Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters Any states soon to follow CA in lead free ammo?

Yep, believe that’s the rule on all federal lands for shot. Ole Commie Bam Bam did in fact ban all toxic ammo and sinkers from federal land and Trump overturned it.

As the internet freaked out over Interior Secretary Ryan Zinke riding a horse to his first day on the new job Thursday, environmental activists expressed outrage over one of his first actions: overturning a federal ban on hunting with lead ammunition in national parks and wildlife refuges.
Zinke signed Secretarial Order 3346, which repeals a U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service directive the Obama administration issued the day before President Donald Trump took office barring the use of lead ammunition and fishing tackle in national parks and wildlife refuges. Zinke also signed an order to expand hunting, fishing and recreation access on federal lands.

You keep one magazine loaded with copper bullets to show the game warden, and you keep magazine loaded with the bullets you hunt with. Not that it's an issue around here.

That wont fly. You can not have lead on your possession while hunting.
You dont think duck hunters have thought of that?

There's a good chance Gavin Newsom, the current Governor of California, will be running for president in 2024. My guess is they won't try to tackle the lead free bullets nationwide as it would be a difficult task to get most states to go along with it. I personally see them trying to take guns away from citizens first and tackle all of there agenda in one move!

A guy I worked with found out the hard way on that. Out duck hunting CO checks him out. He had 2 shells in a pocket he missed from pheasant hunting. Lead shot in possession while duck hunting, busted, and he didn’t like the cost of the outcome.

I have a good friend from Venezuela who is an avid hunter and survivalist, have picked up some pretty good tips on how to properly get around the authorities who support communist agendas!

I certainly hope not. Doing so would eliminate half the threads on the Campfire.

😆

I handload Bismuth shot for waterfowling, in AA target hulls. Had a game warden check my ammo (didn't check my gun because it's a side-by-side doublegun) and he frowned at the stuff. Wanted to write me up even though I argued 'til i was blue in the face. We finally compromised and he took a shell to have analyzed, the fine on hold until after the lab report. Never heard a word back.

Since a magnet (for steel) won’t work on Bismuth, GW’s should be ready to open a shotshell and identify the Bismuth. Perhaps they need a workshop or two. Its not a particularly difficult problem. 😉

About ten years ago I tried the Barnes TTSX. It worked so well and is so accurate, it is all I use anymore, not because it is required, but because it is better.

The older Barnes are a different story and have not tried monos from any other company. So my comment is specific to the Barnes TTSX. It is a really good hunting bullet.

pretty soon in California ,it will be illegal to use lead bullets to shoot criminals with in self defense or the police using it ,, dont want to wound them and have them die of lead poisening dontcha know (sarcasm)

This is a good one!^^^ Never happen tho.

Just for spite I drop one lead BB in the shot cup before dumping in the bismuth shot.

When this copper thing first came out, I questioned and was told by a Calif Warden in my area, "If I pull you over, and it is plain that you are an azzwhole, I will check your ammo and use it as just one more tool to stack charges against you...if you appear to be playing by the rules, I'm not going to be checking your ammo." Pretty much the way the local cops handle the seat belt law.
But that is just 1 warden.

Makes me glad I voted with my feet.

Probably…but…

I began to read about this topic and discovered that even upland bird hunting in California is banned! Here is a summary, fall of 2019:
"The ban prohibits the use of lead projectiles and applies to all hunting (including public and private land), all wildlife (game birds, non-game birds and mammals) and all firearms (rifles, shotguns, pistols and muzzleloader) "in any gauge or caliber for the take of any legal species," according to the CDFW."
https://www.wideopenspaces.com/californias-full-lead-ammo-ban-begins-july-1/

The use of lead ammunition will still be allowed for target shooting, as long as the ammo is being shot in an area where lead is not restricted otherwise. The ban also won't require nonlead ammunition for pellet guns or personal protection guns.

However, even those who are hunting for depredation purposes to dispatch wildlife destroying property or livestock will need to use lead-free ammo.

============================

Back when they banned lead shot for waterfowl hunting in 1991 I thought it was a mistake based on poor studies. IIRC there was a study a long time ago that blamed lead shot when it might have been avian cholera and avian botulism that actually caused the deaths.

In more recent times I have read that condors ARE dying from lead poisoning but I am still not convinced that most of our ducks and geese are dying due to lead poisoning. More inclined to believe in diseases killing them.

===========================


There are plenty of states that ban fishing weights claiming that the common loon is affected. Wondering what the loon is doing to be affected to the level stated below..

Besides banning lead in rifles and shotguns in some places, there are quite a few states that ban lead fishing sinkers and jigs that weigh less than one ounce. They claim the lead is killing loons:

New Hampshire
 Lead jigs and sinkers account for 48% of mortalities among adult loons, which is the largest single cause of
adult Common Loon mortalities in New Hampshire.

New York
 In 2004, New York listed the Common Loon as a Species of Special Concern. It banned the sale of small
fishing sinkers because ingesting lead fishing tackle is one of the leading causes of death for adult Common
Loon and other wildlife in New York.

Maine
 The adult Common Loon population in Maine is small. Maine concluded that keeping lead sinkers out of
Maine waters would increase the survival rate of these birds and allow for population growth of the
species.

Massachusetts
 The regulation was implemented primarily to protect Massachusetts’ small population of Common Loon.

Vermont
to prevent the Common Loon and other birds from becoming endangered in the future.

Washington
 Washington enforces a ban on the use of lead weights and jigs that measure 1.5 inches or less when fishing
on certain lakes in the state.

====================================



From 2013 on the condors in N. Az:

Consider the source, the center for bio diversity: Of the 166 condors reintroduced into Utah and Arizona since 1996, 81 have died or disappeared. When the cause of death could be determined, more than half were due to poisoning from ingesting lead ammunition fragments left in gut piles or carcasses of shot game. At least 38 condors have been killed by lead poisoning in Arizona and Utah, with more deaths suspected to be linked to lead. Lead poisoning recently killed the female of Utah’s only breeding pair of condors. Each year, up to half of the wild Grand Canyon condors must be given life-saving, emergency blood treatment for lead poisoning.

https://www.biologicaldiversity.org/news/press_releases/2013/lead-04-16-2013.html



Az Game and Fish believes it:
https://www.williamsnews.com/news/2020/sep/22/azgfd-reminds-hunters-lead-ammo-can-poison-condor-/

==================

There are all sorts of links on the web that say ducks and geese are affected by lead like this one:

https://www.vet.upenn.edu/research/...-sheets/fact-sheet-detail/lead-poisoning

================


I am thinking that it may just be a short matter of time before all lead shot is a thing of the past. (Some sources are writing about upland birds being affected) Thinking lead bullets will be outlawed but that will happen decades from now.

I live in a state that does not currently ban lead ammo, but I choose to use Barnes TTSX and Hornady GMX simply because of their performance on game and in my rifles.

Pretty much make a 22 LR useless for hunting in these areas where lead is banned, right?

CCI is making lead free .22 LR.