting for hulls isn’t difficult. If you go out with fifty shells in a box, you return with fifty empties in the same box or 49 hulls and one live one in the same box. Not hard to do.
Being only 24, it doesn’t sound like she took that job with the seriousness it deserved and demanded. There were other people at fault as well, but the first frick up started with hiring her.
Nope. It is not a matter of counting.
You don't have any live ammo on a site at all. Not one single round. Just like on a training site for .gov/.mil. Absolutely no live ammo at all.
THE CHAIR IS AGAINST THE WALL.
The Tikka T3 in .308 Winchester is the Glock 19 of the rifle world.
About the only thing I can be sure of is Baldwin was the producer. He was the star. He had responsibility for the production. It was a low cost production. He and he alone aimed and pulled the trigger. It's impossible to separate fact from fiction on what happened but those things are set in stone. Cold gun, hot gun, really doesn't matter until you can know for sure what you have in your hands. He didn't and it cost a life.
Mackay; Top of the morning to you sir, I hope that the wind hasn't blown you folks away the last couple of days and that you and your fine family are well.
There's been a bunch of discussion on this topic on this side of the medicine line as well of course and one of the videos I've watched on the subject was educational, or I thought so anyways.
The chap Ian is interviewing is the head of one of the biggest, if not the biggest firearm supplier for movies shot up here as well as some LEO and military training as wel
The discussion on the video might indicate that the low budget film wasn't using modified firearms for the blanks?
Anyways, as someone who has walked past a movie being shot in Vancouver a couple times, I know quite a bit less than absolutely nothing on the subject.
All the best to you all sir and good luck on your remaining hunts.
They found a stock of "live" ammo on the set yesterday, along with a fanny pack that had "live" ammo in it. So sounds like some very basic rules were broken, and that falls on the armorer.
Meh, no live rounds on the set. Well, okay. What about in the armorer’s car? The point is, taking a pistol from the set to some place off set and plinking with it shouldn’t have been a big deal if basic common sense rules had been followed. It really shouldn’t have been any harder than unloading your guns before you go into the house. All the transporting of the guns and ammo too and from the site should have been done by the armorer.
And as for some other kind of dummy rounds being used, I doubt it. The purpose of a movie is to mimic reality. You pay people well to put in systems to make sure frick ups don’t happen. It sounds to me like this was more of a free for all. I can imagine it was a combination of the armorer being to young to take things as seriously as they deserved and not having the chops to make sure people did what she told them to do.
I doubt that you could find one single person here on the campfire that would pick up ANY firearm, supposedly safe,empty, double checked...whatever...cock it, aim it in the direction of a human, and deliberately pull the trigger. The people in our world just don't do that, mentally can't make themselves do that. I can't see excusing that because of the so called standard practices of the film industry. News article interviews have explained that when the gun is to be pointed into the camera...remote monitors are used, so no one is in front of the gun when the hammer falls. Yes, a lot of fails leading up to this, but you can't deny that in the end, an adult man deliberately pulled the trigger when the gun was lined up on crew members.
Well this is a fine pickle we're in, should'a listened to Joe McCarthy and George Orwell I guess.
I doubt that you could find one single person here on the campfire that would pick up ANY firearm, supposedly safe,empty, double checked...whatever...cock it, aim it in the direction of a human, and deliberately pull the trigger. The people in our world just don't do that, mentally can't make themselves do that. I can't see excusing that because of the so called standard practices of the film industry. News article interviews have explained that when the gun is to be pointed into the camera...remote monitors are used, so no one is in front of the gun when the hammer falls. Yes, a lot of fails leading up to this, but you can't deny that in the end, an adult man deliberately pulled the trigger when the gun was lined up on crew members.
Like Gene Autry's movie fist fighting.
These premises insured by a Sheltie in Training ,--- and Cooey.o "May the Good Lord take a likin' to you"
I would expect any dummy rounds to be easily identifiable (a hole drilled through the side of the case or something of that sort). The armorer was, at the very least, incompetent. She was probably criminally negligent and may even have acted with criminal intent. The same goes for the assistant director. Baldwin, as the co-producer, bears responsibility for hiring these people. Baldwin, as the shooter bears responsibility for ignoring safe firearms handling rules. GD
They found a stock of "live" ammo on the set yesterday, along with a fanny pack that had "live" ammo in it. So sounds like some very basic rules were broken, and that falls on the armorer.
Not quite sure how that all falls on the armorer. Do they have the responsibility, and authority, to stop all vehicles and persons and then to search each?
We may just have to wait until the results of the Sheriff's investigation AND Gloria Allred's investigation (interesting that he has already put in place certain mechanisms to defend himself). The most important person in this situation is the Prosecutor. If he is up for re-election I doubt charges would be filed. Heck, it was in Santa Fe...the land of artist....nothing will happen because "artists" believe they are never responsible for their actions.
I don’t believe that’s what they use. They might for certain scenes or in gun belts but I would think there would be a totally different, distinguishable round for firearms.
They use inert rounds some.
I've had call to use them. Some in ammo loops on gun leather, and some for closeup shots the director wanted.
Made the dummy inert rounds myself. You take a propane torch and heat the primers until they pop, then you can prime cases and seat a bullet.
Don't think I'd trust dummy rounds to be so unless I did them myself. When you by them like from the link in the OP, you are depending on THEIR quality control and safety measures. It pays to be 100% certain.
I don’t believe that’s what they use. They might for certain scenes or in gun belts but I would think there would be a totally different, distinguishable round for firearms.
They use inert rounds some.
I've had call to use them. Some in ammo loops on gun leather, and some for closeup shots the director wanted.
Made the dummy inert rounds myself. You take a propane torch and heat the primers until they pop, then you can prime cases and seat a bullet.
Don't think I'd trust dummy rounds to be so unless I did them myself. When you by them like from the link in the OP, you are depending on THEIR quality control and safety measures. It pays to be 100% certain.
Likely why John Schneider said the armorer dry fires it several times, then the actor dry fires it. That obviously didn’t happen once.
