Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Competitive Shooting M1A

well, I disabled "hotliink protection" on the host and it still doesn't show the picture in here....

oh well, no need to further hijack the thread....

I think I have a poster format of that picture hanging in my shop. I'll see if I can post a pic of it.

even if you get a factory loaded gun, there will be more things that can be done to them to improve accuracy. I still have my navy match rifle built by known navy experts using all usgi parts from the crane truck. things like choice of grease will effect the guns performance. heck, I never knew of one shooter on the navy team that didn't have a bullet spinner as well. it all depends on just how far youre willing to go to get the results you desire. I recently sold my 1000yd open sight obermyer 10-1-5r and chose to keep my 600yd usmc oversized wood stock douglas 10-1 4 groove. it still has my lti card taped to the stock signed by the late mr. dobber! hate the thought of selling that one. (front row left.)

note size of spotting disc plug being the size of a 7.62 projectile.
I use to hit the plug at 600yds and the disc would fall off the target.
I knew some that would hit it so often, they needed to replace it in the pits.
I knew some marines that would call the line boss and send a message to me in the pits to stop dropping and plugging the hits after he got his first 2 shots in the x. because it never moved off x!

and for the record, the quest for rifle accuracy is addicting. so much so in my case that I had to stop pursuing it for fear of losing my mind and income. lol.
I had to draw a line and say im not crossing it, and then became satisfied with what my rifle could do and what i could do. now as im aging out, I can honestly say my rifle is still accurate. more so than my ability to aim it. some day someone will own it. I hope itll impress the new owner.

so, in conclusion, whatever amount of cash you shell out for an m1a, odds are there will be tons more you can do to improve it, regardless of grade. you never really achieve the end goal of perfection. because for every shot you fire, you wear it out, and the perfect gun becomes less perfect. youll hit the sweat spot on round count then you can actually see impacts drift before your eyes as you shoot it more. the life of an m1a revolves around the bore and what you feed it. everything else is fluff.

What do you mean by bullet spinner?

Cool pictures bobski and history. I was out looking at some gunshops today and ran across some very nice M1A's. One match (tag said national match) with early serial # I believe. 039xxx. It was in like new condition with all gi parts, according to my buddy that has a few of them. Shop owner said I could have it for $1,700.00 (also includes a scope mount). My buddy said that was a good deal, but I don't know how good of a deal?? I've fired the M1Garrands and M1A and prefer the M1a, since they are softer shooters and seem to be more accurate. You guys are having a great conversation on these great old rifles, but don't really discuss price. The other one I saw was a NIB stainless match and he wanted $2,600 for it. Then I went to Cabela's and saw a match like the first one I describe for $2,299.00... However, the first one at $1,700.00 was nicer.. What say you guys in the know??

the value of an m1a is the cost of the bbl. next is the use of usgi parts. and lastly, who assembled it.

and for the record, m1a's are not softer shooters. they are a sharp recoil and the garand tends to be a longer spread out recoil. (pop vs. woosh) its the result of the length of the bolt, op rod, and cartridge casing.

and a warning to all. any m1a worth its weight will have a dope book with it telling the builder, rounds fired, type rounds used, and results of matches.
otherwise, youre buying blind. much like a guy selling a car saying it was driven on weekends by just an ole lady from pasadina.

a bullet spinner measures the bullets trueness seated in the brass. match shooters separate rounds by the reading. ones over 1/3000th go in the 200yd pouch. zero to 1/1000th go in the 600 and 300yd pouch. even match ammo has a spread sometimes. worst being 2000th.
makes no sense owning a precision tool like a match m1a if all you do is shoot crap thru it. these rifles should be treated like a stereo freak tuning in bass, treble and balance.

so to answer your question on price, everything revolves around the bbl life. I cant remember, but I tend to think the life of a bbl is 5000 rounds. sweat spot is different for all bbls but 2000 being the peak on average/ so, a like new gun all pretty and such means it hasn't been broken in or its worn out and was given a face lift. and an old beat up looking gun means it has been proven, but there is no proof how much its been used.

the lands and grooves tell the tale and should match the condition of everything else. new looking/worn bbl...walk away. worn gun/new bbl...walk away. new gun/new bbl buy it. worn gun/worn bbl but documented showing it still has life?....buy it and save.
many confuse or combine the meaning of the word MATCH. MATCH can mean the competition itself or it can mean the gun is MATCHED. a MATCH RIFLE means all parts have been MATCHED, to be used in a MATCH wear you are grade against others. get it?

I dont know buddy, do know my first experiences into the M1A is happening right now, i bought a new Springfield National Match, gunsmith buddy said it had a National Match barrel, trigger and sights, also said the walnut stock was bedded and to not go tearing it down, bring it to him and he'll show me, also said he had a couple drill bits set aside for me to clean the gas tube, also has a grease rec, said a cartridge case rim is used to turn off the gas if i get tired of chasing brass, the brass lands less than two feet from my right shoulder, so i guess i'm not leaning on the rifle to bad.

I took 220 sticks of new WW 308 brass, annealed them, full length resized, set case trimmer for max length and ran em all through, a few were long but mostly just trued up necks, deburred inside and out, rehit inside case mouth lightly with VLD tool, worked up a load with 168gr Hornady Amax and Power Pro Varmint powder, CCI-200 primers, col 2.820" Vel 2645 fps, first 5 rounds had a 5 fps extreme spread, checked 5 more several days later and had an 11 fps extreme spread, i think this is something i can work with.

Will zero rifle at 100 then reset rear sight tumbler? to 0 and go from there with JBM program drop chart, bought three 20 round CMI mags and a maglula loader, just kinda rounding out my bag, this will be fun, i intend to shoot a buck, doe or pig with this rifle, i know it'll get the job done, have steel here at the farm to shoot from 100 to 700 yards, and a steel buffalo at 550.

Great post/pics Bobski!

I was amazed watching the Marine and AMU teams going at it(no slight to the other service teams). Lots of tie breaker relays!

Learned eye protection was not an option pulling targets for those guys. That spindle was dangerous when struck and lots of those folks could mangle a 3 in spotter quick.

Legged out in 98 with the M1A. Loved that rifle. Pretty much forced to sell it due to a really poor marriage choice. It was built by a NG team member with a Gene Barnett barrel( Douglas blank?).

Did you ever shoot at Dam Neck VA? I shoot a few matches there in the mid 90's. Lots of time spent at Stones bay Camp Lejune and Camp Butner NC.

OK, I see it's a variation of a concentricity checking fixture. The term "bullet spinner" threw me because when I think of spinning bullets I think of the Juenke machine that checks bullet balance.

Also where you wrote "... separate rounds by the reading. ones over 1/3000th go in the 200yd pouch" I believe you meant "ones over 3/1000th".

Sounds like a lot of fun Gunner ol buddy. I may have to talk to you a little more about your rifle. The first experience I had with one of these was last year when my air borne ranger buddy brought one to a military rifle shoot. That rifle shoots damn well. I was surprised. His has been shot a lot, but it still shoots great. Then another guy had one that was new. He asked if I could shoot it for him, to see exactly how accurate the rifle was. I said hell yes. That new Springfield Armory shot soft. Much softer than the M1 garrand I shot that day. As you know, I shoot weak side when I shoot irons, so I easily notice a difference in recoil. Others may not notice the difference.

That's probably what he meant. Should read .003" though..

yep. you guys got it. they slanged those gauges as spinners since you spin the bullet in the jig as the run out gauge takes the reading. mine was custom made to be adjusted to numerous calibers. namely 7.62 and 30-06.
btw....yes, I shot lantflt dam neck all the time in the 90's and flew to mirimar when all navy was held there. steve stevens, sam Dayton, chief mary, you probably knew the gang. I legged out on pistol in 96 and ran out of navy to finish rifle. retired. so you most likely knew all the big shots that fought for points 1 thru 4 to shoot down the zero wind tunnel near the trees at dam neck!

The Garand you shot may have had a worn-out oprod spring or it could have been due to different powders (assuming same bullet weight).

I hope (OP) larry is taking notes. im posting all this for him to glean.

You bet my Friend, glad to share anything i learn about these rifles, sounds like you guys had a bit of educational fun at the range as well,, i think the Garand and M1A are soft shooters simply by design and weight, and either with a half way descent barrel and loads can easily out shoot my iron sight capabilities, speaking of WW brass, i had two old blue and white bags plus one white and red box of 20 cases, i think the old WW brass will do me good, not impressed with the new red/black/white bags of crap.

Reading every bit of it just not commenting much trying to take in knowledge. And deciding what route to take a little wanting that I'm in no big hurry want to get it right the first time.

Shot a friend's Grand and I agree very soft shooting way softer than many lighter calibers in different lightweight rifles I have now. But then again they're not designed to shoot as fast as I can how many hundreds of times and enemies back in the 40s. Just always had a hankering and want of an M1A..