Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Elk Hunting high fence freak shot in Idaho

In October. Someone was playing with the genes on this one. It's a monstrosity. I wonder how much he paid to shoot it.

Wow!

I'd guess cost of that bull to be between 25 and 35k.

Better him than I

I'll never understand a "hunt" like this...

What part of Idaho? I have a cousin that runs an elk ranch where you pick out a bull from a pasture, then they haul it up to some private land that looks like elk hunting ground, then you "hunt" it. Five figures to start. Lots of people have lots of money and are utterly worthless.

It's the Broadmouth Canyon Ranch near Firth (near Idaho Falls). Here's a link to the article I saw: TAME ELK
They have a Facebook page with photos of giant mulies, buffalo, and big horns, too. They have about 15 square miles.

Thanks, Rock Chuck. That isn't my cousin's operation. BCR belongs to Rulon Jones and family.

That's not hunting..it's disgusting

I wonder how far back the shooter got for the pic. Looks like he's in the next county.

Me neither.
What’s the point in such an endeavor.

Those antlers look like they've been laying on the ground and out in the weather for a while. The rotten velvet is one thing but the the bear antler looks weathered. looking at the base of the antlers,,,, Looks shopped to me.

I don't know how a bull could rub them off when they're shaped like that. I'm pretty sure they're real. When you start playing genetic roulette, you can come up with some weird stuff.

Did you read this on the link:

The shooters just stood there while drivers pushed the elk out of the trees. It was a cattle drive, not a hunt.

Looks like someone took a picture of some dead New Zealand freak elk and shopped on a local elk.

Scored at 648". That's 200 more than the record PA elk on the other thread and that's a huge elk. This one isn't a freak of nature. It's a freak of pasture breeding.

Ok, if true, it's no more than a Holstein cow or bull in this case. Man has breed animals to be larger, product more meat, milk and pull wagon and plows over time. In the last 5 decals people have worked on producing big antlers. It comes as no surprise to me. Just another sign of the times. I'm really surprised that people who pay for hunts like that, think it's a real trophy instead of just shooting someone Holstein Elk.

25-35 won’t touch it. Have a friend that let his wife shoot one 405” or a little better at BCR. It was right at double that amount for that (sic) hunt.

I suppose if I was compensating for a tiny dick and my $150k lifted 3/4 ton wasn't cutting it, I'd want to shoot pasture bulls and get them mounted.

The guy that shot that elk also hunts on Pheasant farms where they tie the pheasant to trees

KB

Not for me, though I also won't judge. There's lots of operations like this in Idaho and most every other state. It is their money and as long as they don't try to enter it into B&C or otherwise lie about the situation, I have no objection to it.

I worked on an elk ranch like this one fall when in college. It was fun, but pathetic. I came across no "hunter" that wasn't 100% cognizant of what they were getting themselves into. Most of them fully acknowledged it was nothing but a money transaction. They were OK with it and so was I.

I agree. What some guys will do to get a set of antlers on the wall.

Umm…no thank you. Whatever makes the dude happy I guess, but no thank you for me. Congrats to him, I spose. 🙄

A rather hideous "trophy" if you ask me.

Not the bull that gets me up in the morning.

Me neither.

I’m guessing this is Rulon Jones Idaho place?

Most high fence hunters I’ve met did not fully understand what the situation was.

High fence hunting is not legal in many Rocky Mountain states and many/most other states in the west last I knew. Idaho, Utah, and New Mexico are notable exceptions.

Yes.

Yep, Rulon Jones……

Then our experience differers with that.

I do think you are right about the high fence operations in the west though, now that I think about it. I believe operations such as this are illegal in Montana and maybe Wyoming too, but those states have similar bison hunts, so it kind of gets blurry. Not totally sure, to be honest. I believe in some states private elk herds are considered livestock and thus operations such as this are not considered "hunting", so that is one loophole I guess.

Are you guys aware that the connection between Elk Farms and the introduction of CWD into the wild ungulate populations has been made?

That's why I am against it, CWD has had dramatic effects on our Mule Deer Populations in Alberta and Saskatchewan! As in REALLY BAD EFFECTS!

You’re right in that where wildlife ends and livestock begins can be a blurry line.

Bison were generally considered livestock at one time, so that line is even blurrier…..

In Colorado critters like domestic deer and elk cannot be hunted and killed for a fee. Now if Rulon wanted to let us shoot his bulls for free……

How many of you are aware Rulon Jones was an All Pro defensive lineman for the Orange Crush back in the day?

In Idaho, privately owned animals are considered as livestock. They're regulated by the state Dept of Agriculture, not by the Fish & Game, so the dept of Ag sets any rules. The owners can butcher or sell them in any manner they want as long as it's humane. They're required to have all privately owned animals ear tagged for identification.
Maybe 15 years ago, a high fence farm a few miles from Yellowstone had a bear tear down a fence and about 100 to 150 elk got loose. The owner wasn't having much luck rounding them up and didn't report it for weeks. To prevent them from mixing with wild elk, the governor (currently US senator Jim Risch), ordered a carte blanche on any elk wearing an ear tag. They could be shot on sight by anyone, not just hunters. I don't think all that many got shot and I have no idea how many were finally captured. I think quite a few mixed with the wild herd.

As for ethics, they're livestock. In Idaho, we like our freedom and here we have the freedom to raise and slaughter livestock as we wish. I have no interest in 'hunting' them, but I support the right to do so. It's a business, just like selling cattle or pigs for slaughter. If someone with a lot of money is willing to pay to shoot a cow in a pasture, that's their business.

Amen.

Also a lot of the domestic elk have red deer genetics (which may partly explain some of the freak antlers) and just like livestock, some will ALWAYS escape at some point.

High fence hunting is unethical. Importantly, how hunters are perceived by the general public is important for our continued privilege to hunt.

In Colorado domestic wildlife like elk are regulated by the state Dept of Ag. Previously they were regulated by Colorado Parks & Wildlife.

Technically it was the captive mule deer herd at CSU in Ft Collins Colorado that gave us the blight of CWD.

Idaho's Dept of Ag requires all cervids being imported to be tested for CWD and brucellosis.

CWD has decimated our MD populations for several reasons. Where I hunted 20 years ago I would see 150+ Mulies every day, now if I see 15 its a good day.

By law we have to now take every deer in to the Gov to have it tested and if its CWD positive, into the garbage the meat goes!

Humans F everything up!

I know you're referring to the canned operations like in the OP, but I am curious about what you consider "high fence".

I wonder why cwd decimates mule deer but not elk...weird stuff.

So this dude just dropped well over $100K? I'd like to think that if I had that kind of money to blow I'd do something more memorable.

Makes two of us

Make that 3.

Ironically (well, maybe ironically), those captive deer came from game farms in Minnesota and Saskatchewan. This occurred in the early 60’s. To this day they have never determined if the deer arrived with the prions present in them or if they contracted it from wild deer on the other side of the fence. The facility bordered public and private ground that is still open space where both muleys and white tails are present.

A small herd of bighorns that were also at the facility at the time ended up with CWD.

The post grad student who was studying the deer at the time eventually identified the disease and the prions present in the deer. The existence of prions and their connection to CWD and all forms of TSE’s were only discovered in the early 60’s.

At the time it was a big deal for the post grad student to discover the presence of prions in wild ungulantes (in this case captive deer) because nobody understood what the disease was when it had been encountered in the wild previously. Only later it was understood to be what has become to be known as CWD.

4

5

It may still happen. It is speculated (emphasis on speculation) by biologists that TSE's in the wild tends to run in cycles. It is also speculated that warmer weather/climate may enhance the transmission of the disease from one individual to another. There is evidence that ungulates crowded onto ever smaller winter range is making the disease more prevalent.

I’ll take the experience, memories, and overall charm of my small freak elk over that one any day. Fair chase…so fair in fact…my guide and I waded across the Williams Fork River(8” deeper than my boots at the time)to get a shot opportunity at him. Got a nice cow about 20 minutes later just before dark that day as well. Not a record freak elk…but damn sure a trophy to me, and I smile every time I look at the antlers on the wall. If that’s what that fella feels, then good deal for him. 😎

00
The easy answer is critters behind a 6ft fence, ostensibly elk proof (or any other game critter proof).

In the case of Rulon Jones and most other of these kind of operations, those elk are raised in pastures--might be 10 acres, might be a 100 acres--fed lots of high nutrition diets, then released into larger enclosures--might be a few hundred acres, might be 1500 acres--a few days before the "hunters" show up. Those elk are the proverbial "Babes In The Woods" when it comes to survival. A few may be wily enough to give a guy a short run for his money, but the learning curve is exceedingly short......

There are varying degrees of that scenario, and yes, there are the large Texas game farms where exotic critters are inside of 10,000 acre enclosures and roam freely year round, and even though those critters can give a guy a challenge I still consider that unethical to some degree.

A guy's first clue he is entering a game farm or Jurassic Park is when he passes through the 6 foot high gate--electrified or not.....

Gotcha. I knew those elk on Rulon Jones's place and many other similar operations are pen raised and then released into a fenced area, whether the day before the hunt or months beforehand. No desire here regardless, under any of those circumstances.

I have changed my tune considering high fence areas somewhat though as one of the most difficult animals I have ever hunted was fallow deer in Argentina behind a fence that was several thousand acres and had several areas where pigs and whatnot had dug holes under it. Those critters came and went as they pleased and as far as I knew, the fallow there were free breeding. I didn't see a deer for 4-5 days and finally got a young buck that was as skittish as any whitetail I have hunted. There are plenty of wild deer or islands in SE AK that are smaller than those enclosures and while deer do swim, they often don't leave whatever island they're on even if hunted.

By contrast about the easiest hunt I have ever been on was caribou 100 miles from any road. That was like shooting cattle that were being driven. Assuming you got in front of where they wanted to go there was zero challenge to it. Same with musk ox in Greenland. I wouldn't doubt the bull in the OP was more of a challenge than those hairy beasts were, other than the travel and weather extremes.

It is all perspective, I guess.

There's another theory that scrapie, which was being studied at the same CSU facility prior to the deer study, was able to cross the species barrier.

This operation is just down the road. Not for me. No respect for those who do it but like others say it’s legal so whatever floats your boat. Not a hell of a lot of difference than shooting a Texas whitetail at a feeder

That isn't hunting. That's paying for an assassination. The shooter" is a POS with $.

He is just a different version of Roundoak.

i guess i will pose this. how big of an area does it require to be fair chase? a 10,000 Acre fenced in area would be unfathomable to truly understand to a guy who has spent all his life hunting the same 100 acres

They weren't studying scrapie because it wasn't specifically known at that time. Scrapie is another form of TSE specific to sheep. CWD is a form of TSE specific to cervids. BSE is a form of TSE specific to bovines. Creutzfeldt-Jakob Disease is a form of TSE specific to humans. And so on. The general name for these diseases are known as TSE's--Transmissible Spongiform Encephalopathy (I dare ya to pronounce it quickly). The prion that causes TSE was not discovered until shortly before the deer at CSU arrived. And it was more than a year after they arrived the deer became obviously sick. Prions can be present in a critter or human for years before the disease becomes apparent.

It has been only more recently discovered Creutzfeldt-Jakob Disease was prevalent in the Russian Czar family possibly going back 500 years. We just thought they were crazy.......

T Inman,
I know, as I said the line can get blurrier and blurrier. I think what bothers me the most about Rulon Jones that it is not clearly stated the circumstances of the hunt, many people from back east are not aware it is high fence--our very own Pugs and Jorge for example. There was a new member here a couple years ago from back east who breathlessly announced his wife had purchased a hunt on Broadmouth. He clearly did not understand it was a high fence hunt.

Whoever wrote the info on the Broadmouth literature and website is really, really good at being deceptive without being legally deceptive.

Understood, and agree for the most part.

I do not remember that new member talking about it but Pugs and his crew made it clear they knew what they were doing and never tried to hide it or be deceitful. If I remember right it was in the very first sentence of that thread.

I may have not remembered it all correctly, but I do recall teasing Jorge about it.....

The public sees that kind of hunting and equates it with fair chase sport hunting, to me that's the danger.

Caveat emptor.

If you find a purposefully vague website, charging mid-five-figures on private ground, and a guaranteed animal, that's a livestock business. I can't quite imagine the person who wouldn't understand that, unless they chose to be intentionally oblivious, or they inherited all that cash. Technically, it fits a definition of hunting. It's also commerce.

I understand guys who pay for land use, or who pay for guide services. But paying for an animal is buying livestock.

I'm glad I brought up CWD, quite the discussion!

The day you find me hunting an animal in an enclosure is well.............never, the entire concept is sick to me, and the ramifications to wild animals has been devastating.

That's what you get for designing a Frankenstein Elk for some rich dude to shoot and playing with nature, CWD, just like us humans custom designed Covid.

Leave nature alone, Let God design the genetics, he does a way better job!

Was CSU studying whatever had been causing sheep to get sick and die for centuries, they just didn't know at the time they were studying scrapie?

100 acres of solid forest is nothing at all like 10k acres of mixed sagebrush and timber patches like what's found in much of southern Idaho. You can find open areas of sagebrush a square mile or more in size, often a LOT more. You can find large patches of timber but with equally large open areas between them. The timber patches often extend up the sides of steep mountains or draws, making secluded escape routes for elk.

The OP article says that the ranch workers stationed several hunters at the edge of a timber patch to wait while they moved through to chase the elk out. They knew exactly where they'd come out. Wild elk aren't going to be chased out into the open like that. They'll double back and will use a hidden escape route. It's amazing how a spooked elk can disappear. These elk aren't wild.

+1!

I'd rather take a wild raghorn or cow than a freak like that.

Livestock, not a game animal. I would not pollute my game pole with that nor would I allow it on my wall. This sort of thing is not good for the sport of hunting.

I would rather have a 5x5 raghorn bull taken fairly off public land than that "thing."

Yeah, that is not really hunting. It's "harvesting". I shoot a lot of spikes on public land where hunters success rates are only about 5%, so they are well earned. I also shoot cows and appreciate the meat they provide. This shooting at elk locked up behind a fence is unethical. There are probably a lot of guys here that like those antlers on their walls that do it every year though, then badger some of us thinking we don't shoot elk or hunt, but this is not "hunting".

Agreed. Maybe he rolls with member sharpthings.

we drive WILD deer exactly like that successfully every year

Judging by the guys clothes in the picture, must not have been too hard of a "hunt" considering his blue jeans or red t shirt aren't even dirty or sweaty.

Not even an attractive head, IMHO.

I'll take a normal 350 rack anytime over something like that.

MM

If you read the article, he was with a group of shooters ferried to a place near some timber. Then ranch employees chased the elk by them. They were all shooters, not a hunter in the crowd.

I made the mistake of trusting a (non-CF) long-time friend who made all the arrangements for that trip and it was only after I had paid my deposit that I started to investigate and found out how it was run. The ranch was very evasive about it and several e-mails didn't answer my questions so I finally cornered them at the Harrisburg outdoors show. I let my friendship take over my normally cautious nature. I'm glad I went, I had a very good time with friends but it was not an elk hunt and I wanted to make sure that was clear in my post about it so others understood what they were getting into.

Still investing in Wyoming elk points to take myself on a real hunt sometime here after retirement.

Gotcha. Makes sense.

You may not have known what you were dealing with when you paid the deposit but made clear what it was in your story/write up. That is good to go as far as I am concerned.

ask a Texan lol

Id be super happy to take a cow elk every year archery elk hunting

Pugs, I think you're a Veteran, and you wanna hunt Wyoming, so you should send a message to Fotis, I'd bet a dollar he could probably help you with getting in on that Wyoming hunt.

Agree with Ted, being upfront about the whole thing means a ton. It's about like finding a decent bison hunt. I want a bison for the freezer but I'd prefer something at least a little like hunting. I wouldn't kid myself though about "the hunt". It's definitely about putting one in the deep freezer and it's more fun than getting beef at the Restaurant Depot.

I figure for every person shooting one behind a fence is one less competing with me in drawing a tag. The way things are going, I don't know if my 4 Wyoming points will even draw a general tag in 2023.

I have a friend who killed a magnificent elk at Roulon Jones' place. Super good guy. He's wealthy, has some health limitations, knew what he was getting into and did it with a bow. He's happy with the experience. Not my style, but I certainly don't begrudge him for it.

ugly rack!

I kind of have a hard time telling folks what to do with their money or their livestock.

I'm not exactly sure what the objection is here, so
someone will have to explain.
Many in my area spend thousands every year to
go " hunt " a whitetail deer.
Many decry high fence hunting, and as many embrace
it. Most all are trying to take a "good " buck. If
you strip away all the layers, they want a large
antlered head to put on the wall to post on their
web page, or show off to friends, or for whatever
reason. A good many don't keep the any meat,
some giving it away, some donating it to charitable
organizations, some stashing it in their freezer
for a year or 3 until it's useless. I'm sure there's
been many that just took the head and left the
carcass, otherwise we wouldn't have the laws we
do about taking a mandatory amount of the
carcass. It really doesn't bother me if the next
guy wants to hunt like he wants to and spend
a pile of money every year to get a new head or
two on the wall as long as the laws are followed.
I do wish that other people would leave me be
and let me "hunt " like I want to as long as I
follow the laws. My license costs as much as
everyone else's does

I'm sure those elk are fed high quality feed during the antler growing season. I do have to wonder what that one tastes like...or chews like. I suspect that he's good for bologna and not much else.

That's disgusting. Now, Huns- I can see doing that to. Likely the only way I'd ever hit one of the little bastards.

Probably tastes like stocked trout. No thanks.
My guess is the guy never had a bite of it anyway. IMO, schit like this is a bad look for "hunters". At a time when there are fewer and fewer people that hunt, the optics are bad.

No dog in the fight here. This bull was killed on a ranch (high fence) near me by an eighty year old guy who had never shot an elk. It wasn’t advertised as a hunt by the operator, in fact he told the client that they were grain and hay fed and would be great eating. Day of the “hunt” client showed up, operator put him in the side by side, drove out to the pasture, dropped the windscreen, set up bipod and sandbags and shot the bull. Loaded him with the tractor and processed meat and hide. The head and cape were taken by my buddy to the taxidermist for him. That’s where I snapped the pic. I don’t care what a guy does with his money as long as they’re honest about what’s going on. That goes for both the client and operator. Unlike that d-bag Sharp things in the archery forum.

That's pretty much what I've been saying. Penned elk are livestock, not wild animals. If the owner can find someone to butcher one for him, more power to him. It's not a hunt and not intended to be one.
What's the difference between this and butchering a bovine bull for the hide? They sometimes make very attractive rugs or wall hangings. I can drive by a house with a pen raised cow or elk head on the wall 10 times a day and it won't affect me in the least. My friends and I hunt them for real and that's good enough for me. I don't care what others do.

And he got a pile of some of the best meat there is, that could've been his whole goal. That, and a nice set of horns always looks good, no matter where they came from.

I think they were studying lungworm. Of course they have been studying lungworm in bighorns forever. Lungworm is another disease that has never (or yet) determined if the white man brought here from Europe or if it was already present. I know a lot of biologists have come to the conclusion that lungworm will always be present and bighorns will always be dying of it.

There have been proposals to prohibit sheep and goats from certain public land areas to minimize exposure to lungworm.

As an added note to the CWD part of this thread: The epicenter of a disease is generally considered the most likely area where a disease evolved and/or got its start. In the case of CWD in mule deer the epicenter is east of Cheyenne near the Nebraska border and just north of I-70.

I think it’s up to hunters to police ourselves. If we don’t call people out and let them know this isn’t real hunting, this trend will likely continue and will make things worse for future hunters. I unapologetically won’t support this type of garbage.

He just stepped out of the 4 seater Polaris Ranger. Did that elk have an ear tag?

By law it had one. They likely removed it for the photos.

I agree.

Each to their own.
I'll not say anything bad about anyone in regard to how they hunt or not hunt.

It's their business, not mine.

You all have a good day.

I have an acquaintance near Brownwood, TX with 1,200 fenced acres.

They sell hunts, whitetail and elk.

He told me a guy drove out from Dallas to shoot a 6-point elk.
He asked the shooter if he wanted the elk turned loose out of the 40 acre pasture that it was in.
Nope, just got out of his vehicle and shot the elk.

I guess he had the itch and the money, but I wouldn't do it.

If only you had the required intelligence to attain some money......or rich parents.

This.

It’s his money. Just don’t try to pass it off as something it ain’t.




P

Money shouldn’t null fair chase. This reflects poorly on hunters and hunting in general. Dignity should still mean something. Apparently it doesn’t to some people anymore. If doing this sort of thing makes a person happy, I won’t support it. To each their own is right