Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters Mule Deer- Know of any .270 brown/grizzly kills?

He looks shorter than he is because he squat-walks to muffle the clanking!

I have been around Phil.

He is more heavily muscled than actor Duane Johnson.

He is as tall a Shaquille O’Neill.

His flying skills are such that Tom Cruise wanted Phil to be a pilot in Top Gun Maverick.

Most importantly he is a wonderful human being and a gentleman.

I got to know Chuck some when I was a wildlife biology major at the University of Montana--where he taught, along with being a field biologist. He spent more time around bears than most bear guides, and among other things was one of several biologists made a pretty long trip into northern Mexico to see if any grizzlies still existed there. They did find one bear that had the appearance of a grizzly, but without a biological test could not be certain. (According to most sources the last Mexican grizzly was killed in 1976, but there's an awful lot of very empty country in Sonora, and other parts of northern Mexico.)

His son Jamie has been the bear management specialist for Montana, Fish, Wildlife & Parks for many years now, and in fact is nearing retirement age. (Apparently bears are in the Jonkel DNA.) A cousin of mine went to high school with Jamie, and knows him pretty well.

These are the stories I cherish hearing. Stories of settlers, pioneers, people who successfully used what they had and did a good job of make do with what you have. It also shows how much people can be misled into thinking that they absolutely must have this or that because nothing else will work. These stories show what can actually work. However, one must use a good amount of common sense and skill in these situations.

🫣🙄🙄

I recently read where writer Tyler Freel with Outdoor Life killed an interior grizzly with a 6.5 CM, but then again, he's killed lots, including one with a homemade bow and flint tipped arrow.

Natives routinely kill polar bears , which can weigh as much as brown bears (1400-1600 #) , with 223’s !

When I hunted musk ox in Nunavut Territory in 1994, my 50-year-old Inuit guide mostly used the .22 Winchester Magnum on polar bears, though he did have a bigger back-up gun--a Winchester 94 .30-30....

I wonder if a big fly swatter would work?

MM

Taking about grizzlies in Mexico. They were in Chihuahua until at least 1980. I think they're pretty much extirpated in Mexico now. My Grandpa and father saw one on Catron county New Mexico in 1973.
I also talked to a forest service guy who showed me pics of more then one grizzly at/ near the Blue primitive area lookout tower. He worked it in early 1970s.
I've never seen one south of Banff myself

Any idea on what type of bullet? Thanks.

IME 55gr FMJ, though one fellow from Barrow told me the Winchester 55gr SP 223 and 222 ammo was very good stuff.

Reminiscing at the Campfire, like sitting around the old pot bellied stove at the general store and talking about grizzlies, is a good way to spend a Cold January day.

When I was a kid, we hunted and killed everything with a rifle we already had. I never knew there was any other guns besides a 22, a 25-35, a 30-06 and a 410 single shot. We also never even thought of getting a new gun to hunt something with, we already had 4 choices.

We had grizzly bears around our cabin all summer and grizzly sightings were almost daily in our yard in the evenings. We would show all our visitors the bears when they would come into our trash pit in the evening. We lived as people did in the 1880’s all summer with a wood stove for cooking, a well for water and an outhouse for pooping. We had a garbage pit, where we threw all our trash that wouldn’t burn and it attracted the bears.

I worked in town at a grocery store and would bring home scraps from the meat shop once in awhile for our hungry bears. My mother told me to stop doing that, as the bears were so frequent, we might lose a kid or a dog to a bear.

I brought the last load of meat scraps and laced it all with enough ExLax to relieve a battalion of men and placed it in the pit. The next morning, all the scraps were gone and my brother and I tracked that bear for over 1/2 mile by the bear $hit in the woods. We never found the bear, but people brag about how they have killed grizzlies, but damn few ever killed one with ExLax…

Everybody knows that a 6.5 CreedmoreNmore can kill anything on planet earth at any distance. C'mon.

Hosea Sarber, SE Alaska Guide and Warden used a .270 right up into the 50s-60s until he disappeared, possibly without carrying a rifle. It does pay to carry something
that will work when the chips are down, even a handgun-like a 45 Colt with 270-300 gr bullets.
About 5 years ago a guide out of Jackson, WY. was guiding a FL. bow hunter after elk. They were successful late, and arrived with horses early next morning-in time to find the elk taken over by a grizzly
and half grown cub. Hunter mauled and guide killed leaving a family. Just recently a cabin owner was killed by a 270 lb black bear near Prescott, Arizona. Jack O'Connor killed at least one or two grizzlies
with a 270 in the 1940s.
Ben Lilly shot grizzlies in Mexico and NM-along the Blue/White Mtns Arizona during the early 1900s with an 1886 rifle in 33 WCF. WDM Bell used a Rigby 275 in Africa, but also used a 303 Enfield and a
318 Westley Richards rifle, a caliber very close to the 30-06 . Good bullet placement seems to me highly important, and the rifle one has in his hands when the bear shows up is his "bear rifle".

All that said, the grizzly is a smart animal and deserves respect. William Wright, author of "The Grizzly Bear" started out as a hunter/guide and became a naturalist with a camera. His first bear was shot with a broken .44 Winchester and a pocketknife. He respected the grizzly as did Aldo Leopold, who commented on the last Grizzly killed on Escudilla Mtn in N. Arizona, stating that it was "only a mountain now".

The .375 H&H works great on everything, except my shoulder. I've been told by PHs in Africa on two hunts people seem to do MUCH better with the 9.3 x 62 vs the .375 H&H because of approx. 15 percent less recoil. Also, no one can see any difference in the killing power of the 9.3 vs the .375 calibers. I'll admit it, darn it, I am a wussy when it comes to recoil. I do not like the recoil of the big powder capacity magnums. This is why I like the 30-06 and 57mm length cases. They just get the job done, good velocity, and accurate. I just do not like magnum recoil.

O'Connor wrote the following on the .270, .30-06, and brown bears:

Yep!

Which is why I eventually sold my .375s--and also my .338 Winchester Magnum. Bought my first 9.3x62 in 2001, and after hunting with it in places from Alaska to Africa discovered I wasn't taking either the .338 or .375 hunting anymore. (Of course, I eventually succumbed to another .375, a pre-'64 Model 70 a year or so ago....)

You know Shrapnel....you tell some of the greatest events having lived it, over so much of the BS from those who have no clue. Reminds me of my childhood...only on the east coast and without the bears

Hi Swamplord.....Phil Shoemaker replied back to me that a bear guide he knew very well used a .270 Win for very many years guiding his bear clients. No problems! However, I believe confidence is very important in hunting dangerous game. If a larger caliber bullet makes one more confident, yes...use it.
I've used the .270 over a lifetime, literally. I've seen it's performance and have utter confidence it it with good bullets. IIRC, Jack O'Connor recommended choosing proper bullets for the .270 Win and other calibers.