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Campfire 'Bwana
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Originally Posted by Dillonbuck
Gnoahh,
My first guess would be the workers were overlooked.
In an extreme emergency the traffic would be the first though.
Someone may have nightmares for years over that normal oversight.

Yep - I'm sure some will be up nights. Might be they also assumed the workers would "see the ship coming!" and bail. But that's not likely, I mean, they've got mind/hands on task - no over the side.


Me



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Indeed.


"You can lead a man to logic, but you cannot make him think." Joe Harz
"Always certain, often right." Keith McCafferty
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Originally Posted by flintlocke
Originally Posted by gunchamp
Originally Posted by Teal
Originally Posted by Teal
Originally Posted by flintlocke
Originally Posted by milespatton
Admittedly, I know nothing about ships, a little about river barges, quite a bit about inland fishing boats, But,I still have trouble understanding why the tow boats are not required all of the way to the ocean, with a ship that size. miles
And this my friends is the key to the whole mess...the shipowners have fought this forever, it's all about the money...within seconds the pilots could have had 12,000 hp guiding the disabled hulk through the bridge footings.

Many are going to learn that it's the companies with cargo on the ship that crashed into the bridge that will pay the damages, not the ship owner or ship operator. That's because of ancient maritime law (older than the US constitution) called "General Average" designed to prevent sailors from fighting over which cargo to toss overboard, and instead to focus on saving the ship. Per Ryan Peterson.

Blog post/linky

Actually - speaking with more people - to clarify, damages to the vessel and cargo are covered under “general average”—paid by the cargo owners and their insurance companies. The bridge and other external damages will be covered by the property insurance of the ship operator.
If it is an accident, does any blame or penalties fall on the captain?
The senior pilot is the captain during the period they are contracted for, it is very respectful, but 99 times out of 100, the ships captain keeps his mouth shut..and is often not much more than a translator when languages are a problem.
I got one side of the story once working on a docking assist at Bremerton/Kitsap Naval Base, a Navy Captain countermanded the order of the pilot...the skipper on the tug I was on balked at the order of the naval captain...the pilot told my skipper he had been relieved and please enter that with the correct time in the tug's log. Very tense but polite..no voices raised on the radio. Normally the navy has their own tugs. The navy ship damaged about 60 ft of pier and a small forest of piling with some hull damage to her stern. I don't know who ended up paying, but we never docked another naval vessel while I was there. The pilot continued to dock tankers and containerships successfully for another 12 years until he retired. I suspect my company didn't think the little bit of navy work was worth the hassle.
Interesting and thank you for the post

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Trojacek


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My tensonal Lebel bees sumwhut esxepsonal sxasperated cuz of dish hapsunal ebent! Butt us Kant spen no $$$$ on da bride upket ft cuz wee got sen dem $$$$$ to urbankane!


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Originally Posted by AKwolverine
Originally Posted by AcesNeights
I saw several explosions on several different videos from several different angles so I’m withholding my opinion…

Are you thinking CGI or the Rothschilds?

Neither. It was Jooish space lasers.



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Connect the dots, people.

This was an obvious attack by Putin to retaliate for the CIA Moscow concert hall massacre.

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Funny as hell, not nearly as catastrophic as the collapse of Baltimore’s education system among many other things 🤣😂🤣😂🤣

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Lots of coal stuck in the port

Look at CEIX stock. Might be a buy

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Originally Posted by gnoahhh
I, as well as everyone I know here is still is still in shock. From what I understand, the pilot did get on the horn to shore authorities the instant it became apparent that the ship was going to hit. The authorities, who we locals refer to as "the bridge cops" (MTA cops responsible for all the bridges in the Bay region) who did immediately choke off traffic onto the bridge. The vehicles seen in the videos were merely stragglers who scooted through in the last second, it's unclear if any of them took the plunge. (The videos show only a couple vehicles moving on the bridge - which even at that time of night is usually damned near bumper to bumper.) The vehicles that went in the drink were seemingly work vehicles of the maintenance crew standing on the bridge, as were most if not all, of the people who went down. It would seem that the emergency response was prompt and effective, sparing a whole lot more souls from a grizzly end. You gotta remember this ship was moving at a snail's pace, a big irresistible force, but a snail's pace nonetheless.

The main question I have is why didn't the maintenance crew get the word to drop what they're doing and scoot. Maybe they did and simply didn't react fast enough, who knows - we may never know.

I knew when this thread started that the conspiracy theorists and "Chicken Littles" would jump to conclusions and start promulgating wild ideas based entirely on gut feelings, scant information, and prejudices. Hell, they may well be right at the end of the day but it bears keeping quiet about it until the facts are in - if for no other reason than to honor the poor bastards who lost their lives.


And damn good for them to get it shut off so fast. I'm sure one of those cars was a 'f'k it, I'm going'. I'm glad they did their job well and that it wasn't 8am.

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Originally Posted by JohnnyLoco
Funny as hell, not nearly as catastrophic as the collapse of Baltimore’s education system among many other things 🤣😂🤣😂🤣

Truth!!!


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Originally Posted by gunchamp
Originally Posted by Teal
Originally Posted by gunchamp
I find it amusing that some of you couldnt possibly imagine this not being an accident. There currently is not enough info out there for me to form a good opinion yet, but after all the insanity we have seen in the past few years, anything is possible. This could be cyber or lord knows what. Could just be a bad accident as well. Laughing off either possibility is very short sighted

The prevailing thought has been that it's anything BUT an accident. Some people, believing it's an accident, realize that it's unlikely that the engine room was "hacked" to stop ships power and then EXPERTLY rode momentum and currents to create a collision to take out a bridge at the BEST possible time of day to do so for mitigating loss of life. They did this knowing eventually power would come back on and reactions would ensure a collision after. They couldn't plan on her sinking as she only has 10 feet from keel to the bed - she's not gonna disappear under the waves....

The MAN 55,000 hp powerplant has Wi-fi and internet connectivity that opens it up for hacking - I'm sure.

They want to "attack" as retribution for whatever but not hurt anyone - makes sense.
I dont know alot about shipping or ships in general. You may be absolutely correct. I just question everything these days. Too many odd things happening

Democrats keep introducing legislation to put government controlled kill switches in new vehicles. Why couldn't a foreign government hack a kill switch into the ship?

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"The welfare of humanity is always the alibi of tyrants".
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"The welfare of humanity is always the alibi of tyrants".
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Originally Posted by Swamplord
[Linked Image from imagizer.imageshack.com]

Looks like he is singing "Oh say can you see, that bridge coming at me...."

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Originally Posted by Longbob
Originally Posted by Swamplord
[Linked Image from imagizer.imageshack.com]

Looks like he is singing "Oh say can you see, that bridge coming at me...."

Or, “I’m Popeye the sailor man”.

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In 5 more pages people will be saying the saw flashes from demolition charges.


You didn't use logic or reason to get into this opinion, I cannot use logic or reason to get you out of it.

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Stop with the rumors

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Since there’s no sign of Jag, I’ll post this…



From Telegram:

Lara Logan (https://x.com/laralogan/status/1772675651599770093?s=46) on Baltimore Bridge Collapse

Multiple intel sources: Baltimore bridge collapse was an “absolutely brilliant strategic attack” on US critical infrastructure - most likely cyber - & our intel agencies know it. In information warfare terms, they just divided the US along the Mason Dixon line exactly like the Civil War.

Second busiest strategic roadway in the nation for hazardous material now down for 4-5 years - which is how long they say it will take to recover. Bridge was built specifically to move hazardous material - fuel, diesel, propane gas, nitrogen, highly flammable materials, chemicals and oversized cargo that cannot fit in the tunnels - that supply chain now crippled.

Make no mistake: this was an extraordinary attack in terms of planning, timing & execution.

The two critical components on that bridge are the two load-bearing pylons on each end, closest to the shore. They are bigger, thicker and deeper than anything else. These are the anchor points and they knew that hitting either one one of them would be a fatal wound to the integrity of the bridge.

Half a mile of bridge went in the river - likely you will have to build a new one. Also caused so much damage to the structural integrity of the bottom concrete part that you cannot see & won’t know until they take the wreckage apart. Structural destruction likely absolute.

Attack perfectly targeted.

“They have figured out how to bring us down. As long as you stay away from the teeth of the US military, you can pick the US apart. We are arrogant and ignorant - lethal combination. Obama said they would fundamentally change America and they did. We are in a free-fall ride on a roller coaster right now - no brakes - just picking up speed.”

The footage shows the cargo ship never got in the approach lane in the channel. You have to be in the channel before you get into that turn. Location was precise/deliberate: chose a bend in the river where you have to slow down and commit yourself - once you are committed in that area there is not enough room to maneuver.

Should have had a harbor pilot to pilot the boat. You are not supposed to traverse any obstacles without the harbor pilot.

They chose a full moon so they would have maximum tidal shift - rise and fall. Brisk flow in that river on a normal day & have had a lot of rain recently so water was already moving along at a good pace.

Hit it with enough kinetic energy to knock the load-bearing pylon out from under the highway - which fatally weakens the span and then 50 percent of the bridge fell into the water.

All these factors when you look at it  - this is how you teach people how to do this type of attack and there are so few people left in the system who know this. We have a Junior varsity team on the field.

Tremendous navigational obstruction. Huge logistical nightmare to clean this up. Number of dead is tragic but not the whole measure of the attack.

That kind-of bridge constantly under repair - always at night because there is so much traffic and they cannot obstruct that during the day. So concern is for repair guys who were on foot (out of their vehicles) working who may now be in the water - 48 degrees at most at this time of year.

When you choke off Baltimore you have cut the main north-south hazardous corridor (I95) in half. Now has to go around the city - or go somewhere else.

To move some of that cargo through the tunnel you may be able to get a permit but those are slow to get and require an escort system that is expensive and has to be done at night.

For every $100 dollars that goes into the city, $12 comes from shipping. Believe this will cripple the city of Baltimore at a time when they do not hav
e the resources to recover.

@lauralogan

@Brandenburh4Mi


Originally Posted by Bristoe
The people wringing their hands over Trump's rhetoric don't know what time it is in America.
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