Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Gunsmithing Last straw with Midway USA for me

Larry Potterfield here. Thanks for the kind words and please allow me to provide some answers on backorders, postage and dealer delivery addresses.

Yes, backorders set a record high about 10 days ago. Despite our best planning efforts, every March for as long as I can remember has been this way. The culprit is record sales at MidwayUSA, unprecedented slow delivery from some key vendors and the limited availability of ammunition and components - especially the slower moving items, caused by war needs and high prices of raw materials. Backorders are going down and we should be back to normal by the end of April, except on ammo and components, and some items like AR-15 parts.

Concerning postage, yes we do charge a little more than the UPS or USPS rate card for your order - and yes,the rates continue to increase. The little extra covers insurance, reships, packaging supplies and some other miscellaneous costs. I have never thought of the postage account as being a profit center. Yes, we do charge separate postage on backorders. I realize it isn't your fault that we are out of stock on an item. Perhaps it is our fault, but certainly not for lack of planning. Actually, it is mostly just a matter of the vendors not being able to ship their products in a timely manner, due mostly to increased demand. MidwayUSA could certainly pay that postage, but we would have to make it up somewhere - raising the postage rates or raising the prices. I don't personally like either one of those options better than the one we currently use, and hope you share that that preference with me.

Concerning dealer delivery addresses, I know this doesn't affect many of you, but here is the answer. We had a number of dealers who set up selling accounts on Ebay, Gunbroker and Auction Arms and a couple even had their own web sites. These dealers would price their products a little below ours. When they got an order, they would place it with us for shipment to their Customer. Now, we don't make a lot of profit on a dealer order, so helping competitors get started, using our large inventory and efficient delivery system didn't make a lot of business sense to us. So, we now ship to dealers at their business address only.

Anyway, those are the answers to the main concerns expressed here and I appreciate the opportunity to present our side of the story.

This is my 31st year at MidwayUSA, and yes it is a great success story. But success has come because we have always been focused on doing the very best for our Customers and success is only sustained with the same attitude.

You know that I personally hunt, shoot, reload and do some of my own gunsmithing. The Company and the Potterfield Family have always supported the NRA and the shooting sports community. I am no different than most of our Customers, I just have a different job, and come to work every day trying to do it better.

Thanks for your time and your business!

Aim Straight,

Larry Potterfield
President/CEO
MidwayUSA

Appreciate you checking in and telling your side of the story. Welcome to the site.

The only issues I have had with Midway are:

1. Backorder shipping charges exceeding the cost of the item - a $2.00 item costing $6.00 to mail. They "should" verify that you still want the item before shipping it to you and charging you credit card.

2. The cost with shipping is often higher than Graf's or other places. Flat rate shipping charges on heavy items like bullets are not that expensive.

I have to say that everyone there that I have talked to or dealt with via email has been great and very accomodating.

Hey, Larry.

If you recall we spoke about your shipping policies at the Reno ACGG show two years ago. As I stated on here, you were very kind and gracious and you even took my email address and had a gentleman named Eric contact me.

Well...despite your's and Eric's assurances that it was taken care of the next order I placed for Remington 700's actions resulted in the exact same problem. Your company will not ship serialized receivers/frames, etc to any address except for the FFL premises address. As it just so happened, right when this was going on with you I got my newsletter from the BATF and one of the FAQ's had to do with this very topic. I sent your office a copy of that newsletter where it states quite plainly that an FFL holder can have a different shipping/mailing address to receive firearms other than the business premises address. As I pointed out to you, Eric and your staff my mailing address is right on my FFL under (of all places) "mailing address." This is not something that I added on, it is printed on there by the BATF.

As for your other policy that was the last straw for me and what initiated this thread...all I can say is that it shouldn't be all that difficult for your sales people to differentiate between someone ordering a truck full of stuff that they want to sell on e-Bay and a dealer ordering one item.

Larry, I admire the fact that you took a home business and turned it into a multi-million dollar affair, and after meeting you in person I do not have a bad thing to say about you personally. However, in my humble opinion, the lack of concern for customer relations at your company is just unacceptable.

In addition Larry...you can buy the exact same product I tried to buy from Midway (a Leica 1200 Range finder) at Amazon.com for the exact same price as your dealer price. Several other places also sell them retail for your dealer price.

Since I have (or had) an account with Midway I thought (silly me) that I would be loyal and give my business to what I thought was a friendly company where I had an account.

Mr. Potterfield:

Regarding postage and your statement:

"Concerning postage, yes we do charge a little more than the UPS or USPS rate card for your order - and yes,the rates continue to increase. The little extra covers insurance, reships, packaging supplies and some other miscellaneous costs. I have never thought of the postage account as being a profit center."

With the last order I made with you, and which I cancelled when I saw the shipping charges, the postage was more than double what it would cost to send the same package to you, and also more than the cost of the item.

"packaging supplies and some other miscellaneous costs."

When you are in the mail order business, you are going to have expenses for packaging supplies, and also the expense of paying someone to package the item. That is to be expected, but double what I would have to pay to ship the same item to you? No way.

I have made a few handcrafted items, and I have always, when I even charged shipping at all, only charged what it cost me. I didn't try to make a profit on the shipping.

I could make a pretty good living selling to you goods for my purchase price, then charging you double my shipping cost to ship them to you.

Sorry, but I just don't buy your reasoning for the high shipping costs.

"The little extra"

How about more than double?

I think it would also be appropriate to mention that a good portion of the back orders are for products made by companies that are owned by Midway. I don't have the list of those companies in front of me but it is pretty extensive if I recall.

As for "not much profit" on dealer orders...that is almost comical. As I already pointed out, a Google search came up with numerous stores whose retail price was exactly the same as Midways dealer price on the item I tried to order from them. Their shipping was far less, and they would ship the damned thing to me anywhere I wanted them to.

Comparing Prices? Remember, Graf & Sons pays the freight!

Midway used to to that also...in fact it was one of the policies that launched the business from small to large.

Larry,
Thanks for responding. The response shows you have an interest in what customers are saying.

However, I do disagree with the shipping policy on backordered items. It has made me second guess an entire order when everything isn't in stock due to the shipping practices. Many times, this has sent me elsewhere to buy.

You mentioned shipping is a cost center and no revenue is made. I do believe you on this. However, how many millions in net revenue are needed by the Potterfield family before business suffers b/c you want a net zero in shipping and don't want to absorb some of the cost? Instead, lack of planning on Midway's behalf is passed on to the customer.

Instead of passing the shipping on to the customer, why not use Wal-Mart tactics of being the biggest in the business and holding vendors feet to the fire? Let them absorb some of the cost when missing declared delivery deadlines.

The shipping costs entailed by Midway today easily put your company at the top of the list in terms of cost comparative shopping with other online sales companies. This has caused me to shop around instead of being allegiant to Midway as I have in the past.

99.9% of companies don't order gun and shooting related gifts for their employees, clients, or customers either. It's a business client deal with Midway. Ordinary mortals like myself can have stuff sent to whatever address we choose - at least on the internet orders I normally do. FFL clients by virtue of the document they have on file have a BATFE connection. I'm sure every company prefers not to lure trouble to their doorstep. In a big company like Midway, that is probably easier avoided by using a simple blanket policy.

One can do business with smaller, more personal companies and I sometimes do. Often they don't have the inventory or consequent selection. Midway does have a better website than do most other web based shooting supply places and you also can tell what is in stock or not when you place the order. Further, you know what it will cost to ship the backorder if there is one. I wish other customers helped pay the freight to Alaska. That really bites if you want to complain about shipping fees. I do like the fact that you know exactly what is in stock or not when you make an internet order.

You know it's always amusing to me that people who decry government regulations and restrictions on the firearms industry are so often people who seem to have absolutely no problem when people within the industry add even more ridiculous restrictions into the mix.

A wise man once told me that the fate of a liar is that they can never believe anything that others tell them. Perhaps something similar is at work with people who are always assuming that someone is out to screw them over.

Perhaps, if Mr. Potterfield is so worried about this and has had such bad experiences with it, then he should just abolish dealer discounts all together and sleep restfully at night knowing that the black helicopters aren't going to be hovering over his house any more!

I'm still curious as to why Midway will not ship in FLAT RATE boxes to Alaska. Grafs and Lock, Stock will.

I have much respect for Larry for putting himself in the crosshairs with this thread. When I first got into reloading I poured thousands of dollars from various suppliers and never had an issue with Midway. I do not understand peoples complaints on higher prices or shipping rates. We all have the capacity to search out the best deals so why get negative towards Midway?

Midway has the right to choose their policies and I appreciate Larry coming forward. The fact that he joined the fire to give his position just means he listens to what we have to say.

The market will decide.

Wade

WOW!. What a simple thing, buy from whom you are pleased with, eh? Just like meat and veggies at the grocery store and booze at your favorite liquor store.... Somehow you landed on with whom you shop.

I'm not negative about Midway. Ordered from them for years, but the cost of shipping to Alaska is better handled with Flat Rate USPS. A few companies will work with me on that, some won't.

It's 69.7 miles from my house to Brownell's. I liked to go to the store and pick up items but now with the price of gas I can have it shipped for a lot less. I can see why Midway has raised their shipping prices. Can you drive to somewhere and get it cheaper? This does not fix Rick B's problem but we all know what the price of gas is doing to the cost of anything in this country. kwg

Midway raising their shipping prices has never been the issue here.

The issue has been that Midway charges about double or more to ship something to you than it would cost for you to ship it to Midway.

Personally, I don't care to pay Midway $12.00, or more to ship a $10.00 item to me.

Midway calls it shipping and handling. What is handling? Picking it up and putting it in a box? Anyone, from grocery stores to stores that sell shooting supplies is going to have to handle their products. Do you pay a grocery store for handling a can of beans when they put it on the shelf?

Actually, you do, but the cost is figured in the price of the can of beans. You don't pay extra for "handling" it when you check out.

Yep.

3000 bullets from Lock, Stock and Barrel will cost me $13.95 to be mailed. Cabelas will charge me $16.95 and Midway will charge me $61.

kwg,

Maybe some on here have misunderstood where I'm coming from on this or perhaps I'm just not real good at expressing it.

I'm not trying to tell Larry Potterfield or his business to do anything...my only point in starting this thread was to alert other FFL gunsmiths that have Midway accounts that Mr. Potterfield obviously thinks we are all a bunch of crooks trying screw him, instead of loyal customers trying to give him our business. That's a pretty sad (read that as stupid with a capital S) attitude to take towards gunsmiths who spend thousands and thousands of dollars at Midway each and every year...and are in the position to recommend Midway products to their customers.

Mr. Potterfield has made his choice, as he is certainly entitled to do...and I have made mine. Not one penny of my money or my customers money will be spent at Midway EVER again.