Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Predators and Varmints "Best Prairie Dog Cartridge" - Article & Opinion

JBLEDSOE: I read just fine - and if YOU are unable to answer direct questions then what is the point conversing with you - and your closed mind!
I will try once more anyway!
YOU WERE alluding to the 204 Ruger as being "un-versatile" in your post!
I called you on it and you refused to answer that inquiry!
Instead you resort to snide and immature remarks regarding my reading and shooting abilities!
How imbecillic and immature!
I corrected you once and I won't hesitate to correct you again!
THE 204 Ruger is an amazingly versatile and efficient Varminting cartridge!
Nothing you have espoused contradicts that!
I base MY contention on over 5 years of extensive in the field and at the range experiences with it!
Refering to the 204 Ruger as a "fad" (like you did!) is also bogus and erroneous!
Sales of 204 Ruger arms and ammunition is very strong!
I know several Varmint Hunters that own more than 4 Varminters in 204 Ruger (me included!) and one of my friends owns 6 Varminters in 204 Ruger!
I will remind you AGAIN - NO ONE SOLD ME on the 204 Ruger!
I investigated the ballistics and its reported recoil and decided to try one for myself!
Boy (I am not referring to you as "boy" I am just exclaiming "BOY"!) I am sure glad I did.
Please answer my direct question of you JBLEDSOE - WHAT lS NOT VERSATILE ABOUT THE 204 Ruger?
And we are not talking about cartridges "that work" (like you contend regarding the 22's!) we are talking "the best"!
The 204 Ruger is the best all around "Prairie Doggin cartridge" I have ever used - bar none!
If you contend otherwise, state your case, specifically, so I can debate it with you!
I hope "you can read" THIS post well enough to understand and reply to it!
Long live the 204 Ruger!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

VG, ya mean even better than that ol' 17 HMR thats over rated and almost defunk.
just funnin ya ol'guy, hope you and the family had a great holidy.

I have tried the .17 HMR a couple of times on paper, where it was darn accurate, but then took it out one night calling in coons, and I was less then impressed with the terminal results. Usually took a couple of shots, but I would imagine that with PD, the .17HMR could be quite fun out to 150 yards or so.

I'm gonna give the 204R a try. I really like the 6 x 55 Improved for my varminting. I have tried a lot of other cartridges from the 22lr to the 300 wby, not just for fun but loaded specifically for p-doggin. I have noticed that it is the velocity that causes destruction on a dog, all things being equal (ie. plastic tipped bullets). The 300 Wby steaming 110 v-max causes no more "lift" than my 6mm. I will see if the 204R steaming along gives the same result as other cartridges with similar velocity.

The main ranch I shoot P-dogs on is over 30,000 acres and has to many towns to keep tract of. When the weather is nice in the summer we set up benches and shoot into the wind, as much as possible. We will spend most of the day there hanging out and shooting. Most of the year, however, we drive from town to town checking cattle, windmills, tanks, and doing chores.

After a handfull of shots most dogs out to 350ish yards go down leaving only head shots. Add to this the wind blowing your barrel and bullets around. In short order you will see what you and your rifle are made of. When the other guys were getting frustrated I was pulling dogs out of there holes with the six out of my heavy barreled Grey lady. Needless to say I have now built the other guys heavy barreled 243's to launch the 55 BT. Our 22 caliber rigs are collecting a lot of dust. I will run a 204R into the prairie and see for myself.

Some others have offered their experience based opinions on caliber...so here is mine.

17 Remington - great cartridge, as long as there is no wind. Longest kill on a prairie dog - 499 yards, one hole, thru and thru.

204 - Longest thus far - 753 yards. I doubt I will get a longer kill shot, possible...but will try.

223 - Longest thus far - 853 yards. I was not out of scope, but the energy of the bullet was about done.

223 AI - have not rang this one out all the way. 500-550 with 55gr VMax are no problem though. I am loaded with 75 gr AMax's now...we shall see.

22/6mm AI - only started working with this cartridge. I do NOT push the load yet, only running a touch under 3700 fps with 75 gr AMax. This is THE most destructive round I have experienced so far. At 400 yard, the 75's cut the dog in half, toss fifteen to tweny feet vertical and another fifteen backwards...and this is on FULL SIZED prairie dogs. My spotter just kept saying, "do it again, THAT was cool!"...and he is a VERY experienced shooter. Believe there is a magazine article calling this caliber the "half mile 22".

6.5x55 AI - will be in full swing this spring...I will post some pics as it happens. 142 gr SMK's at 3K should do just fine.

I haven't found anything that would make me want to trade my .222 Rem or my 220 Swift. Yet.

My number one ultimate go to p-dog splatter caliber is now my 204. Actually two of them. How can someone not like them when they are basically a ballistic twin to the 22-250 using a 1/3 less powder which means less barrel heat (a major plus in a busy dog field) and the best feature of all is seeing those impacts through the scope with a full array of acrobatics.

Yup......less powder consumption , less barrel heat , less muzzle jump , less blast , cheaper brass than the bigger stuff , and Swift -like ballistic performance ....I suspect the anti 204 guys have just not given one a fair trial .

Where do you get "anti 204 guys"? I have not heard any one bad mouth the 204. Just because we don't use the 204 can only mean that we don't like it? Are we to discard all our .22 rifles and gear and dash out to buy it all over again in 204? I had a 204 and discovered that for my uses it didn't do anything for me. Does that mean that I am "ANTI 204"? I drive a Ford. Do you assume from that fact that I am anti chevy? The logic escapes me.

.

As I mentioned in my prior post on this subject, I tried the 204 for a year, I shot everything from gophers to coyotes (and prairie dogs) with it and in my opinion it did not do anything that the 223 did not do.

I have been using the 222 and 223 for over 40 years now and perhaps one reason I am so confident in the 223 is that I have shot it so much that hold-over and windage hold-offs are almost an autopilot thing, I don't have to think about it, it just happens naturally.

Also as JBLEDSOE mentioned - just because the 204 is the new kid on the block and some folks like it they seem offended that we don't agree with their opinion, just remember opinions are like a certain part of your anatomy - we all have one.

The story in Varmint Hunter that started this is interesting in that by setting an arbitraty limit on the foot pounds needed to kill a PD and then interpolating that into the yardage that one can kill a PD the authors criteria appears to be biased in favor of the 204 from the start. Even more interesting is that he only used the cartridge for 350 rounds on PD's. Even the author admitted that the difference between the 223 and 204 is only minor.

quote from the article -�this leaves in no particular order, the 223 Remington and the 204 Ruger. You could probably be happy with either of these cartridges but they are not equals and the 223 is the next to go. It doesn�t have the maximum range of the 204 and its other ratings are no better.�
In the article his reason for not making the 223 his pick was that it rates it as a 357 yard maximum range cartridge versus his rating of the 204 as a 448 yard range cartridge. If you read the paragraph below apparently he is in error about the killing range of either cartridge.

If one wishes to put a different spin on �the best Prairie Dog Hunting cartridge� they could simply cite a reference from a different article in the same issue - In The Field With Remington and Swarovski by John Anderson,

Quote from that article.
�For those interested in such matters, John Barsness like to shoot varmints at long range and he keeps records at each hunt. His longest prairie dog kill with each of the three cartridges he fired was 458 yards with the 17 Remington Fireball, 630 yards with the 204 Ruger, and 712 yards with the 223 Remington. Certainly such distances are stretching it for any of these cartridges, but his results show what can be done if you know what you are doing.�

Using this article one could conclude that the 223 is the superior cartridge. Yes, I realize that Mr. Barsness has weighed in on the side of the 204 and that is okay with me, he is welcome to his opinion just as the rest of us are welcome to ours.

I am glad that the 204 is out there and that many people like it, the more shooters we have the better off we are. However I am also glad that we have choices and it just happens that my choice, after a years work with the 204, is still the 223 - I am sure that many other folks have other choices and that is great. It would be a boring world and many gunwriters would be unemployed if we all liked the same thing.

Whoa there Bledsoe , no need to get all lathered up about it. Also no one said you should dump a perfectly good 22 caliber to get to a 204 .

Maybe anti was the wrong choice of words , but at some point you are either going to rebarrel or replace those 22 s if you shoot a bit. And the 204 does carry some very logical and proven ballistic and practical advantages for pdogs.....but really , I don't care what the next fella wants to shoot .

In S.E. Wyoming there is a pdog paradise called Thunder Basin. The dogs number in the millions, and access, if you are polite, is not a problem. The wind howls across this chunk of prarie constantly and a lot of shooting is done from 250 to 600 yards. The most sucessful cartridges I've used and seen perform here are all above 6mm bore, with the 270, 284 and 30 cal stuff taking the most consitent hits in that gusty piece of real estate.

No such thing as best pd cartridge. Depends on the shooter and the likely conditions.

Wayne

So true.

I've killed thousands of PD's with a .22LR
next would be the .22 mag followed closely by the .223
IF I had to pick a single cartridge for shooting PD's it would be a toss up between the .223 and the .243.
I haven't toyed with the .204 but only because wind is a factor where I hunt, and I don't think the .20 cal bullet can deal with it. I may be wrong, but I'll stick to the heavier bullets of the slightly bigger rounds

In no specific order,222 Rem,223,22-250,243 winchester,25-06 remington.................

20 VarTarg (20-221 Fireball)

My personal choice would be the 222 Remington with forties.

I certainly would like to run some 55/60 V-Max, BK, and BT's from a 222 Magnum, just to see.

243's and the 243 WSSM lights them up afar with 55/58's, just like the 22-250.

Too many good rounds to pick from and anyone can tell you what the "best" deer cartridge is too FWIW. Just personal preference.

Bringing this thread back to the top. PD season is just around the corner!

I have two more 223 barrels to AI (a factory 1:9 Savage & a Broughton 1:8). Will be leaving my first Savage 12FV in 223 alone. Barrel has at least 5K down the tube...and want to see how long it will last.

With a little luck, this year will be my 1000-1500 yard year (ok...a LOT of luck!). Bringing out my 22/6mm AI and the 6.5x55 AI to push the envelope as far as I can. 75 gr AMax, 142 gr Sierra SMK's or 140 gr Berger VLD's will hopefully be my new friends!

Greeeeeetin's guys.. newbie to helping those prarie dogs get their 72 virgins..LOL this was a really cool thread and really helpful to me as im just gettin my first dog setup tommrow..Woo HOO! hehehe... I was doing research to make sure the 204 was what would do the job on yotes and pd's.. looks like from what i see here ( ALL THE CONTENTION ASIDE ) that it will be a good choice.
Im getting the new Remington RT-AR15 in 204 / with an 8x 32 x 40 bushnell elite 4200 scope...

Dogzilla: Well I am just as pleased as punch that you are strongly interested in the 204 Ruger cartridge!
I had lunch (I BOUGHT LUNCH!) for myself and three long time Varmint Hunters today - we seldom get together all at once.
The lunch time and long after lunch time topics were about guns and calibers.
What else is new - huh?
But the surprising part of todays get together was all four of us have and USE 204's for Varminting.
One of the group has even killed several Deer with his.
But as far as Varmints go the 204 was touted as a VERY flat shooting, very accurate, very easy to load for, is very mild of recoil and is slow to heat a barrel!
I think that was the ONLY topic at that long luncheon table that was unanimously agreed upon today - the excellence of the 204 Ruger cartridge - it is a splendid and agreeable cartridge!
NO "contention" there.
Now I will have to say this Dogzilla - none of us have a 204 Ruger on an AR type Rifle so you are kind of on your own there.
I wish you the best of luck with your choice and hope the Prairie Doggin season finds you safe and grinning, all those days long!
And I am very happy that you have made your first post on one of my "topics"!
Welcome to the 24 Hour!
Thank you for that.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy