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Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 19,088 Likes: 1
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 19,088 Likes: 1 |
ART338wm. Colorado is one of the cheapest states for nonresidents.Guess that is why we have so many. It is one f the last states NR can buy an OTC tag. NM has these high demand hunts,which cost NR $850+ just for the tag. Montana has a system that gives NR a jump in drawing a tag if they send in a contract with an outfitter. Then also,the more money you send in the more your chance of drawinga tag increases
If God wanted you to walk and carry things on your back, He would not have invented stirrups and pack saddles
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 57,494
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 57,494 |
That cool IntruderBN,
But your one up on me with a huge advantage. I love to hunt elk more than anything else except white tails, and in the two states I hunt and the one of which I live there are exactly zero elk for me to chase. Make that two up on me, as my favorite deer state of IL allows as meny nonresident gun hunters as the permit No#s will bear. The IL DNR loves the $$$ they get from all the nonresidents (its in the tens of thousands) who pay almost $300 to deer hunt in IL and as a holder of a life time hunting liceince I only pay $15 for a eithor sex permit and $30 for a permit that allows me to take one each buck or doe.
I only now put in for one spacific unit for elk in NM. While I was in unit 34 the very first year it was open for ML elk, I learned just how hard it is to kill a bull in only five days of hunting. I did though, see some extreamly nice bulls. I thankfully I ended up taking a nice 4x4 on the evining of my third day.
Unit 34 at least the part I was in was extreamly lean in good glassing points. And it was over grown with scrub oak trees that made spotting elk realy, realy hard. I am a strong beliver I should ahve spent more time in the north west part of the unit as it had a whole lot less roads and hunters and quads, this was on the advice of a realy nice guy who was a biologist for the unit. I suspect that was sunspot area IIRC and I've seen some really nice 6x6 in that area, though never had a tag, and there were many less trails and vehicles in that area and in fact teh only area we actually saw folks that had harvested elk.... Its on my list if I ever go back, but then again I have this strong urge to hunt 36 in the wilderness areas behind the ski apache.... never been there but to ski though.... Sure hope I don't have 34/36 flipped in my mind.... Jeff
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,678
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,678 |
You got 34/36 correct and I had a great hunt in 36 a few years back. Saw good elk every trip out of camp. Hunted just North of Ski Apache. Took a strong 350 class elk on the third day of the hunt. Did have an outfitter and it was a horseback hunt.
Only people we saw were the two wardens who checked us out on the second day.
We were camped about seven miles back in the Wilderness. I heard that the Gold hunt on the reservation that was just completed took at least two booners and many in the 360 class. Of course they were paying the Indians about $17K for the pleasure.
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 31
Campfire Greenhorn
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Campfire Greenhorn
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 31 |
I've been hunting unit 15 for 17 years and my extended family lives in Luna, Reserve, and Apache Creek. I cannot tell you how much a lot of the land there has changed for the worse! Every year my brother and I are out repairing areas that the atv's and trucks have started new two tracks. At first we didn't think much of it and even were naive enough to think it helped us get around the unit. Well that didn't last long and we saw the impact on the land and try our best to close any area that we see have been freshly made.... It is sadly... A losing battle! Yes there are too many Atv's in the unit but sadly again a lot are not even hunters! Like Alpine, AZ blew up with people buying second homes, mountain property Catron county has now seen some of this. There are so many that just show up with there atv's and jeeps and trucks and think it is ok to just tear the place up and make new roads where ever they damn please! We have even called the forest service to come issue citations but they never come out, never! They just don't care!
As far as hunting 15.... Well I'm still in! The trophy quality is still amazing there and they pull 350" to 400" bulls out every year! I have on film a bachelor heard from this year with 5 bulls over 350" one has to be 380 or better! So sign me up! And there are places to get away from the roads and hunters and bad guides... You just have to know where they are! And yes USO has a bad rep! Very bad even with the locals in 15. They are considered the lowest on the totem pole with the youngest and least experienced guides. There are some good guides in the unit though so don't burn them all...
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 3,869
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 3,869 |
Well said CZ and yes there are some big bulls left in there, but the quality of the hunt is NOT what it used to be! It is amazing how an idiot driving down the road with a bugle can shut up the area in just 10-minutes of assholizm!
Good Shooting!
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Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 17,527
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 17,527 |
Same thing happened to me in Colorado unit 10 a few years back. Dickheads everywhere "scouting" during archery, for their upcoming rifle hunt. I talked to one A-hole on a motorcycle. He was driving around looking for elk, and asked me if I saw any. He then told me he would not go any farther, as to not ruin my hunt. I told him thanks...Then he headed off in that direction, and I see him in the distance going right down the same trail he claimed he would leave alone! He bumped the elk out of there of course.
Then, I got the cops called on me for parking on public land, that was right next to private. The cop was a real dick too, and I had to prove I was in the right by showing him a map and GPS. Banning landowner tags would go a long ways...
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Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 2,034
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 2,034 |
I hunted unit 15 a few years ago and can attest to high volume road traffic. Matter of fact thats all there was. I never saw another hunter while I was hunting. A few times USO guys would be at my truck when I got back some hours after dark. Actiing like they were just driving by wondering if I had any luck. I always said "no, and I walked all over this place lookin for em." That was the last time I set foot in Reserve, NM. Nice counrty though, I stayed with some folks at Apache Creek who didnt say any good about several of the outfitters around there.
Joseph
Joseph
Joseph
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 32,312
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 32,312 |
Listened to a elk hunting friend last year (not these guys) who saw a guy screw up their hunt by riding his ATV into their area in a similar manner. This was in a wilderness area, no ATV's allowed. He was, as these guys were doing, scouting for an upcoming hunt and messed the guy up. They waited until he got off the ATV and headed off scouting...and then unloaded on it with their rifles, rendering it a pile of scrap metal.
While I don't agree with it for all the obvious reasons, not to mention there is now a 500 pound chunk of scrap metal in the wilderness...I suppose it got the intended result.
110% true story. I'll save the readers the need to respond and say it myself: Stupid idea, and a damn good way to get your own head blown off. I'm from NM; breaks my heart to read all this. I got out before the ATV thing really started (mid 80's). Bummer. Instead of shooting ATV's, I would think if a guy carried a small bottle of Karo syrup he could monkey-wrench them pretty good. Just hypothetically. I hunt mostly roadless wilderness areas in Oregon for elk. In fact, even a hand-pushed wheeled cart is illegal. Keeps the riffraff out.
The CENTER will hold.
Reality, Patriotism,Trump: you can only pick two
FÜCK PUTIN!
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Joined: May 2008
Posts: 982
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 982 |
Nice thread couple of the ideas would fit right in with the communists in DC. Some real dick heads in the world thats for sure. Makes sense why your home states are F'ed up beyond belief. Change your diaper and go home.
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 31
Campfire Greenhorn
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Campfire Greenhorn
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 31 |
Nice thread couple of the ideas would fit right in with the communists in DC. Some real dick heads in the world thats for sure. Makes sense why your home states are F'ed up beyond belief. Change your diaper and go home. Who exactly is that aimed at hamr? I call Arizona, New Mexico, and Colorado home and wouldn't trade these states for any!
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 13,268
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 13,268 |
A friend of mine guided for a while on the Gila for an outfitter that had a grand total of 1 guide (him) for the area. They ran 1 hunter with the guide for each hunt and that was it. They eventually got out of the Gila area and possibly NM all together because of crap dealing with other outfitters.
Otto is my co-pilot.
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 2,529
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 2,529 |
Godog57,
And as far as only allowing resident hunters on federaly owned (read that all Americans not only that states residents owned) land, Im all for that just as soon as any state that wants it that way pays back all the federal tax money it has received and used for used land management/improvements, game management/improvements and all the money it has received for past NR tags which BTW makes up a large if not huge part of most states WL budgets. You guys already get any where from 75% to 88% of the bull tags as it is, what the hell rite do you have saying I can not hunt on land owned by all tax payors?
And dont even think about handing me that old stand by BS line that I can do anything else I want to on federal land but hunt because your states G&F dept manages the heard when you would not have any where near the $$$ to do so without the $$$ you get from NR tags. Not to mention combined the litterally 10s of millions of dollars non-res hunters spend in your states EVERY SINGLE YEAR.
Wow. Sorry I offended you, but your logic is precisely the argument that USO Outfitters used to sue AZ and NV about 5 years ago in order to up the non-rez quota. Why, you might ask? To placate its typical client: The one I've learned to abhor every bit as much as the outfitters themselves. I've seen what's happened to the Gila over the last 30 years. It's trashed. Absolutely trashed with 2-rut tracks. Why do you think I pick on non-residents? My perspective is MUCH different than yours. Anyone I've ever had a run-in with happened to have an out-of-state plate on their equipment (usually from that big state just to our East), and they're usually tagging along with one of a number of local outfitters. We've all got our pet-peeves, I guess, and I do agree with you that our fellow hunters pose more of a threat to our lifestyle than PETA ever will...Then again, I also have a strong opinion about rifle hunters  ...fire away! Funny you mention that Intruder. I've hunted NM several times and the absolute laziest, trashiest, idiotic, worthless road hunters I've ever seen were usually RESIDENTS of NM. Seems to me the majority of NM residents there think game can only be killed from a vehicle. Not all NM residents are like that, I understand. But I think sometimes states need to look in their own mirror before throwing blame elswhere. Bill
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 15,648
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 15,648 |
Godog57,
And as far as only allowing resident hunters on federaly owned (read that all Americans not only that states residents owned) land, Im all for that just as soon as any state that wants it that way pays back all the federal tax money it has received and used for used land management/improvements, game management/improvements and all the money it has received for past NR tags which BTW makes up a large if not huge part of most states WL budgets. You guys already get any where from 75% to 88% of the bull tags as it is, what the hell rite do you have saying I can not hunt on land owned by all tax payors?
And dont even think about handing me that old stand by BS line that I can do anything else I want to on federal land but hunt because your states G&F dept manages the heard when you would not have any where near the $$$ to do so without the $$$ you get from NR tags. Not to mention combined the litterally 10s of millions of dollars non-res hunters spend in your states EVERY SINGLE YEAR.
Wow. Sorry I offended you, but your logic is precisely the argument that USO Outfitters used to sue AZ and NV about 5 years ago in order to up the non-rez quota. Why, you might ask? To placate its typical client: The one I've learned to abhor every bit as much as the outfitters themselves. I've seen what's happened to the Gila over the last 30 years. It's trashed. Absolutely trashed with 2-rut tracks. Why do you think I pick on non-residents? My perspective is MUCH different than yours. Anyone I've ever had a run-in with happened to have an out-of-state plate on their equipment (usually from that big state just to our East), and they're usually tagging along with one of a number of local outfitters. We've all got our pet-peeves, I guess, and I do agree with you that our fellow hunters pose more of a threat to our lifestyle than PETA ever will...Then again, I also have a strong opinion about rifle hunters ...fire away! Funny you mention that Intruder. I've hunted NM several times and the absolute laziest, trashiest, idiotic, worthless road hunters I've ever seen were usually RESIDENTS of NM. Seems to me the majority of NM residents there think game can only be killed from a vehicle. Not all NM residents are like that, I understand. But I think sometimes states need to look in their own mirror before throwing blame elswhere. Bill + a whole lot...
- Greg
Success is found at the intersection of planning, hard work, and stubbornness.
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 3,869
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 3,869 |
You are right that NM sucks and all TX and CA residents should boycott it! We are all lazy slob road hunters! I am sure we would end as a state without all your Federal contributions!
Good Shooting!
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 2,529
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 2,529 |
Sorry if I hit a nerve hunting1.
As I stated, I know not all hunters in NM are slob hunters.
I also know we here in TX have more than our share of slob roadhunters, and I know many visit your state. I just find it annoying that some people jump and holler about "out of state hunters" roadhunting and tearing up land, when in my experience its been locals doing it just as much if not more than the non-residents.
Sort of hypocritical IMO is what I mean.
BTW I love your state and treat it with the same respect I would want someone to treat my own land.
Good hunting,
Bill
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 3,869
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 3,869 |
I was just funning and I agree with your comment! It is just sad all around for all sportsman who want to come here and have a good experience. I love NM, but due to a corrupt education system, sad liberal politions and overall a poor economy it will not improve quickly. I help anyone with what I know, so ask away and congrats if you have the money to buy tags and an even bigger congrats if you can draw!
Larry
Good Shooting!
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 2,529
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 2,529 |
Headed there in one week exactly! Unit 34 Deer. Any tips for that area? I've hunted 30 a few times but this will be the first time in 34.
Bill
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