Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters The best gun CLEANER

So how does one tell if it is an oil base or water base?

On a visit with Dan Lilja in his shop some years ago, he firmly believes trying to remove ALL powder fouling from a good bore is a bad idea. He's done a lot of experimenting, using his digital bore-scope, which provides a hugely magnifed image, and firmly believes accuracy is better with some powder fouling in the bore--and Lilja barrels are highly rated by many shooters. Last time I checked his website this info was still there, in more detail.

Sometimes, you will get lucky and the ingredient list will be found on the maker's site - but not always. Naturally, they don't want the competition to know exactly what makes up their formulation. Unfortunately for them, disclosure is the law. Still...

The best way to determine what your cleaner is made of is by looking up the MSDS (Material Safety Data Sheets). Here's an example, Hoppes No 9.

https://www.hoppes.com/on/demandwar...04e3a446-2860-4fdd-9e91-49ea662e5830.pdf

Some MSDS sheets are short and to the point, others less so. Hoppes No 9 goes on for 20 pages. What you want to look for is the ingredient list.

Composition/information on ingredients (starts on page 2) This will also give you the amount of the ingredient (in percent). They are listed from the most to the least in the bottle.

Hoppes formulation is a petroleum based cleaner whose main ingredient is kerosene. According to the sheet, 30 to 60%. Quite the swing. While the primary ingredient is kerosene, the exact proportion is unknown, or perhaps, when they make it, they dump in an approximate amount.

Or you can just email the company and ask them for information.

Edited to add: You'd think that MSDS sheets would be standardized, but they aren't. For comparison purposes, I have added the Ballistol MSDS. Regardless, look for the ingredient list.The ingredients will be listed from the most to the least in the container.

https://www.ballistol.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/MSDS_TECH_BIO.pdf

Thanks JS…..

I only use bore tech proof positive jags and hardly ever use a brush. If I do, I use bore tech nylon brushes.

My cleaning starts with Bore Tech carbon remover and then follow with Bore Tech eliminator or copper remover. I also use bore tech cleaning rods and bore guides.

I have a couple of rifles that really shoot well but also foul easily. A little patience and a few extra patches will clean a really dirty bore without brushing. Safe to leave in the barrel overnight too.

Bore Tech is pricey but they always have a black Friday sale.

No reason to use high powdered copper cleaners everytime you clean your gun....when you do use a high powder copper solvent use a nylon brush.

Study up on your chemistry.Joe....

Absolutely! Dan actually got me onto this about 25 years ago with one of his .17 barrels for a big-cased .17 I was doing.

Having done a number of big .17's with other custom barrels, I was used to aggressively cleaning every 20-25 rounds to stay ahead of the accuracy drop off with the Berger 25's @ 4,150 - 4,300 fps (Winter temps). When I took Dan's suggestion and cleaned 'just enough', the barrel would go 50 rounds before needing any attention at all. When I cleaned it aggressively....20-25 rounds and it would start to act up. At that point, I could do a minimal 2 patch-three brush strokes-2 dry patch process and it would go 50 rounds before needing attention. Even a poor white kid like me from the wrong side of the tracks and living in a sod hut on the Northern Plains could connect those dots!

I went back and tried this with my other big-cased .17's (Shilen and PacNor barrels) and surprise, surprise (Gomer Pyle-speak ), they both did the same thing. Later on, with our .30 cal. BR stuff, we didn't clean until after each yardage. Barrels were a mix of Lilja, Kreiger, PacNor, Kostyshyn, Rock, Lederer and Bartlien.

If it's a 'new to me' used gun, I'll take it down to bare metal with a mixture of brushing, patching and JB then let the barrel tell me how much cleaning it likes as things progress.

Good shootin'. -Al

Small calibers are a different animal Al......A lot of .22 rim fire target shooters never clean their barrels....if they do they have to shoot them back in.

I've never desired a cartridge as small as a .17 if I did I'd occasionally use a bore snake in it.

Thanks for the reference to Lilja JB. I went and read it. I'll post links to Lilja comments. Great info! This should be required reading for all barrel cleaning imo.

https://riflebarrels.com/support/centerfire-maintenance/

https://riflebarrels.com/barrel-fouling/

https://riflebarrels.com/support/22-rimfire-maintenance/

LFC,

This applies to all barrels, not just small-caliber barrels. And rimfire barrels (and ammo) are a very different deal than centerfire barrels and ammo.

I recall one barrel maker made rimfire barrels from free machining screw stock. I guess it was because achieving a really good finish was easy and the low pressures and soft bullets didn't need hardened adamantium.

Two barrel makers I know personally told me they use a type of 304 stainless for their rim fire barrels as it's very similar to 12L14 which is widely used for screw stock.

12L14 is an easily machined alloy. It gives a really nice finish if the speeds are anywhere in the ball park. I like it for making inline seating dies. Prior to changing to a type of stainless, L.E.Wilson's seating dies, and seating die blanks, were all made from 12L14....sometimes referred to as 'leaded' steel.

Good shootin'. -Al

Have you ever used any, tell the truth now.

Now thats just crazy...talkin' common sense like that!

I've got one here that's a good candidate for the Dyna Tek bore coating. I've not used it before but this one will be a good test subject as it lays down copper like crazy. I've got it JB'd (again) down to bare metal now.....will stick a Teslong in it now and then again after coating and shooting. Any thoughts on the Dyna stuff appreciated.

Thanks! -Al

You kinda lost me there it sounds like you pretty much said what I said....

Were you trying to say that bigger bores need to be shot in like .22s ?

Al one minute your bitching about too much copper in your barrel next minute you claiming barrels need to be dirty to shoot good....

Boy oh bOy...

Teslong Bore scopes that plug into an old lap top, i phone, smart tablets are $80.

If your method is not verified with a bore scope, you are beyond clueless as hard carbon does not show black on patches.

When a guy says this and that chemical method works well, you need to know:

# of grains of powder fired in-between cleanings

How fast the gun was fired

factory or custom barrel(smoothness in the bore)

In other words, put your cleaning method in perspective so others can understand.

I have everything that Bore tec sells, Montana extreme, Shooters choice, Old and new Hoppes, Witch's Brew, and others. The bronze bristle brush on it's first 50 strokes is the most important thing to know about getting carbon out of a barrel. Change brushes often.

Teslong bore scopes do away with the Voo Doo magic of this and that solvent in gun cleaning. Buy yourself a Teslong bore scope and become your own expert for your application in shooting. There is a LOT of Snake Oil being sold out there when it comes to bore solvents to remove carbon...copper is the easy stuff to get out...as a rule.

My sentimates exactly.....I dont have a bore scope so I just read my patch.


Only thing I would add is what ever "Snake Oil" you choose be sure and keep the bore and brush wet with it when brushing.

I always tilt my muzzle down a little when I'm cleaning when I see it dripping out "Snake Oil" I know its wet enough.

IME, DBC has been a game-changer. It goes in all my bores.

How much acetone do you use? Or do you just leave it out completely unless dealing with plastic residue?

Thanks