Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire Self Defense

Gimme a shotgun that shoots where I look and a shell that goes bang.

I'd be fine with my 590, but my AR pistol with a can and a D60 full of Gold Dots has many advantages over a shotgun.

I never got in a gunfight and wished I had less ammo.....

Nothing beats a shotgun fella.

I chuckle at you too

I feel ok with that Rem. 1187 with the slug barrel on it and loaded with 5, 3” 00 buckshot. (That’s 75 pellets) . Then there’s the twin Sig 938s under our pillows, to go along with the AR and the thirty rounder loaded with ballistic tips.
If we hear you, and the toy poodle will, it’s gonna be a bad day/ night for a bad guy or guys.

Luckily our house set up is perfect for defense against a night breach.

The Indian more than the arrow.

I’ve seen this proved wrong time and time again with buckshot and a 40mm, thats what “Indians” that want to live carry.

An AR is NOT “overwhelming firepower” which is one of the tenants of force multiplication.

It's all good.

# of gunfights > 0

# of gunfights lost = 0

I'll take a good 2-point sling on the AR with the can and an Aimpoint.

😉

Use what you feel is best, some folk believe in the vax too.

How many indoor gunfights have you been in, if you don't mind me asking?

You need to find out who dirty dan is fella.

I’ve been right there watching what one man with a shotgun, an m79, 226, and a machete can do to over a hundred enemy combats.

Shotgun for me bud !

For those of you who chose 00 buckshot instead of #4 - why?

Muzzle blast? Lemme show you what that looks like.



Point of my babble is going to narrow down a bit. Self defense? Ya, in what circumstance?

Well, it's kinda awkward to pull a long gun when you're in a car, so I rely on handguns for that. They have served me well over the years, and most recently about 2 years back in the closure of a road rage incident. Haven't shot anyone, or pulled the trigger, but they served purposes well. These days I carry at all times here in Florida, and on occasion when traveling, depends on whether there is a reciprocity agreement with states I'm traveling thru. In two of the cases I was involved with the deployment of such iron prevented what would certainly have been a fatal conclusion otherwise. I'm good to 50 yards with an .38 Spcl and not more than 15-20' with a LCP.

Rifles? Yeah, that includes AR's and such things. I'm quite certain they have their place, albeit not in a car or inside a home. Placement requires aiming, and that takes time unless the perp is right in your face. Also of consideration, I live in a 'stand your ground" state and can defend myself, family or strangers from bodily harm. What I cannot do is shoot neighbors or passerbys on the side. I view rifles as something best deployed in the outdoors, nothing more or less. At that, it needs to be a circumstance that does not endanger innocents. Even if they are a mile away.

Shotguns? In my home, or even in the yard, you betcha. Will birdshot disable an attacker? Inside a home, only if he's lucky, otherwise they are dead meat. My dad told me years ago to let the quail get out a bit further so I wouldn't blow them to pieces. My response was to shoot the head off of those up close and behave like a regular guy at longer ranges. Will I load buckshot? Yeah, the smallest size available for whatever gauge I'm holding. Typically it's #3 or 4. It's something I'll use in the yard at ranges beyond 30 yards or so. It will be effective out to 50-60 yards or perhaps a bit more. First load(s) in the tube are small buck, last to get loaded are #5 or 6 birdshot. I say that because........

First rule of self defense: Your priority is to disable your attacker, not to kill them necessarily. If they're dead, they're dead, no big loss, right? You want to stop the fight, first and foremost. The pic I posted earlier was of a joker likely still alive, but I'll bet my bucks he was not concerned about continuing whatever acts got him shot. The sting of a hundred bees... Only have a .22 RF? It kills more people every year that pretty much all the rest combined. Can you disable someone with a .22 RF? HINT: gut shoot'm. I've been with men that were gut shot and I've seen it happen to others on the ground. War's over for them and mostly what they do is cry like a little girl. Oddly enough, the last thing that moves when someone is trying to confuse your aim is their bellybutton. Hardest thing to hit? Maybe a foot, or a head. Trust me on this; inside your home, unless you live in a mansion, the longest shot you'll likely take is 50', and I"m being generous. You shoot someone with birdshot at that distance they are done. Shoot'm at half that range and they are double done and the ambulance won't need a siren when it leaves. #8, #5, it matters not much at all. Miss and hit the wall? It won't go far, and perchance you shoot out one of your windows, serious damage to your neighbor's house is unlikely.

Now riddle me this. While I served in Nam I often provided air cover for infantry units deep in indian country. As often as not the point man carried a....are you ready.....a Winchester Model 12 loaded with buckshot. Why do you think combat professionals would do such a silly thing?

That didn't answer my question.

I’m a fan of number #4 but during my career standard issue was 00

I don’t need to answer your question, you don’t matter.

I keep a couple of shotguns loaded around the house, #6 covers a multitude of pesky critters and I wouldn't be afraid to use it on a bad guy in close quarters. But, if I have my preference in a truly bad situation, I want a rifle.

Im team scatter gun in my case its either a browning A5 with the buck special barrel loaded with 2 3/4" #1 buck or an Ithaca M37 riot gun loaded with 2 3/4" #1 buck

Fine by me. I'm not the one saying what's "best" for others to use, only what I have trained with, and use myself. As stated, I'll happily use my 590 if it comes to that, and, IMO, a short AR isn't even remotely viable without a can, so, for many, I'd never even recommend what I train with.

Plus, as body armor becomes a thug-life thing, something that negates armor has a certain appeal. 😉

I’m chuckling again, body armor doesn’t matter to a man slinging buckshot, shoot the pelvis, legs, or neck and head.

When you look at the statistics from actual shooting a couple things are very clear.

Long guns are more deadly than pistols. Within the long gun category, there's no difference in "one shot stops" between rifles and shotguns at 58%. This includes psychological stops where the say, Fùck, I've been shot, and gives up even though he was physically able to continue fighting.

For average rounds before incapacitation, the edge goes to the shotgun, 1.25 to 1.4

Percentage incapacities by one shot goes to the shotgun, 85% to 80%

But when we look at the percent of people NOT incapacitated regardless of how many times they were shot, the rifle wins, 7% to 14%.

Percentage of shooting resulting in a fatality, Rifle win, 68% to 65%

Percentage of hits to the head or torso. Shotgun wins, 84% to 81%

IMO the most important stat is the one most reflective of actual wins. Is the bad guy incapacitated. Yes, or no. 93% to 86% the rifle wins, and my choices reflect this data.