Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunting Rifles Winchester's Super X Silvertips

Are the current Winchester Silvertips that are loaded in the Super X line of ammunition really as bad as I have read? I read an article where the author (I believe it was Mr. Barsness) shot a deer with one and it didn't even penetrate the first rib that it hit. If they are really that bad, why doesn't Winchester just discontinue them on the basis of being cripplers? Just currious. Thanks.

Matt

A good friend of mine uses them in 300WM and 7 RM and has great success. He took a monster bull elk this year at 60 yards, and a small bull moose as well. All the silvertips are is a dressed up Ballistic Tip. Love 'em or hate 'em, they have put down a heap of game.

280_ACKLEY

Super x

Read again.............. Super X silvertips are NOT the same bullet as the ballistic tip.



Two totally different bullets, in design, construction and performance.

I have used Winchester Silvertips in the past in my 270, and my father in law uses them exclusively in his 30-06. Based on the animals I have seen taken with them, I believe they are an excellent factory bullet for deer sized game. Of course, my father in law only shoots 25 to 36 inch spread muleys, he hasnt killed any real big deer with the silvertips (grin). <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />I moved on from them because I wanted to reload bullets with better ballistic coeffecients, etc.

When Silvertips came out in the late 40s, they were the "cat's meow" when it came to holding together. Shortly thereafter, Mr. Nosler came out with his partition and the rest as they say is history. Having said that, Silvertips at the time were far better than any of the British made Kynochs for African game. Just to feed fuel to the premium bullet fire, my uncle used them in his 270 in Africa for Lion and other thin skinned game in Angola ( yes I said Lion I was there as a teenager!) in the late 60s and dropped them handily. Today, they have a small but loyal following ( that is all my father in law uses in his 270) and I think the only two calibers still loaded are the 270 and 3006. I sure would like to see a comparison in penetration and cohesiveness between them and say Ballistic Tips, Sierras, etc . jorge

jorgeI,

I just recently saw them listed in 30-30. Don't know if there are others......

jorgei,

When I was growing up in Pa., it seemed like everyone in my family used Sivertips. Dad, uncles, their friends.......mostly in '06, .308 and .270.

I thought that was all there was !!!

My first deer (doe) fell to a 180 Silvertip out of my '06. I think I was 14 at the time. That was the standard load (it seemed so anyway) for guys back in that day shooting the '06.

There was something magical about that silver tip'd bullet !! As I remember, it dropped deer by the truckloads. Probably because it was the perfect match of bullet construction being used at the velocity they were intended for.

I wish I could find some to load in my dads old Mod 70 '06.

Would make for a very nastalgic combination.

Tony.

BTW,

Anyone know where I can get some .308 Silvertips ??

150's or 180's.

TIA,

Tony

I think "280Ackley" may be confusing the newer "Ballistic Silvertip" with the older "Silver Tips" with the aluminium cap on the nose.I don't think they can be that bad as they were very popular in the 300 gr. 375 H&H in the 40's and 50's.,according to Finn Aagard anyway.

Sorry, I should learn how to read. I was thinking the Ballistic Silvertips <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

280_ACKLEY

The Silvertip that broke up on a mule deer came apart on the shoulder, not a rib, and was 150-grain .30-06 from a factory load. This happened about 1984 if I recall correctly, and I had to track the deer for a half-mile over a couple sagebrush ridges and shoot it again through the ribs, which worked.

The post-mortem only revealed the jacket, turned abolsutely inside-out. I still have it, in fact was showing a friend the remains today.

An old friend, the late Walter White, killed one of the biggest brown bears listed in Boone & Crockett with Silvertips from a .375 H&H back in the 1950's. He had to load the magazine several times, as the bullets kept breaking up on the bear's wet hair and hide. Several broke up on the shoulder. Luckily the bear was across a river so there was some comfort zone.

On the other hand, an elk-hunting buddy's father bought 1000 130-grain .270 Silvertips in the 1950's. He is still loading them and killing elk, and has a pile of recovered bullets that look much like recovered Nosler Partitions. Some went through fairly heavy bone.

I don't know about today's 130-grain .270's, but such mixed results seem to indicate that the construction of Silvertips has varied widely, perhaps both over the years and from caliber to caliber. Personally, I have had much more consistent results from Hornady Interlocks, which are just about as "affordable."

Any given bullet will have its share of "lovers" and "haters". Just last week a fellow came in the shop proclaiming Core-Lokts were no good for deer. Another said he had had terrible luck with Interlocks on deer. Whatever..... Millions of dead deer and happy hunters would likely disagree. Anyway, name a bullet, any bullet and you'll get a lot of opinions. Ballistic Tips are one of the more controversial these days but the old Silvertip has certainly had it's share of controversy as well. I've used Silvertips in .250 Sav., .300 Sav., .303 Sav., .30/40 Krag, .300 H&H, .348 WCF & .358 WCF and have been left with nothing to complain about. Individual bullet failures notwithstanding, I think they're good, solid performers for non-dangerous game, although I wouldn't hesitate to shoot large carnivors with the more potent cartridges pushing heavy Silvertips. Sometimes I think hunters put too much thought into bullet designs, depending on the game of course. As long as a hunter uses a proper cartridge loaded with a decent expanding/decent penetrating bullet of proper weight, I don't think the deer, sheep, elk, hog or what have you will care whether he was shot with a high tech A-Frame or a low tech Silvertip. I'm all for "super premiums" on game requiring their penetration and weight retention but I'm convinced that many hunters would be better served with something like the Silvertips, Power Points, Hi-Shoks or Core-Lokts that have been filling meat poles for eons. How did hunters get by before the advent of the Fail Safe, A-Frame or Accu-Bond??? I guess all those dead animals should just be attributed to luck....

I think you are right on the 3030s and maybe even 308s. Best way is just to go to the Olin Website. My father in Law still swears by them in his 270 and my pre-64 FWT loves them. Moreover, they shoot to the same POI as 130gr Power Points. I use them for hogs here in the south in a pinch. Overall though, Mule Deer's post pretty well covers it. When they work, they work but when they fail they FAIL. No way I'd use them on dangerous game. jorge

God I have not shot a head of big game with Winchesterr Silvertips since 1969. I when to Newfoundland with my uncle to hunt moose. As I recall I put two on the shoulder of a bull, and that moose just walked off and ran into my Uncle who shot it once with a 308 and some Corelots., Both those bullets were on the shoulder sort of turned inside out. I was rather young then, the next year, I had a new 7mm Remington mag and handloaded 175 gr Nosler Partitions. Did not have any trouble on Moose that year or Africa the next summer. They tend to be very unrelable. When they work they work good when they don't they make a mess. Hornaday's is a way better bullet than those. And you can never go wrong with a Nosler Partition.

I second gmsemel's opinion. If you're hunting deer-sized game, or simply can't stand to pay for Partitions when hunting larger game, the Hornady Interlock flat-base is an extremely affordable and much more reliable bullet than the Silvertip. I've shot lots of game with all the popular bullets, and the Interlock works more reliably than any other affordable bullet on the market. For a little more (and if you can find some, and if you shoot a 6mm, .270, 7mm or .30 rifle) there's the Speer Deep-Shock, which is better yet, darn near like the Partition.

My information is that the older Silvertips were all made for different applications and designed to perform under different conditions.
The .270, 130 gr. Silvertip worked very well on lots of stuff. That's because it was designed for one load and velocity range. The 150 gr. .308 spitzer bullet was designed to work on everything from the the .300 Savage to the .300 H&H Magnum. They didn't work so well.
Since then, Winchester seems to have learned that it is worth it to them to design bullets for specific applications. Their hollow point, 120 gr. 25-06 bullet is a case in point. I understand they tend to do this with their very good Power Point bullets as well. E

I actually have one box of Federal 165gr Deep Shok factory loads left. Too bad they quit loading them as they shoot great. I know that it has been pretty hard to find anyone stocking them for reloaders for well over a year. Hope they can start offering them more reliably.

I've been told the Deep-shok has been discontinued by Speer due to "difficulty in manufacturing" More's the shame.



Mule Deer, can you verify this??

No, I can't verify--but I will try to. Thanks for the heads-up.

My personal theory is that the Deep-Shok is being put out to pasture because Nosler was likely peeing in their pants over a standard factory bullet that would out-Partition the Partition, and for a lot less $$$. Maybe they even threatened to pull all their bullets from the Federal Premium line. Think about the revenue that Federal would lose if they couldn't sell Ballistic Tips. Who knows?



On a related note, I see that Remington has ceased to load Nosler bullets of any kind in their ammo. From the x-section on the website, the new Accu-Tip is obviously a Hornady SST...you can even see the InterLock ring. This move makes a bit of sense, since, if I'm not mistaken, Hornady is already maufacturing most, if not all, of their Core-Lokt's for them. Note well, I did NOT say that the Core-Lokt and InterLock are the same animal. For some reason, that always seems to run through people's minds when this subject comes up.



RSY

RSY, I've had the EXACT same thought on why the Deep-shok was discontinued....................and I think we hit the nail on the head.

If that is the case, it really is a shame. An excellent bullet, as good as the partition at less than 1/2 of the price.

Mule Deer - any news??

BTT

I use Silvertips in my Win 64, 32 Win Special. I've only shot a couple of whitetails with it, but I only needed one shot both times. Maybe it's just the high vel loads that break up.

The only catridge I have used the Silvertip in is the 30-30 in the 170gr weight. My Model 94 shoots them better than anything I can reload for it. It also performed well on the deer I have used it on so far giving complete brodside penetration. My rifle is a Black Shadow with 24 in. barrel and has an old 3x Weaver on it. It will shoot three of those factory Silvertips into 1in at 100 EVERY time if I do my part. So far I have no complaints with either bullet or rifle.

I've shot em and wasn't impressed with the accuracy. But, that is rifle-specific. I didn't do any load development, the first load I tried was so far off, I did not want to put any more effort into it.

mauser96,

I am really getting to like the Speer Deep Shocks. I worked up a 165 grain DS load for my 300WIN and it is super accurate. Well under MOA and consistant.

I killed a nice 8 pointer opening day with that load. Unfortunately, it wasn't much of a test as I had to neck shoot the buck. However, I did take out the spine with the shot. I have seen the results of BT's and Sierra's on similar shots and the exit was the size of a softball.

The exit of the 165 DS, with an impact velocity in excess of 3100, looked like a nice expanded bullet's exit. I'd say it was similar to what I would expect to see from a Partition or bullets of similar performance.

Hopefully I'll have a few more chances to try them out before this hunting season is out.

Tony.

Killed a 9 foot brown bear in 1974 on Kodiak Island with 338 win mag and win 225 gr silver tip bullet. One shot thru lower part the hump and the bear went stiff on his feet and fell over dead. This combination would stop a moose in its tracks and they would be dead before they hit the ground. I never had to shoot anything twice. Silver tip were just an awesome bullet, wish I had bought several boxes for longevity. But I didn’t so switched to Partitions, but they have never killed as fast, clean and instantly as the silvertips.

Holy Zombie thread Batman

The lack of experience is really obvious by statements and questions related to these sites!

I've killed deer with a Savage 99 in 358 Win using factory Winchester 200 gr Silver tips and a 270 Win and factory Winchester 130gr Silver tips never an issue