Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Handguns .357 vs 10MM

That is a good point. Over the years, I've seen lots of pistol shooters. Very few could shoot even a standard weight .44 Magnum well. Most, however, could shoot a standard weight .357 pretty well. Experienced shooters, not new shooters.
I'd say much the same about the 10mm and the guns chambered for it. All of the 1911 pattern guns I've shot, and seen shot, were tough to shoot well. One of the reasons why I opted for the the 1006 Smith instead of a Colt Elite. I've shot 1911, 45's for over 50 yrs, so I'm not exactly new at it. I found the 10mm in the 1911's a strain to shoot well. I can do much better with my 4 inch, .44 Smith 29. With the Smith 1006, I shoot it about as well as I do my .44. Since the trigger isn't nearly as good, probably not as well when under stress.
I haven't shot a Glock 10. But I have shot their 9's, the .45's and their 40's. Got a hunch that if your hand fits the Glock 10mm's frame, it would be a good match for a 10. They handle recoil very well. Not my idea of a good pistol trigger either, but that's up to the guy shooting it. At least they won't beat up as badly as some other designs.
Besides the lighter kicking .357 in a good steel revolver, the Ruger "Alaskan" in .454 Casull might be worth something to a recoil shy guy. Shot with .45 Long Colt ammo, they ought to get the job done. E

Okay,

I put my money where my mouth was. I came home this afternoon, and took a stainless Ruger Blackhawk in .45 Colt (my neighbor was kind enough to lend me his Blackhawk, even after I told him what I would do to it), a S&W model 15 and a S&W M1911PD into a small box and poured in a mixture of fine dirt with flour added. All guns went in fully loaded.

Now I live in NW Arkansas, so the finest dirt is rather course, and contains lots of itty-bitty rocks, so the flour was added to add in something like real fine dirt.

Dirt and flour were poured onto each gun as it sat in the box (about 2 cups of each). The lid was put back on the box, and the whole thing was shaken several times. I cringed as I shook the box up with each gun in it.

The guns were taken out, shook off and then fired. Results:

S&W M15: DOA No DA pull, and couldn't pull the hammer all the way back
Ruger: DOA Could not draw the hammer all the way back
S&W 1911PD: 8 rounds fired

Full disassembly of the M15 and Blackhawk showed the flour was the real killer. The courser dirt didn't have much penetration into the inner workings mostly because it was too course. I think in my neck of the woods, a revolver would put up with a lot in the field. If I were back in CA, I think the story would be different.

Oh, and flour is a B-Otch to clean out of guns; still haven't gotten to my 1911 yet.

Sorry guys, no photos available; I have church tonight and I just didn't have time to do all that stuff.

The M-15 is a revolver?

I never would have dreamed a semi-auto would be more reliable in the muck, but in all honesty I don't know much about firearms period.

Love my Tracker. Shoots more accurate than me, no problems, and feels great on the hip. Taurus has done miles of work to fix their problems of the past, and it's easier at this point to find satisfied customers than the contrary.

How about this "torture" test: Let's use reloaded brass and lead bullets. My great great great grandchildren will still be shooting my Model 28 decades after your uber-pistol becomes splinters.

The M15 is the Model 15 Combat Masterpiece


IMO, it is one of the finest revolvers ever produced regardless of maker, regardless of cartridge (the Model 15 is a .38 Special K frame)

Kevin, I agree with your opinion of the Model 15. I carry one every day as I work cows in central Texas. We do have the fine dirt. My black Border Collie assumes a medium brown color after a ride in the truck bed. Not doubting your test results, but I have found with minimal care, the Model 15 holds up well and is completely reliable in this condition. It never is dropped in the dirt, however. The best thing about the revolver for my purpose is that I can carry different loads at the same time, some for snakes, some for small stuff, and a couple for dangerous game (people).

Jim

Great point. You also never need to wonder if you chambered a round or not with the revolver.......

Kevin's test is interesting. If I'm going to spend the day on a tractor doing field work under dusty conditions I learned long ago to pack the Glock 20. It can get filthy and still work, not so a revolver. If both guns are clean and lubes the revolver is less sensitive to ammo quality, grip, a whole lot of things. If things are going to get dirty the advantage moves to the autopistol pretty fast.

In reality Barkoff, this is much ado about nothing. The way to buy a gun is decide what gun you want, buy it before you change your mind, then figure out what advantages it has over everything else you own. When you start to itch again, repeat the cycle.

I think it's important to keep it all in perspective. I have maintained that the auto pistol is more reliable in extreme conditions. But how reality based is my test? That's a LOT of dirt and debris. One would have to either fall into a mud puddle, or just plain abuse their sidearm to ever replicate the results in the field.

What I'm gettin at is; I've never once worried about whether my revolver would go bang. I have worried about various auto pistols.

I think it's not until you get into extreme conditions that the auto starts to shine. Everything else shy of that, the revolver really has the edge for most things as a field gun. (power, reliability and versatility).

I have personal experience that tells me what's best in the field for defense against a black bear; a .44 magnum revolver stoked with 240 JHP's. But after years of hunting bears, I also have a good sense of what it takes to put them out of commission. Therefore, I'm willing to carry a .45ACP, .357, 10mm, or a .41 magnum.

If I walk down to the hollow on my property where I know there's a mamma bear, I carry a Winchester 94 or Remington 81 AND a sidearm; otherwise I just carry a sidearm.

Kevin,

Your test does a great job of demonstrating the importance of the proper holster and carry method for the conditions. Switching from a revolver to a semi-auto under say, extremely dusty conditions, is still trusting to luck. IMO it's much more important to get the handgun under cover and prevent filling it with dust in the first place.

Wonder what dirt is as fine as flower? Seen a hell of a lot of jams with semi auto, and a few, but (dam few) with a revolver.

I think that I'll try a simular test

The only negatives with a revolver for a self defense piece is fewer rounds before reloading and the speed loader are more of a pain to carry. A spre mag is falt and easy to carry in a pocket IMHO

jwp- I remember reading that flour was substituted in one of the stateside military tests to simulate the sand in the Middle East because they couldn't find anything that fine here.

My thought was, Arkansas "dirt" (really, it's fine gravel), and flour represent the two extremes of the "dirt" realm.

A couple points I thought about after reading the posts. Many times after riding through dusty conditions on the ranch, I blow the dust off the gun with an air compressor (carefully), works great. Also, the last thing I want to shoot a mad bull, or a 400# hog or anything else large and mean with is a 38 revolver. I always carry a 30-30 in the ranger or the truck. Still, I almost can't leave the house without my 38 revolver.

Jim

Mad bulls call for a judicious amount of Nike-Kwon-Do.

Ain't that the truth...........

I owe my cow elk this last year, in part to two unhappy bulls. I think she stood up from bed to see what the fuss was all about when my friend and I were walking through that herd of beeves below her...

I got chased into the Pecos as a kid by a bull or range cow; couldn't tell you which but there wasn't much apparant difference to my 11-year-old eyes... grin... got washed down the canyon a ways and got out and saw a bear, then had to come back up the canyon past the god damned cows to get back to camp!

My wife and I, way back in the day when she was my girlfriend, got chased by some cows... or more likely stampeded them our own direction somehow... up above Alvord Ranch in the Steens... we were on mountain bikes, which are sadly inferior to a cow, for hauling ass across a sage desert. I had two native redbands and a fishing rod strapped to my bike.

I guess those bulls helping me out on my cow elk evens things up a little at least.

You want some? I can get as much as you need. Fine as volcanic ash. Maybe that's what it is/was. It's all over southern Idaho. And I would be careful carrying any revolver where it might fall into the stuff.

A 30/30 win has more energy at 100 yards than a .44Rem Mag at the muzzel and a 44 is really a 42 cal,and the 10 mil is 40 cal.

And the 10 mil with HDY 200 XTP #9 powder will get you 1030 vel.

With a good flat nose bullet it can be loaded to take any game up to bear and Democrates!

Bob